Previa Conundrum - what to buy and how to spend a few £k

[Andy_k]

Currently we have a '98 Mk1 Previa - 2.4 Petrol with approx 145k on the clock. Our average weekly mileage is about 300

It's as solid as a rock, runs like clockwork and regular maintenance aside costs us nothing to run (much of my fuel gets claimed back as expenses so mpg isn't really an issue).

The cylinder head gasket was replaced when we first bought it 4 years ago. the cat was replaced/refitted at the first MoT we had done, I put new disks and calipers on all four corners, 4 new tyres and a new starter motor last year.

It's a great workhorse and is ultra reliable - I've also converted it to include a secondary 12v/240v system running off a leisure Battery which charges from the alternator

but.....

The paint is starting to look a little tatty (one panel was sprayed very badly by the previous owner), parts of the interior are beginning to show their age and there are a few electrical/mechanical issues starting to appear - the sunroof stopped working for no apparent reason (closed and no leaks) and stubbornly refuses to do anything more than just click, the aircon needs a new condenser/refill,  the carpets probably need replacing and some of the trim pain is flaking away - that weird grey stuff on the dashboard in particular.

So, with approx £5 - £6K to spend do I...

a, Spend the money on a bottom half respray, wheel refurb and getting the niggles sorted out - not ruling out buying a donor vehicle to cannibalise for parts?

b, Spend roughly the same amount on a later model Mk2 Previa?

 

My questions then are ideally for those who've driven/owned both.

• How do the two compare for day to day use? It's our only car as my other half doesn't drive any more - The DVLA  took a dim view of her having a licence after she was diagnosed as a narcoleptic 🙂

• What are the internal dimensions like? With the seats out the Mk1 is huge - the load bay is approx 8ft x 4ft - plenty of room for my gear, two dogsm the mrs and still room to sleep in at night when we are away from home

• Is there anything I'd miss 'upgrading'? The switch from RWD to FWD for example or (what appears to be) the narrower sliding doors

• Anything I've missed - which is the 'nicer' vehicle to own etc

 

Thanks for your thoughts, comments etc and sorry for the long post

[RUToyota]

Given what you have said and the issues you have, then for me it would be a no-brainer...with up to £6k to spend I'd buy a newer vehicle...in my case it would be an Estima...but that's personal choice I guess.

All you can do is go look at some and decide which you think is the best for your needs.

 

Good luck

[Andy_k]

cheers - looking is easy 🙂 I'm after owner's experiences.

New versus old is kinda tricky though - spending £3k on our current car fixes all the issues, paints the bottom half of the car (if I help out with the prep work) and leaves some change for little jobs - OK, it's money we can never recoup if and when we decide to sell it but it 'saves' us at least £2000 to spend on other stuff 🙂

I'm normally up for buying a newer car but this time it's not so easy 🙂

[TP49]

I'm with Neil on this one I'd go for a newer Estima, but it's a hard decision in your case as your attached to the car. As with most older cars you spend money keeping them on the road and sometimes the heart rules the head. But in saying all that there's some lovely classic cars out there that owners cherish to keep them alive. For an every day vehicle you need reliability so if yours is reliable makes the decision harder good luck with the decision only you can make.

[RUToyota]

Looking might be easy...but it's also important so that you can make the best decisions on how to spend your money.

I have no experience of your current Previa model so it's impossible for me to compare...at least by looking at and driving a newer vehicle (particularly the Estima) then YOU will be better placed to compare newer with current.

 

[Andy_k]

cheers for the replies, I was rather hoping for replies based on experience rather than just common sense 🙂

We are going to look at an Alphard this weekend (slightly over budget but not really a problem) and the guy selling also has a Honda Elysion which also seems to tick a lot of the boxes - I hate buying cars 😞

[RUToyota]

Both good vehicles...so good luck..and trust your instincts.

[Andy_k]

17 minutes ago, RUToyota said:

Both good vehicles...so good luck..and trust your instincts.

cheers, yeah, we've been thrown a curve ball on the insurance for an import - despite having full no claims, no accidents for over 30 years, clean licence for the same period and being just over 60 my job really doesn't help with getting anything slightly unusual 'road legal' - our normal insurers won't touch an import and the 'specialists' won't touch me/my line of work

Back to Previa versus Previa then - so, please no more Estimas, Alphards etc 

[Andy_k]

OK.

 

To wrap up this thread - after having spent the morning test driving three Mk2 Previas I'm in a position to answer my own questions.....

 

First impressions of the Mk2 were good,

I sort of liked the dash but then decided that I really didn't like it because everything was in the wrong place - nothing I couldn't live with but it was a 'black mark'

The seats didn't seem as supportive as our old ones but again it wasn't a deal breaker

Internal space seemed less than our old one,  particularly at the back - I'd need to go back with a tape measure if I was going to buy one (I'm not) 

Once we started driving on 'damp' roads was when I decided I didn't like it

Why did nobody mention that the front of the car doesn't feel like it's attached to the back??

Halfway around a corner and they all did the same skittery little understeer slide - even when off the power. If there was a bump it made it worse - if it were just one of them I would have accepted it as a fault on that one but they were all identical (very Toyota ). It did nothing to inspire confidence. Maybe it's a front wheel drive thing but other FWD cars I've driven would torque steer but not break traction like this. It also felt 'top heavy' with the body prone to leaning.

Not a car I ever need to drive again - it felt worse than our old Chrysler Grand Voyager which was always a bit of a lottery whether it would come out of a corner on the line it went in on 😄

 

Thanks for your comments - I just wish someone could have been honest about them and saved me a morning 

 

[TP49]

Honesty didn't come into the equation. No problems with my Estima but then again I drive normal.

[RUToyota]

Frankly that seems a tad impolite when people at least took the time to try to assist ...I find none of the issues with my Estima that you mention.

You clearly have different opinions but you can't expect people to give honest replies to issues that they have not experienced themselves.

Perhaps your driving style is not suited to the vehicles you tested....or perhaps the vehicles did not represent the best examples out there.

[Andy_k]

On 10/27/2019 at 2:35 PM, RUToyota said:

 

You clearly have different opinions but you can't expect people to give honest replies to issues that they have not experienced themselves.

Perhaps your driving style is not suited to the vehicles you tested....or perhaps the vehicles 

There was nothing rude or impolite. I asked for people's opinion, preferably based on personal experience. As nobody had that experience I went out and test drove some myself.

There is no point bsnging on about how great Estimas are - I'd clearly ruled out import, so, if they are great, then I'm really happy for you.

As for Mk 2 Previas, well, in my opinion, they handle like crap. Too much body roll which causes understeer. They drive like the original Merc A Claas. However  as you seem quick to blame my driving style you could try reading some riad tests. Understeer is a common critique so maybe they are all wrong as well!!!

I do about 30k miles most years. Much of my driving is on A and B roads as we dont have motorways or even many Dual carriageways down here. If a car/van/MPV won't go around corners, it's no use to me 🙂

[Andy_k]

It seems I'm not alone....

 

from this forum, discussing the Mk2 Previa
Having said that, they are far better than the FWD MkII which can be unstable and suffer from severe understeer if there is a lot of weight in the back
it is front wheel drive and far less practical than the MK1; and less stable when fully loaded due to the FWD system (Can Understeer badly)

From UK Estima
as with most of the larger MPVs, you can throw it through the first part of a roundabout but have to watch the understeer and body lean on the way out. 

From Honest John
Pronounced body lean and lack of front-end grip in corners.

There sure seems to be a lot of bad drivers around doesn't there? 😄

 

We are still no closer to a decision. I suspect the current one will be staying 🙂

 

[TP49]

That might be the right decision keeping the car you have as it suits your needs. As an aside I have never thrown a car into a roundabout I drive it. But judging by the body roll and under steer your talking about a roundabout would need to be taken at quite a speed to create that situation. As a retired lorry driver speed in the wrong place can cause no end of dodgy situations. You have your opinions as you are entitled to as I do mine. So whatever your decision good luck with it.

 

[DAN@ADRIAN FLUX]

On 10/25/2019 at 7:37 PM, Andy_k said:

cheers, yeah, we've been thrown a curve ball on the insurance for an import - despite having full no claims, no accidents for over 30 years, clean licence for the same period and being just over 60 my job really doesn't help with getting anything slightly unusual 'road legal' - our normal insurers won't touch an import and the 'specialists' won't touch me/my line of work

Back to Previa versus Previa then - so, please no more Estimas, Alphards etc 

Hi.

If you need any help with insurance at all then please feel free to drop me a line.

Regards,

Dan.

[Andy_k]

3 hours ago, DAN@ADRIAN FLUX said:

Hi.

If you need any help with insurance at all then please feel free to drop me a line.

Regards,

Dan.

Hmmmm Adrian flux insurance - no thanks Dan, we have (ancient) history - once bitten, twice shy!!!

[Andy_k]

3 hours ago, TP49 said:

That might be the right decision keeping the car you have as it suits your needs. As an aside I have never thrown a car into a roundabout I drive it. But judging by the body roll and under steer your talking about a roundabout would need to be taken at quite a speed to create that situation. As a retired lorry driver speed in the wrong place can cause no end of dodgy situations. You have your opinions as you are entitled to as I do mine. So whatever your decision good luck with it.

TBH, on the road tests with the Mk2 Previas, none of them were 'thrown into corners' but like many other people have done (including members of this forum and recognised motoring journalists) I experienced somewhat unpredictable and certainly very much unexpected understeer triggered by what I would class as 'very slight' body roll at speeds well below the legal limit and considerably lower than I would consider safe in either the Mk1 and way below those our Golf deals with them - of course, once it had happened once, it was pretty easy to replicate and think '****, if this was an emergency I probably wouldn't be in full control of the car'. Reading road tests, it's clear it's not just me that thinks this is an issue. OK, yeah, there's the option to drive within the car's capabilities but why spend time compromising when there are better/safer options available? 

Five days a week I do a 60 (each way) mile 'cross country' commute to work where about 35 miles are on B Roads- there's no way i'd be wanting to do that in a Mk2 Previa.

Cheers for your comments though

3 hours ago, TP49 said:

 

 

[whitbym]

Wow Andy, this few weeks or so I've been having exactly the same thoughts as you. 
I have a "cherished" (to me !) 1997 2.4 Previa GL Auto and I've had it for 4 years. I spent hardly any money on it and it has been very reliable, even being unused for 12 months, it still passed it's MOT. I use it as an occasional camper and it's absolutely brilliant as I can easily fit 3.6m lengths of wood in the back with the boot shut ! Also, I can drive fairly lively along country lanes and it has a bit of poke when accelerating onto motorways. Fuel economy is not the best but I probably do less than 5k miles; mostly pottering around town, or driving to/from France.
This year I've been spending some money, new brakes/discs, bluetooth radio, wiper arm, side panel, new LHD lights with intention to register in France. I even bought an obd1 reader but have yet to try it out properly.
I'm on first name terms with my local Toyota parts department in Colchester and I find them very helpful and in the main they can still source many new parts for this era of mk1 Previa. However, I also wanted to get new tyres, but the rear lower wishbone suspension was broken by tyre fitters a couple of weeks ago. And I cannot get this part new from Toyota as they no longer make it.
It is currently at my "trusted" local garage to see if they can rescue the situation, and if they can, hopefully I'll get some kind of recompense from the tyre people.

Which is where I was thinking about what if "my pride and joy" is written off, what next ! I too had the same thoughts as Andy and it is very helpful that he gave his "review" of the Mk2 Previa. Especially as it is a FWD, he has kind of confirmed the handling is different if you are used to a mk1 and that you do lose a "seat's worth" of space in the back due to the front engine layout.

I too have had a look (internet only) at the Alphard, which may be an option, but in France the homoglation may be more convoluted than importing a UK spec. But I'm hoping, even if I have to spend more cash than the car is worth, that the trusty mk1 previa can ride again ! Or keep on the lookout for one that is for sale, which is very infrequent !

[Andy_k]

On 11/1/2019 at 10:27 AM, whitbym said:

Wow Andy, this few weeks or so I've been having exactly the same thoughts as you. 

We've looked at it from virtually every angle and no matter what we tried didn't make a convincing argument to change. 

The Mk2 Previa really didn't appeal, the handling was unpredictable - if more of my mileage was motorways/dual carriageways I would have probably gone for it but my daily drive is a mix of A and B roads with lots of roundabouts and windy 'cross country' roads which really unsettled the Mk2's I tried.- the roads in East Sussex are really crap, our nearest dual carriageway is 12 miles away and we are about 50 miles from a motorway.

We looked at imports even though insurance would be a major headache for me (pro musician) but all had their faults that we couldn't live with - Satnav/entertainment systems that only work in Japanese so totally useless in this country, prohibitive cost of parts with poor availability etc etc

We also (briefy) considered a Chrysler Grand Voyager but the American handling (or lack of) and the tacky plastic interior and a dreadful driving position ruled that out.

Despite people telling me that their cars don't exhibit these tendencies an awful lot of people seem to be reporting the very same issues.

We also realised that most of the cars we were looking at spending the money on were higher mileage than ours and many had big bills in the pipeline (cam belts etc).

So, after a lot of thought we've decided to spend about half the money on getting the bottom half of the Mk1 painted and tidied up (approx £1200 at our local body shop), the front seats (the only ones in the vehicle) are being re-trimmed/rebuilt by a local motor home upholsterer, I'll replace the aircon components, get it re-gassed and give it a good service, get the alloys refurbed and a few other bits which should all come in at around £3k with another £500 or so to spend upgrading the hi-fi to add a new head unit with reversing cam etc (actual cost about £750 but the existing unit will sell for a couple of hundred to offset the cost. This leaves us a couple of grand to just stick in the bank in case anything major goes wrong or to have a month off next summer and just go on holiday in it 😄 However, good ones are getting harder and harder to find - there's a very low mileage, 1 owner,'98 for sale near us in almost mint condition and he's asking £3500 for it and turning down offers of £k so he's confident it will sell 😄

No, we'll (probably) never get the money back if we decide to sell it at some point in the future but at least it won't depreciate any further and that's enough for us.Good luck with whatever you decide but we were talking to the body shop owner today and we agreed that the Mk1 is a car that's been largely overlooked and only now are people realising how good they were

[DAN@ADRIAN FLUX]

On 10/29/2019 at 8:12 PM, DAN@ADRIAN FLUX said:

Hi.

If you need any help with insurance at all then please feel free to drop me a line.

Regards,

Dan.

Ok no problem.

Regards,

Dan.