Rav4 2008 2.2 d4d d-cat wont rev after a couple og minutes.

[Henrik (Denmark)]

Hi there.

I have som trouble with my rav4. It starts perfectly and runs great for 4-5 minutes. The it kind of dies and can not get above 3000rpm. It is not in Limp mode as there are no fault codes logged. I can not see anything that is not ordinary when i look at the sensors with my diagnose tester. It is performance chipped and the dpf, egr and catalyst is removed in the ecu and the inside is removed. I have checked almost everything. No blocked intercooler, turbo pressure is fine, fuel pressure is fine, all filters changed, scv valve changed, map sensor changed, maf sensor changed and so on... I don't really think it is a electrical problem, because i believe that i would be able to spot that with my tester. I have one that can do almost everything. Does anybody know how the throttle body works? Is it completely open when started or will it regulate the air with that?

Thanks in advance.

Kind regards Henrik Hansen

[paul9]

Are you sure the fuel pressure isn't dropping off when the performance drops? I would have suspected a fuel delivery problem as the most likely culprit. If it is a throttle body problem, then it could be a temperature related intermittent fault. How do your oxygen levels and fuel trims look on a graph before and during the problem? They may point to whether your fuel or air is restricted and causing problems. It also could be faulty or corrupted mapping data in the ECU. There are also a couple of temperature sensors which can cause strange problems if they are giving faulty readings, so graphing all the temperature values you can access might be helpful to you to diagnose the issue.

[Henrik (Denmark)]

8 minutes ago, paul9 said:

Are you sure the fuel pressure isn't dropping off when the performance drops? I would have suspected a fuel delivery problem as the most likely culprit. If it is a throttle body problem, then it could be a temperature related intermittent fault. How do your oxygen levels and fuel trims look on a graph before and during the problem? They may point to whether your fuel or air is restricted and causing problems. It also could be faulty or corrupted mapping data in the ECU. There are also a couple of temperature sensors which can cause strange problems if they are giving faulty readings, so graphing all the temperature values you can access might be helpful to you to diagnose the issue.

Thanks for fast reply😁

Yes i am sure about that. The weird thing is og i turn off the ignition and wait for 5 seconds then it runs perfect again for 4-5 minutes. The mapping should be fine - it has been running with it for 7 years. I dont see any difference in temperature or anything when it slows down. I just dont get it. So i was wondering if it was some air that gets restricted for some reason. All values on the injectors also look fine. The two exhaust temperature sensors are fixed on 749 degrees and has been like that since the mapping. Inlet temperature is not showing any weird readings either. The fuel pressure is between 40000 and 70000 depending om the speed and is right about what the target pressure is so i dont think it is a fuel problem. Have tried to change the filter and it made No difference. It also fails when the var is just idling and not moving for 3-5 minutes. 

[Henrik (Denmark)]

I also suspect the throttle body because i inspected it yesterday. With my knowledge og diesel engines it should open fully when engine is started and the close when it is **** off. But mine is barely open when started and never fully open even at full throttle. Is that normal?

[paul9]

I haven't observed mine, but I would expect to see a decent range of movement across the board from closed to fully open throttle. And as you said, the mapping SHOULD be fine, but the flash memory can and does become corrupted at times. Also, keep an eye on the values coming from the pedal, they can be intermittent at times, so worth remembering to check that.

[Henrik (Denmark)]

5 minutes ago, paul9 said:

I haven't observed mine, but I would expect to see a decent range of movement across the board from closed to fully open throttle. And as you said, the mapping SHOULD be fine, but the flash memory can and does become corrupted at times. Also, keep an eye on the values coming from the pedal, they can be intermittent at times, so worth remembering to check that.

We have had the original map in it and the error was the same so i think i can rule that one out. I am hearing what you are saying so dont think i am ignoring you☺️ Do you think anything will happen if i remove the flap in the throttle body to test if it could be causing it? The pedal potentiometer is reacting like it should at all times. Was my first suspect in the beginning😏

[paul9]

I can't remember if there's a feedback reading from the throttle body to show the commanded value and the actual value in the Toyota Techstream diagnostics, but pretty sure that there should be. I would check those values before and during the fault happening before I pulled bits off the throttle body.

[Henrik (Denmark)]

On 9/22/2019 at 3:04 PM, paul9 said:

I can't remember if there's a feedback reading from the throttle body to show the commanded value and the actual value in the Toyota Techstream diagnostics, but pretty sure that there should be. I would check those values before and during the fault happening before I pulled bits off the throttle body.

I can't see the throttle body om my tester. Crap. What do I do then?

[Alan1234]

I would change the rubber fuel lines on the engine sound's like you have a blockage or restriction it would account for why it starts ok after a few mins . Even restriction back to tank /sender unit .

[Alan1234]

Make sure it doesn't have a tiny fine filter were it enters the high pressure pump.

[Henrik (Denmark)]

15 minutes ago, Alan1234 said:

I would change the rubber fuel lines on the engine sound's like you have a blockage or restriction it would account for why it starts ok after a few mins . Even restriction back to tank /sender unit .

They are tested. And it starts after 5 seconds. Not minutes. And it is both when the car is moving or steady.

[paul9]

Worth trying to manually check the throttle body flap, as it should have a decent range of motion. What you have described about yours doesn't sound quite right.

I remember a Nissan Bluebird my sister had with similar symptoms. There were rusty fuel lines and the rust flakes were clogging the lines to the fuel filter. When the fuel pump stopped, the blockages would drop back and allow fuel to flow again for a while.

 

[Henrik (Denmark)]

1 minute ago, paul9 said:

Worth trying to manually check the throttle body flap, as it should have a decent range of motion. What you have described about yours doesn't sound quite right.

I remember a Nissan Bluebird my sister had with similar symptoms. There were rusty fuel lines and the rust flakes were clogging the lines to the fuel filter. When the fuel pump stopped, the blockages would drop back and allow fuel to flow again for a while.

 

But how do i check Them in a different way? I have been looking up into it with the car started and my wife om the throttle. It is never fully open.

 

I doubt that is my problem. It is after the exact same amount of time no matter what.

[paul9]

Poke it with a tool to see if it is jammed and will free up, but not hard.

[Henrik (Denmark)]

13 minutes ago, paul9 said:

Poke it with a tool to see if it is jammed and will free up, but not hard.

I poked it with my finger and it felt like a little motor was keeping it steady.

[paul9]

Pretty much how it should be, but it should also open up more when the throttle pedal commands it.

 

[Buff69]

Is there a air flow meter “thing” that controls the amount of air to the engine  in the air filter line if so that may be faulty??

[Henrik (Denmark)]

1 hour ago, Buff69 said:

Is there a air flow meter “thing” that controls the amount of air to the engine  in the air filter line if so that may be faulty??

There is a maf sensor yes. But that has been changed and is not faulty.

[Henrik (Denmark)]

So i just figured out why it is doing it. The two temperature sensors on the picture rises to 749,9 °C. But why are they all up there? They go from 160 to 749,9 in less than ten seconds. Are they both faulty? And does anyone know the part number on them? Thanks again.

[Henrik (Denmark)]

4 hours ago, Henrik (Denmark) said:

So i just figured out why it is doing it. The two temperature sensors on the picture rises to 749,9 °C. But why are they all up there? They go from 160 to 749,9 in less than ten seconds. Are they both faulty? And does anyone know the part number on them? Thanks again.

 

[furtula]

Go to japan-parts.eu and enter your VIN, then you can find the sensor part numbers there.

I would try disconnecting both sensors and see if the car behaviour changes.

[Henrik (Denmark)]

23 hours ago, furtula said:

Go to japan-parts.eu and enter your VIN, then you can find the sensor part numbers there.

I would try disconnecting both sensors and see if the car behaviour changes.

I tried to disconnect the sensors today. Then they both say 0°C in the tester. No difference in the cars behavior. I also took the ecu out and took it apart to check if there should be a bad connection or soldering. Notting to see. Cleaned it and put it back in. No difference. Any good ideas?

[furtula]

From what i saw you have a bluetooth code reader.

I would invest in Toyota techstream cable, you should get more info on the car (10-15GBP)

There was a topic recently troubleshooting high fuel consumption i think also 2.2 engine where it's mentioned operating temperatures under certain conditions, what is normal, max, when it's doing regen etc, worth taking a look, also great troubleshooting by the original poster.

Also, you claim your exhaust temperature was very high, but on picture it shows different values?

From the topic below

Toyota documents claim exhaust temperature will not go over 700-750 unless it's stuck open and that it wont go over 800 degrees at idle if it's stuck open. 

Do you have high temps on idle?

 

 

[Henrik (Denmark)]

12 minutes ago, furtula said:

From what i saw you have a bluetooth code reader.

I would invest in Toyota techstream cable, you should get more info on the car (10-15GBP)

There was a topic recently troubleshooting high fuel consumption i think also 2.2 engine where it's mentioned operating temperatures under certain conditions, what is normal, max, when it's doing regen etc, worth taking a look, also great troubleshooting by the original poster.

Also, you claim your exhaust temperature was very high, but on picture it shows different values?

From the topic below

 

Do you have high temps on idle?

 

 

I have different values because they "follow" each other but updates in two different seconds. So the other one follows one second after. I have high temps 5-10 seconds after start. It is so weird. But hey. I want a tester like that. Can you maybe link to one that works as IT should?😁

[furtula]

You just need an adapter cable, can get it from websites like eBay and alike, costs 10-15 GBP, just search for Toyota techstream adapter cable.

Most of them come with with a small disc with the software.

Downside is that it works out of the box on windows xp only, on newer ones you need to do some workarounds, however some people reported using windows XP in a virtual box and that it worked fine, and yeah, you also need a laptop for it, but as you can see in the topic, it's a powerful troubleshooting tool.