Corolla Assista (Japan) > Avensis T27

[DanFen]

Glad I've found this forum :)

I've been driving a 1.3l automatic Corolla Assista Package imported from Japan (2001 model), since 2008. No major issues, or any issues at all... just stuck callipers.  It has 165,000km and am thinking of upgrading. Not because of any issues with the car, but as an upgrade.

I've found a 2012 Avensis 1.8 T4. It has around 95,000km.  It's being sold for €9,500 (£8,300 with current rate). I think it's a little bit expensive but I might deal for a lower price.

What do you think about such a change? This for sure adds to the running costs (in terms of license and insurance, and probably also cost of parts), but what about the reliability of this car? Is it as reliable as the Corolla I have? Are these Avensis capable of reaching the same mileage of a Corolla without major issues, or do they have a shorter lifetime? I drive an average of 10,000km per year. The last thing I want is to upgrade for a better car, turning out it's not better at all :) 

Thanks!

[mrfixer]

 I believe you are in Malta?  The 1.8 sold there would be the EU version with Valvematic engine and electronic parking brake (EPB).  The Avensis is therefore a bit more complex than your Corolla and so potentially more expensive to maintain. However the car is not particularly old or high mileage. Check it over very carefully and you'll probably be OK.

[DanFen]

Correct, valvematic one. I spoke to two local mechanics and they are both sceptical about the car. They're saying it's not economical and that it will have transmission issues. I can understand you can't compare it to a 1.3l VVTi on a 2001 Corolla, but how bad can it be? One of them even went as far as hinting I'd be better of with a VW Passat instead.

Could be they are just not familiar with the car as I haven't seen a lot of these around, most Toyota on the island are imported from Japan rather than EU (and if it's imported from Europe, it's from the UK).  It's certainly a dilemma 🙂

[FROSTYBALLS]

So what difference does it make if it is from the UK, rather than other European plants such as France or Turkey?

[Konrad C]

I have had my 2009 '58 plate Avensis Tourer 1.8 TR Valvematic since Sept 2015, and paid £5600 from a trader. It had 50,000 miles and had been recently serviced, before I bought it. On that basis you are paying a over the odds, so you need to get the price down a lot! The car needs to be in perfect condition. Mine had a couple of marks and scratches, and one ding in the passenger door which I manage to remove.
The only other issue I learnt about, was the door strap cracks. Overall, apart from having the clutch replaced, replacing tyres, and getting a full size spare alloy in place of the horrible space saver, the car has been good.
The EPB faults I had have been caused by either a sensor not properly connect after the clutch replacement, or when I used the wrong diagnostic tool to 'reset' the EPB after rear brake pad change. You don't need to reset anything after a brake pad replacement, but press and release the parking brakes. I fixed both those issues. 
I do the oil and filter changes myself and use 0w-20 fully synthetic oil, plus air and cabin filters. Spark plug are Denso Iridium, nothing else.

I suspect the water pump may need changing, due to the noise coming from that area. I will order a replacement and Toyota long life coolant. I have a spare belt. I have researched the job and it is not difficult (for me) to do. I will confirm the water pump is at fault, by removing the belt and spinning the pulleys. The noise is not too loud, but just noticeable. Hope it's not the alternator!

The car is reliable and a lot of the items are easy to fox compared to the diesel variant, due to access.

I used to own a '98 Mk1 Avensis 1.8 GLS, and that was a great car, built in the same Derby factory as my current car. Had it from 2003 to 2016 - yes I had them together for 6 months. 

Sorry for waffling on. Just giving my experience of the car.
   

[DanFen]

Hey Konrad, thanks for the feedback, very informative. I fully agree about the price, I have to get that down at around €7,500 (£6,500) for it to be worth getting.  Considering it consumes slightly more fuel compared to my current car, and insurance/license costs are higher. The car was visually checked already and it seems to be in a very good condition. I'd also need to find a reliable mechanic to properly check it, ideally with the computer.

What concerns me most are the running/maintenance/repair costs and the reliability of this car. I know it can't match my 2001 1.3l Corolla because of the bigger engine and additional electronics, but are they as reliable? Do they last a decent amount of time, or it's highly probable that I have to scrap it after 5 years due to some CVT / engine failure? i.e. is this car able to reach 250,000kms or is the life expectancy that of 100,000kms?

I'll be honest, one of the reasons I am interested in this car is because of it's aesthetical design (I like prefer sedans to hatchbacks) and features, but I also want to same reliability of a Corolla. If this car is not able to match the reliability I will let it go and keep the slow 1.3l Corolla with 165K kms 🙂 

 

[Konrad C]

Hi Daniel, good move to get a diagnostics check. Some sellers don't like it, because diagnostics might find something hidden. I have my own diagnostics including Toyota Techstream (older version) and VCI. My Launch which messed up my EPB, has improved with updates. I also have Delphi on the same netbook as Techstream, but with a different cable. Techstream has been a life saver, and I have used it on other friends cars.

[DanFen]

Hi Konrad, is Techstream a free software that you can use with any OBD connector? What is My Launch? 🙂 

The seller got the price down to €8500 (£7,400 with current rate). I'll probably manage to get it down to €8,000 as well. Actually I don't think I'll accept the offer of €8,500.

I got some questions about the CVT, cause I've never drove a car with one. Is it driven the same as an automatic car?
And more questions, are there any specific checks I should definitely do? Like I know for example the issue with the front doors, and the issue with the EPB (but is there a way to check the EPB for example?)

 

[Konrad C]

I can't really answer much about the CVT, but from what I know, it is better built than those used by other companies like Nissan. CVT is driven like an auto, and can be set to preset gearing equivalent in manual mode. I drove a Rav4 with CVT and that was fine. Others will provide more detailed info from experience and use.

Type Avensis EPB in the forum search, and you will find more info. I already stated some issues. Like any car there will be the odd fault where the EPB unit has to be replaced. But this is rare for most. My car is 11 years old, which is one of the first built T27. The cable seals need to be good to stop water ingress. Avoid wading through deep water. Some of the problems are not the EPB, but the calipers and other brake components. Also electrical connections like the gear position sensor in manuals need to checked for firm connection, after a clutch replacement. This has happened to me and a few others, where the fitter has rushed the job and and not put back the securing bolt to the cable or securely fitted the cable. This will cause the EPB fault to appear with a message, and the auto release won't engage. So most of the issues are external to the EPB.

The front door is a sticky issue. I chose to use large washers to help spread the load. Some cars had the doors replaced or were repaired.
 

 I have increased the size of the washers since that photo. I have metal which I might cut to shape and size, then get a friend to weld to reinforce that area of the door. I use some silicon grease on the straps to reduce the loading. Each car has varies to how it's used, if the cars are bad or not. Factor that in.

The Valvematic engine has a vacuum pump at the gearbox side of the camshaft. When idling you may hear it. That's normal.
If buying the 'Nav' version, make sure the map SD card is supplied. It is needed if the car Battery is disconnected, because the audio unit will not boot without it - no radio or any other function! Some owners remove the SD card and keep it with the car folder and manuals, so check there. Talking of navigation, the unit is always out of date, even with the latest update. You are better off using your mobile phone.

I covered some things and hopefully anything I missed will be covered by others.

 

[DanFen]

Thanks Konrad, much appreciated. It really helps. Seller didn't agree to €7700 yet, that is the point I would buy it. 

If I get to that point I'll probably think about installing LPG on it, at least after a few months (until I get used to how it works). 

[alan333]

On 4/28/2020 at 7:21 PM, DanFen said:

I got some questions about the CVT, cause I've never drove a car with one. Is it driven the same as an automatic car?

Yes the cvt (constantly/continuously variable transmission) is fully automatic, and 'creeps' like a full automatic. It's revvy tho, like you're driving with a slipping clutch.  Great around town, but annoying on hills at motorway speeds.

[DanFen]

19 hours ago, alan333 said:

Yes the cvt (constantly/continuously variable transmission) is fully automatic, and 'creeps' like a full automatic. It's revvy tho, like you're driving with a slipping clutch.  Great around town, but annoying on hills at motorway speeds.

Fair enough 🙂 I've always driven an automatic and we have no motorways in Malta. Maximum speed is 80km/h.

[DanFen]

I've settled with €8000 (that's £6,970 current rate). It has no scratches whatsoever, just a tiny little bump on the body the size of my finger tip. Seems to be very well kept. 

Still got to check it out at a car mechanic, although they said, they will check it out with a computer for any errors and there's nothing much else to be checked. Maybe jack it up and check the bottom also. Not sure if this method of "checking" is just in my country or not. I've only bought a car ones and it was from a relative, so didn't have to go through this.

Here's some photos.

 

... and my current Corolla (2001 Japan model)

[paul9]

It looks very nice at least, but then so does your Corolla. It seems expensive, at least in UK terms, but I haven't a clue what typical pricing for the Maltese used car market is. I hope it is a good one for you if you buy it.

[Konrad C]

On 4/28/2020 at 7:21 PM, DanFen said:

Hi Konrad, is Techstream a free software that you can use with any OBD connector? What is My Launch? 🙂 

The seller got the price down to €8500 (£7,400 with current rate). I'll probably manage to get it down to €8,000 as well. Actually I don't think I'll accept the offer of €8,500.

I got some questions about the CVT, cause I've never drove a car with one. Is it driven the same as an automatic car?
And more questions, are there any specific checks I should definitely do? Like I know for example the issue with the front doors, and the issue with the EPB (but is there a way to check the EPB for example?)

Here is answers to the diagnostic questions. 
I have Launch CreaderVIII which has lifetime updates and works with nearly every car. It has improved with performance, but never use the reset parking brake function! I used this by mistake after replacing the rear brake pads, and all it did was remove the zero point calibration of the clutch and g-force sensors, creating a couple of codes. Worse still, it couldn't remove the faults. The EPB warning message was displayed and the auto release did not function. Detains of the Launch are in the following link.
http://www.obd2shop.co.uk/wholesale/launch-x431-creader-viii-comperhensive-diagnostic-instrument.html

The next diagnostic software and kit I got off the net was Toyota Techstream. It was not the latest official version. It worked a bit, but I then found a later, but not current version of the software. This works perfectly and fixed the EPB problem the Launch created. Depending where you buy, the cable and software vary in price. I have used Techstream on different models, and it's works very well. The official Techstream is a pay per use. 

The final diagnostics in my kit is Delphi. Like Techstream I got it via eBay and the price varies depending on seller. You get special cable interface and software disc. It's loaded on to the same Windows XP netbook as Techstream. Unlike Toyota only Techstream, Delphi works on most OBD2 cars. I works well and was better than the Launch at first. The Launch updates have improved it since. The Delphi like the Techstream not being official can't be updated! 

I didn't give prices since you are non UK and I got these items over 4 years ago. Any good quality diagnostic scanner should work, just find out what they can do!