Battery Problem?

[Mafio]

Hi, can anyone tell me what the idle current consumption is on a 05 Avensis 2.0 auto. Mine reads 350ma. If the Battery is fully charged within a week the Battery is dead. I do have an aux Battery to start the car and once the car has been running for a mile or two there is no problem in restarting, so I am reluctant to buy another battery. The alternator is about a year old so shouldn't be a problem. Back to my question if 350 is high then I will have to look further.

[Mafio]

Sorry I have used the wrong word; I meant by idle, the engine not running, no lights, no key in the ignition  nothing on.

[Gerg]

I think that 350mA is way too high, as I'm sure you know, that is a load of about 4 watts.

I would expect 50 - 80 mA would be the range you should be looking for.

Be aware that your car is new enough (I think) to use a CAN bus system - the draw should lower in distinct steps as the car shuts down ECUs after the car is turned off.  On our Auris, which I measured a month back, the lowest level of current drain is only achieved after the car has been left, undisturbed, for 20 minutes.  There was about 3 steps down, of varying duration, on the way to arriving at this level.

HTH

[sproutdreamer]

That looks to me more like the boot light is staying on. A  5watt bulb is about 5w@12.9 on a fully charged Battery, worth checking out or a courtesy light in the car. I have had the same problem with an Avensis boot light staying on.

[Mafio]

Many thanks for Gergs suggestions I have now measured the current drain after some 5 hours, it's still 330Ma. Tomorrow i will investigate first by checking visually and then by disconnecting the relevant fuses. The 4 or 5 watt does look as if its a lamp somewhere.

Many thanks for your replies.

[Mafio]

Hi, Have removed the 7.5A 'Dome' fuse and current consumption goes down to 50ma. Which suggests a courtesy light etc, I have only visually checked the lights they go on and off when supposed to. Am I missing something are there lights anywhere else such as engine bay, spare wheel bay etc.

The car is a lift back, by the way.

[paul9]

I think they are the glovebox, front seats, rear seats and boot. I can't remember there being one under the bonnet.

[Ricochet1]

Hi David,

how dis you measure the current leakage?     i have a car whose Battery flats in under a week and it was replaced only a few years ago. I switched the int light off previously, still flattening.

[Mafio]

Hi all. after a lot of messing about I am not sure there is a problem! I measured the current across the open circuit dome fuse. The lights go out this then drops to 50ma but after a further 40 secs it drops to zero. The current consumption from the Battery is still 330 ma even after a minute or so. I can only guess that this is due to the alarm and or radio. I cannot be bothered to investigate any more I will live with it. This only arose due to the lock down, the car is normally used every day so the problem doesn't arise. Its only because it has been idle for a week or so.

Many thanks for all thoughts and suggestions.

 

[Gerg]

15 hours ago, Ricochet1 said:

Hi David,

how dis you measure the current leakage? 

There is the obvious one of fitting a regular current meter in series with the Battery feed, or perhaps better still, the earth.  Care is needed with this, if you forgetfully try to start the car with the meter in the current setting and still installed, then the meter will blow its internal fuse, or the meter may possibly overheat/catch fire.

Then there is a more expensive option without these risks (£36) :-

https://www.amazon.co.uk/UT210E-Current-Meters-Capacitance-Tester/dp/B00O1Q2HOQ 

which simply clamps over an individual conductor with no disconnection, interruption, or aggravation necessary, but you do have to physically isolate each conductor that you wish to test, so that the clamp can fit  around that single wire.  

There are  likely to be other similar meters around.  I bought one of these some while back.  Meters of this type used to be very much more expensive.

Or, as another option, with a digital voltmeter on a sensitive scale, you can measure the voltage drop across individual fuse blade's contact pads (these should be still visible when installed).  This can be matched up to the chart in this VW technical bulletin, to establish the current draw on each fuse that you suspect is part of the problem circuit.

 

VW_-_Flat_Battery_-_Current_Draw_Table_-_VW.pdf

[Mafio]

Thanks Gerg, I used a multimeter.

[Gerg]

9 minutes ago, Mafio said:

Thanks Gerg, I used a multimeter.

No problem!  I was answering the other poster above yours, as much as anything - you appear to know your way around this electrical lark quite well!

[Mafio]

Many many moons ago I used to be an electronics engineer. I could read a television circuit diagram with no problem at all, but the car wiring diagrams are a mystery to everyone else except to the draughtsmen. I have various wiring diagrams for the Avensis in a PDF format and they are a nightmare to follow. And what about putting a fuse box in the drivers foot well, you have to lie on your back to get to it.____

__

[Ricochet1]

Thanks Gerg,       i'll order one of those meters and i may be back for further advice if thats ok?.  i am not an electrickery person , i can weild multi meter leads but where to and interpreting results ,not always so successful.

john. 

[Ricochet1]

Ordered one of those clamp meters and with some training ( i knew a son's University education  would be of use)

we found only minimum drain    20mA  ...so its the carp RAC Battery.  will call them out and see what they say but i wont buy another of theirs.

[Mafio]

Well! it seemed that some of the problem was indeed the Battery not holding the charge, a new one now seems to be ok.

In the mean time however the exhaust blew a hole which has now been fixed only to be advised by the garage that the join to the back box has failed. And guess what, they cannot source a back box. There's always something...

[Konrad C]

I too recently changed the car Battery. I flattened it once or twice as far back as 2018, doing diagnostics and listening to music whilst fitting gadgets to the car, but it coped well after. The Battery condition indicator was showing 'green' = good! If parked up for a few days it would either just about start, or the Battery was too weak. Once the car was running, the battery was fine. I carried one of those small booster starter, and that worked. The lock down made the situation worse, so I changed the battery in the end. Good thing too, as the plastic battery tray was missing. All sorted and I can leave the car up to a week or more (car usually park for a few days between use). 

[Ricochet1]

Battery problems worsen. RAC man came out , looked at his laptop and said we havent any record of fitting this, while he was looking at a Battery that said RAC all over it, then tested i.t

(NB RAC branded batteries have 5year warranty)    eventually confirmed it was fitted on July 4th 2016 by RAC  so within Warranty period ...end of good news.

He said they will not honour the warranty because its below 11.9V,- thats one of their conditions, and gave me a leaflet about it. and that was it 

he did offer 10% off a Bosch battery  ..  I paid £110 for this 5yr g'teed.battery in 2016  and now they say   NO! 

So beware the RAC Battery SCAM. 

think i may start anew topic to make folks aware of this fraud.

[Catlover]

What did the leaflet say about the 11.9v criteria the RAC mam spoke about.?  You should have been made aware of any conditions when you bought the Battery.

[Konrad C]

1 hour ago, Ricochet1 said:

Battery problems worsen. RAC man came out , looked at his laptop and said we havent any record of fitting this, while he was looking at a battery that said RAC all over it, then tested i.t

(NB RAC branded batteries have 5year warranty)    eventually confirmed it was fitted on July 4th 2016 by RAC  so within Warranty period ...end of good news.

He said they will not honour the warranty because its below 11.9V,- thats one of their conditions, and gave me a leaflet about it. and that was it 

he did offer 10% off a Bosch battery  ..  I paid £110 for this 5yr g'teed.battery in 2016  and now they say   NO! 

So beware the RAC Battery SCAM. 

think i may start anew topic to make folks aware of this fraud.

That's not good. My old Battery was a Platinum Battery which I think was supplied by National Tyres, well before I owned the car back in 2015. I replaced it with Exide Premium at a good price from Tayna Batteries plus delivery, just over a month ago. Same Battery from Euro Car Parts would cost far more, even with discount!

[mrfixer]

Years ago the RAC was run for the benefit of its members. Starting 1999 it was taken private and has since had about half a dozen different owners. Its currently owned by a private equity company based in Luxembourg. These smart guys know that failing batteries are a very common reason for call out and a good chance to sell you a Battery at a huge mark up.  Then impose some very questionable warranty conditions - job done!

Best thing to do is not use their overpriced breakdown service.

[Bob110023]

Hi guy's.  I look after all the Battery warranty issues for a company in the Bristol area. A Battery returning only 11 volts could have had an internal fault. Did the RAC guy test the Battery. 🤔

[Ricochet1]

23 hours ago, Catlover said:

What did the leaflet say about the 11.9v criteria the RAC mam spoke about.?  You should have been made aware of any conditions when you bought the battery.

The leaflet which they have now, but not at the time, (because i had v small print conditions on the back of my 2016 report/invoice which did not mention low voltage),

The leaflet says, amongst other exceptions   ' Batteries which have been fully discharged - i.e.with an initial voltage below 11.9V'.

In any event they wouldn't give you this until after the event ie fitted and paid for when you are still  blinded by the '5 Year Warranty' 

if i had realised this i could have done something because after he was sent away clutching his 10% off offer i put a power pack on the Battery and moved the car and let it run for 10 mins giving a voltage across terminals of 12.3V as measured by my neighbour  when we took it off ..

Even the RAC man said you can go to customer care but they wont do anything. 

Can you tell i am not pleased?   i'll prob post the leaflet tomorrow.

I may do a public post on FACEBOOK about this..

take care folks

JC

 

[Ricochet1]

On 7/1/2020 at 8:57 PM, Catlover said:

What did the leaflet say about the 11.9v criteria the RAC mam spoke about.?  You should have been made aware of any conditions when you bought the battery.

i believe this leaflet has been printed since i bought the Battery, this is the relevant part.

 

RAC Batt leaf2.pdf

[Catlover]

If you suggesting the 11.9v clause was not listed n the conditions when you bought the Battery why not challenge the RAC direct, perhaps getting advice from some free organisation such as Citizens Advice etc. You could come unstuck if you just start going Facebook etc then you are challenged and proved not correct. Just saying - be aware.