Keyless Entry Theft

[Anthony Sutton]

just to let others know....

I have a Touring Sports with Keyless fob.  I've read about thieves sending signals to your fob in your home to start your car.

I bought a Mission Darkness Faraday bag for Keyfobs from Amazon for £17  to keep my keyfob in overnight.
I tested this Faraday shielding bag with the Faraday test app, and it gave so much more shielding that other faraday bags out there

I also went to Settings on the car and disabled SmartEntry&StartSystem (so now I have press the Start button with the fob to start the car): I think this further reduces chances of KeylessEntryTheft

While I was there, I changed setting such that my double clicking the lock button on my fob, it Double Locks the door locks. I suppose that's also good right? But I don't know why that doesn't come as default!

Hope people find this helpful. Do leave comments if I've done something whacky!

I'm new to this forum, and find people Really friendly!

[TonyHSD]

Cool, I keep my keys in Pepsi can and I think it works great too. 

Thanks for sharing. 

[AndrueC]

My car is kept in a locked garage overnight and private car park at work so I just don't worry about it. There're some good hints there but personally I like keyless entry and wouldn't want to have to go back to holding my keys 🙂

[Heidfirst]

3 hours ago, Anthony Sutton said:

just to let others know....

I have a Touring Sports with Keyless fob.  I've read about thieves sending signals to your fob in your home to start your car.

I bought a Mission Darkness Faraday bag for Keyfobs from Amazon for £17  to keep my keyfob in overnight.
I tested this faraday shielding bag with the Faraday test app, and it gave so much more shielding that other faraday bags out there

I also went to Settings on the car and disabled SmartEntry&StartSystem (so now I have press the Start button with the fob to start the car): I think this further reduces chances of KeylessEntryTheft

While I was there, I changed setting such that my double clicking the lock button on my fob, it Double Locks the door locks. I suppose that's also good right? But I don't know why that doesn't come as default!

Hope people find this helpful. Do leave comments if I've done something whacky!

I'm new to this forum, and find people Really friendly!

afaik you can also disable the fob sending via a keypress sequence

[Anthony Sutton]

"Which" survey seems to suggest that by turning off 'Smart Entry", you can minimise keyless theft

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49273028

[Chattacks]

I turned the keyless off quite soon after getting the car. Its a great feature that is very convenient to have but I'd rather not risk the scum of the earth trying their chance with a relay attack to take the car. 

[Anthony Sutton]

I imagine you have 'double-locking' by pressing keyfob twice in succession.  I can't imagine anyone wouldn't (unless leaving Gran in there for a few minutes whilst you popped to the pharmacy to get her prescription).

[Jonmartin]

On 8/5/2019 at 8:07 PM, Heidfirst said:

afaik you can also disable the fob sending via a keypress sequence

What is the key press sequence ?

[Anthony Sutton]

Jon,  the problem with supposed key sequences, is that you're never quite sure if they've worked! best to do it through the settings screen as I did.

[furtula]

2 hours ago, Jonmartin said:

What is the key press sequence ?

Should be in your owners manual, best to download an online copy from Toyota UK, so you can easily use search function to find the things you need.

Also, on newer cars the online version actually has more content than the printed one.

[Jonmartin]

1 minute ago, furtula said:

Should be in your owners manual, best to download an online copy from Toyota UK, so you can easily use search function to find the things you need.

Also, on newer cars the online version actually has more content than the printed one.

Thanks for the info. I’ve been using the online manual, for a while now, it’s much better than the paper copy. I’ve found the entry methods, as always, there is more to this car than you first realise.

[PeteB]

I've used the key sequence to disable the fob for some time on my current and previous Toyotas (Toyota actually call it something like "Battery saver").  This has worked on a Gen 3 Prius, Gen 4 Prius and my current Gen 5 RAV4,

First lock or double lock the car.  Then, while pressing and holding the lock button, press the unlock button twice.  The little red light on the key gives two double flashes to confirm.  I just look for this to confirm it's worked, and it's become an automatic habit.  Easy enough to double check if in any doubt - put a hand in the handle and if the car doesn't unlock, it's worked.

It does mean you have to press a key on the fob to get into the car next time, but that's no problem (to me, anyway).

I've also put the spare key into battery saver mode.

A £90,000 Range Rover was recently stolen in my area while the key was said to be inside a Faraday pouch, it was suspected either the pouch was not sufficiently good quality or the spare key had not been protected or disabled.

[Cbatoday]

Surely only the corolla with the "entry function option" can be stolen using the relay method

Standard corolla with wireless entry would surely need the button to be pressed on the remote to open the doors

[bewA]

Hmm perhaps that might not work as with the smart entry and start (e.g. no pressing of buttons) doesn't require button pressed you just need to be next to the car to unlock it.

It depends whether relay attacks can simulate button presses but for that to work the original key would need to be pressed.
Much like when universal remote controls for Infrared had to learn button presses from the original remote.

[Heidfirst]

1 hour ago, Cbatoday said:

Surely only the corolla with the "entry function option" can be stolen using the relay method

Standard corolla with wireless entry would surely need the button to be pressed on the remote to open the doors

The relay method, yes, However, afaik there are systems that will capture & record the signal from a remote fob. 

The bottom line is that the true professional thieves will find a way to get a car if they really, really want it. Hopefully, they would steal a higher  value car in preference to a Corolla though ...

[Cbatoday]

31 minutes ago, Heidfirst said:

The relay method, yes, However, afaik there are systems that will capture & record the signal from a remote fob. 

The bottom line is that the true professional thieves will find a way to get a car if they really, really want it. Hopefully, they would steal a higher  value car in preference to a Corolla though ...

The solution seems to be to put the key fob to sleep when it's not in use 

Check here to watch and the link to buy https://3dautokeys.co.uk/vehicle-security-shop/products/keyless-protector

 

[Anthony Sutton]

I think people are talking about different things.

for my own Touring Sports: "Smart Entry" means i press the fob to unlock the car. Then, once sat in the car, I press the Start button. (the car senses that the fob is nearby).

by disabling Smart Entry in Settings, the car no longer senses my nearby fob. So i need to press the fob on the Start button (ie. make contact) to start the car.  

This is no extra hassle for me.

With Relay crime, thieves send a signal to your Fob, which amplifies your Fob's unique signal for them to open the car door. (i keep my fob in an effective Faraday bag, which reduces this Relay crime possibility).   But even if i didn't, and they were able to amplify my Fob's signal  they cannot now start my car, because they need the actual Fob to be in contact with the Start button   to start the car.

It's true, there's no foolproof way to stop crime,  just to reduce risk. And Toyota luckily have given us this option to turn off Smart Entry.

 

I realise that for other cars, you can even open the car door without pressing your fob,  just having it in your bag or pocket. This is terribly convenient, but in my own mind, unsafe.

I'm unsure if thieves can actually copy your Fob's signal as you're pressing the key.  If so, then they can easily open the car  when you've left.  

But switching SmartEntry off,  they will not be able to start the car without having the Fob.

 

On a separate note, there have been 3 break-ins in our street over the last 12months, where the only thing the thief took were the car keys, thus stealing just the car. So it's definitely worth NOT keeping them hanging in the entrance of the house!

[Heidfirst]

2 hours ago, Anthony Sutton said:

With Relay crime, thieves send a signal to your Fob, which amplifies your Fob's unique signal for them to open the car door. (i keep my fob in an effective Faraday bag, which reduces this Relay crime possibility).   But even if i didn't, and they were able to amplify my Fob's signal  they cannot now start my car, because they need the actual Fob to be in contact with the Start button   to start the car.

No, with relay they don't send a signal to your fob but use a piece of hardware to boost the signal from your fob (unless it's asleep/switched off/in a Faraday pouch etc.) to the car - the car then thinks that the fob is present at/near the car so they can open it & start it. Once it is started they can drive it away from the fob.

If you have turned off Smart Entry then, yes, you should be OK. Of course you have also paid for hardware that is now effectively redundant & no more convenient. 😛 

[FROSTYBALLS]

On 8/8/2019 at 10:19 AM, Anthony Sutton said:

"Which" survey seems to suggest that by turning off 'Smart Entry", you can minimise keyless theft

'What Car', not Which?

[LeonK]

On 8/10/2019 at 12:29 PM, Anthony Sutton said:

I think people are talking about different things.

for my own Touring Sports: "Smart Entry" means i press the fob to unlock the car. Then, once sat in the car, I press the Start button. (the car senses that the fob is nearby).

by disabling Smart Entry in Settings, the car no longer senses my nearby fob. So i need to press the fob on the Start button (ie. make contact) to start the car.  

This is no extra hassle for me.

With Relay crime, thieves send a signal to your Fob, which amplifies your Fob's unique signal for them to open the car door. (i keep my fob in an effective Faraday bag, which reduces this Relay crime possibility).   But even if i didn't, and they were able to amplify my Fob's signal  they cannot now start my car, because they need the actual Fob to be in contact with the Start button   to start the car.

It's true, there's no foolproof way to stop crime,  just to reduce risk. And Toyota luckily have given us this option to turn off Smart Entry.

 

I realise that for other cars, you can even open the car door without pressing your fob,  just having it in your bag or pocket. This is terribly convenient, but in my own mind, unsafe.

I'm unsure if thieves can actually copy your Fob's signal as you're pressing the key.  If so, then they can easily open the car  when you've left.  

But switching SmartEntry off,  they will not be able to start the car without having the Fob.

 

On a separate note, there have been 3 break-ins in our street over the last 12months, where the only thing the thief took were the car keys, thus stealing just the car. So it's definitely worth NOT keeping them hanging in the entrance of the house!

I agree.

As far as I am concerned Keyless Entry and Keyless Start are just solutions to a problem that didn't even exist in the first place. In fact, it has created more problems than it has solved.

I have disabled them both myself - it is not hassle and has increased the security of my car.

You work hard for the privilege of owning a car - the last thing you want is to help a scumbag car thief to take it from you...

[Rosgoe]

On 8/8/2019 at 11:18 AM, Jonmartin said:

What is the key press sequence ?

Hold lock button press unlock twice led on fob will flash 4 times

[AndrueC]

1 hour ago, LeonK said:

I agree.

As far as I am concerned Keyless Entry and Keyless Start are just solutions to a problem that didn't even exist in the first place. In fact, it has created more problems than it has solved.

It depends on your perspective. New features don't have to solve a problem to be justified. They just have to improve the owner's experience in some way. And speaking personally I'd never want to go back to owning a car that didn't have it. I love the fact that I don't have to fumble around in my pocket for a key. I love the fact that there is no risk of scratching the paint or the interior finish with a sharp metal object.

The issue of theft isn't of concern to me because I keep the car in a locked garage. There are also several solutions to the problem that just require car manufactures to tweak their design. I'd imagine that most have already done so.

[LeonK]

On 8/5/2019 at 5:01 PM, Anthony Sutton said:

just to let others know....

I have a Touring Sports with Keyless fob.  I've read about thieves sending signals to your fob in your home to start your car.

I bought a Mission Darkness Faraday bag for Keyfobs from Amazon for £17  to keep my keyfob in overnight.
I tested this faraday shielding bag with the Faraday test app, and it gave so much more shielding that other faraday bags out there

I also went to Settings on the car and disabled SmartEntry&StartSystem (so now I have press the Start button with the fob to start the car): I think this further reduces chances of KeylessEntryTheft

While I was there, I changed setting such that my double clicking the lock button on my fob, it Double Locks the door locks. I suppose that's also good right? But I don't know why that doesn't come as default!

Hope people find this helpful. Do leave comments if I've done something whacky!

I'm new to this forum, and find people Really friendly!

Hi Anthony,

I asked my dealership to disable smart entry before i took ownership of it.

For the added security pressing the fob to enter my car and placing the fob on the starter button really is no chore at all...

For me Smart Entry is a security liability - you should not have to invest in Faraday pouches etc. to protect your vehicle...

 

On 8/5/2019 at 5:07 PM, TonyHSD said:

Cool, I keep my keys in Pepsi can and I think it works great too. 

Thanks for sharing. 

 

[LeonK]

On 8/8/2019 at 12:49 PM, Anthony Sutton said:

Jon,  the problem with supposed key sequences, is that you're never quite sure if they've worked! best to do it through the settings screen as I did.

The key sequences are not "supposed" - they are described within the user hand book. I agree that its a job to know whether they worked or not. But if you place your fob in a Faraday pouch it would not be broadcasting the signal regardless..

[Rambler56]

3 hours ago, LeonK said:

The key sequences are not "supposed" - they are described within the user hand book. I agree that its a job to know whether they worked or not. But if you place your fob in a faraday pouch it would not be broadcasting the signal regardless..

I used Faraday pouches with my previous car and I would suggest anyone using them do a periodic test to ensure they are still having the desired effect.  I tested the pouch(s) when I first got them and they did indeed work.  Fast forward several weeks, I was standing next to the car (washing it) with the key pouch in my pocket and the car opened when I touched the door handle.  The constant opening and closing of the pouch can apparently cause 'minor' fracturing of the Faraday mesh so buyer beware and test the efficiency on a regular basis. I did eventually disable the keyless entry using a key fob sequence, the JLR dealer/manufacturer  was adamant it could not be disabled, a youTube search proved otherwise!