Timing chain

[Mass_]

Hi,

I have a concern regarding the replacement of timing chain in my Yaris(1.3 petrol 2003).

There is around 251000 km (157000 miles) on it.

The question is: should I replace it?

 

Thank you so much in advance.

[snowBALLs]

No need when the car still drives without problem, suppose to last lifetime. Can be costly compare to what your car is worth if u want to replace, I wouldn't. 

[Madasafish]

1 hour ago, snowBALLs said:

No need when the car still drives without problem, suppose to last lifetime. Can be costly compare to what your car is worth if u want to replace, I wouldn't. 

Agreed,

[lani100]

No just keep driving 

[furtula]

If there is no audible rattle, dont touch it. Main thing to keeping the chain healthy is regularly changing the oil and filters, so dont skimp on those.

[Mass_]

Hi. 

 

Thank you guys so much for your help. 

I recorded a 15 sec video of warmed up engine. 

Can you hear anything? 

Cheers 

[Madasafish]

That sounds like a well worn engine. Does it make a lot of noise - rattling - when cold. That is timing chain wear. The sound you hear could be tappet clearances and timing chain.

A change is a PIA - done it myslef - and with genuine parts will cost at least £200 in parts . You need to remove one engine mounting and the crankshaft bolt can be VERY VERY tight.  It is NOT a job for the incompetent, inexperienced or badly equipped mechanic.. Then you will want to replace the auxiliary belt.

[Bomber209]

Hi, if it sounds rattley, it's more likely to be the chain tensioner shoe that's worn. At 251k, km's or 150k miles, I would expect something worn. Run your engine and carefully put a long screwdriver point on the timing chain cover, and the handle end to your ear. you'll hear anything going on in there.😃

[Mass_]

Hi. 

It is not as loud as on this video. 

I does not take any oil even after 10000km(oil service done). 

When i bought it(5years ago) it had been like that but there is some cliking now. I don't know if you can hear it? 

[Mass_]

It does not make a lot of rattling when cold so this is the reason i don't know what's is going on 🙂

[furtula]

If it makes a cold start up rattle, that's somewhat ok (2-3 seconds until oil gets around the engine). I also have it, i did install filter with a spring, which helped eradicate it almost completely.

@flash22 has a good ear for the various ticks the engine makes, maybe he can diagnose it.

 

[Mass_]

Thank you so much for your help. 

Let's say it is the timing chain. 

How much longer does the engine last? 

Should I expect it may conk out any time? 

[flash22]

That's not the chain, tbh that is just age and worn valve gear (worn lifters) and a bit of injector tick

If its not broke, don't fix it

The rot will get the car before the engine needs work, regular oil changes with a good quality oil, DO NOT use a thicker oil as it will cause more harm than good

[scannerman]

A problem with older, higher milage cars with unknown history is previous oil change intervals. If not changed regularly, sludge can build up and restrict the oil ways feeding parts of the engine like the valve gear. When cold, the oil is thicker and may not be getting enough to these parts until its warmed up and the oil has 'thinned' A timing chain change is uneconomic for your car and it may not be the cause. If I were you, I would go through the process of an engine flush, its relatively inexpensive to do, just get a bottle from Halfords or a local car accesory shop, add it to your oil, follow the instructions to run the engine for a time, and then change oil and filter. I would use 0W/30 oil. If the rattle persists it may need a professional assessment. I had a similar problem with an older Yaris, the flush cleared it.

[Mass_]

Thanks once again guys for your time.

Some mechanics say the timing chain may snap at any time due to high mileage. 

Replacing it is way too expensive given the car is worth not much.

The oil I use is 10w-40.

[flash22]

If its the 2NZFE engine it should be 5w30 A5 or equivalent Semi synthetic - 10w40 is too thick

an oil change is 3.7L plus 0.2 for the filter

[olddriver]

When was the chain/belt last changed, and when does Haynes say to change it?

My Corolla belt and tensioner cost £200 to replace at my local independent garage, that's a lot cheaper than an engine rebuild, or the value of the car surely?

[scannerman]

41 minutes ago, olddriver said:

When was the chain/belt last changed, and when does Haynes say to change it?

My Corolla belt and tensioner cost £200 to replace at my local independent garage, that's a lot cheaper than an engine rebuild, or the value of the car surely?

The guys got a timing chain inside the front of the engine and requires a fair degree of strip down to access. If correct oil change intervals with good oil, the chain could last longer than the car.

[olddriver]

2 minutes ago, scannerman said:

The guys got a timing chain inside the front of the engine and requires a fair degree of strip down to access. If correct oil change intervals with good oil, the chain could last longer than the car.

Thanks, it sounds like it's back to the future then, so it's like a 1960s etc car engine, and we never used to change the chain in them, unless you were doing a rebuild?

[scannerman]

Just now, olddriver said:

Thanks, it sounds like it's back to the future then, so it's like a 1960s etc car engine, and we never used to change the chain in them, unless you were doing a rebuild?

If it ain't broke etc. Talk to a Ferrari owner about timing belts.

[flash22]

3 hours ago, olddriver said:

Thanks, it sounds like it's back to the future then, so it's like a 1960s etc car engine, and we never used to change the chain in them, unless you were doing a rebuild?

That's the one, some engines eat timing chains like the PSA n14 and N16 in the BNW mini - Toyota's like a lot of jap stuff is well-designed and built

3 hours ago, scannerman said:

Talk to a Ferrari owner about timing belts.

 

360's have a large plate behind the seats for access, others you have to pull the engine and box what takes 15-20 hours-ish if its mid-engined, The mr2 and a lot of lotus cars its a rule of 3 - 3 or more jobs on the engine drop it from the car

[scannerman]

29 minutes ago, flash22 said:

That's the one, some engines eat timing chains like the PSA n14 and N16 in the BNW mini - Toyota's like a lot of jap stuff is well-designed and built

 

360's have a large plate behind the seats for access, others you have to pull the engine and box what takes 15-20 hours-ish if its mid-engined, The mr2 and a lot of lotus cars its a rule of 3 - 3 or more jobs on the engine drop it from the car

I've heard that Gynecologists are good changing belts on 360s. Lotus, Lots of trouble, usually serious.

[0101charlim]

On 2/28/2020 at 12:02 AM, Mass_ said:

Hi,

I have a concern regarding the replacement of timing chain in my Yaris(1.3 petrol 2003).

There is around 251000 km (157000 miles) on it.

The question is: should I replace it?

 

Thank you so much in advance.

In my humble opinion, if you do decide to replace it, have someone else assist you if you're still amateur with these kinds of job. A good "Toyota service" is an investment with your car.

[Konrad C]

On 2/28/2020 at 10:10 AM, Mass_ said:

Hi. 

It is not as loud as on this video. 

I does not take any oil even after 10000km(oil service done). 

When i bought it(5years ago) it had been like that but there is some cliking now. I don't know if you can hear it? 

The normal advice for any car is to do regular oil changes, at least once a year. If the car does lots of short journeys with lots of stop/start , then two or more changes with the year. Same goes for high usage high mileage within a short time. The trouble is the OP bought the car with a noisy engine. When buying an older car, unless the cars history is well documented, plus the car thoroughly checked, you don't know how well it's looked after. The older the worse. From the OP's statement, the engine was noisy and the noise has got worse. 
If the engine is already showing signs of being worn, then unless doing DIY repair, it is better to drive and hope it lasts. Repair cost will be too expensive unless the owner is prepared to pay, and the car is in good condition, apart from the chain and guides!   

[flash22]

Its not worth doing at that sort of age, swap the engine out for a low mileage one, TBH the thicker oil wouldn't of done it any favours