Hybrid shuddering stop

[scar]

We have had our Hybrid 4 weeks today. My wife went out to do her shopping and  she had this issue.

Driving along 30 mph limit approaching a roundabout. Car shuddered though its whole body and came to a halt in the outside lane. Lots of lights flashing on the dash and it didn't want to move. Eventually it did and she got safely to her destination. 

She was seriously flustered and tried her best to relate the issue in chronological order. She even said, did I try to change gear ? did that do it. Well I thought an interlock on the gear selector would stop that.

Its booked in for a check Tuesday.

Anybody heard of this problem ? your input welcome.

[scar]

I have had a look at the dash cam footage. My wife is driving normally about 30 mph, no cars in front. It looks like the TSS decided to do an emergency stop. I can hear what my wife described as shuddering I think its the ABS modulating the brake system. Strange, no bits of paper blowing across the road. In fact it couldn't have been more clear in front of the car.

Sent a copy of the video to the garage.

Also put a old dash cam on the rear window looking forward to hopefully capture future issues. Hopefully it will never be needed.

Tried attaching a copy of the video to this post. Hope it works.

[philip42h]

Did the car "see" a bicycle? I know that seems insane but the stop was triggered exactly alongside the bicycle symbol in the cycle lane ...

No, that can't be it ... 

[Sooty]

quite possible. I notice the cycle sign on the road immediately before the stop was triggered.

[Rav4ster]

It is usually beeps and pops up BRAKE message on the speedo screen. Mine does similar thing all the time on the same bend, when car is parked on outside of the bend, so I slow down, to avoid an emergency stop by a car.

[flash22]

Another owner had Battery issues due to the length of time the car had been stored before pickup what could easily be 4 months

[scar]

Thanks for those suggestions, they are welcome because I don't know what the issue is.

I am assuming its the emergency braking system activating if you think otherwise please chip in.

Regarding the painted bike on the road surface. She has driven past a few on that stretch of road. However the braking coincide as she past one so thats a possibility. We use this stretch of road on a regular basis and its been trouble free. Its certainly a contender for being the trigger.

My wife said there was loads of lights on the dash when she looked after the car halted. A brake message may have been one. I hope these events are recorded by the vehicle.

My trade in was a CR-V that I had for 4 years. The emergency braking activated once when it was needed 😋

Yes batteries despite appearing to be 100% can cause issues. My brother in law has a jag, Battery caused lots of gremlins till it was replaced. Apparently its a known issue for his model.

 

[MagicBoy]

Having had the TSS trigger on the Auris when a someone pulled out of a side road without looking .... it certainly looks like a TSS stop.

I've had the big flashing red BRAKE !!! thing a couple of times, but in that instance the car just stopped itself as I was going for the pedal ... with no alert. I also felt the seat belt pre-tensioners trigger. System did its job - stopped about 1ft from the door of the offending Mini. Had to power it the car off and back on again to get it to move IIRC.

[scar]

MagicBoy, after the stop my wife couldn't  drive away just as you mentioned. It was a case of pushing buttons till power was restored then drive off.

[ian rooke]

Hi on my Prius I trigger the TSS every time I pull into the garage it being only 4 inches longer than the car and it doe's not switch off the drive  

[Auris James]

Glad there was no accident. If there was a car behind, could of easily gone into the back, not expecting an emergency stop.

[scar]

34 minutes ago, Auris James said:

Glad there was no accident. If there was a car behind, could of easily gone into the back, not expecting an emergency stop.

Yes James that was my main concern. You only need a vehicle with average brakes, driver not paying attention and its whiplash time. The braking distance of the RAV was good but it doesn't you any favours when the vehicle behind cannot stop as quick. That road is a major bus route as well.

[duncerduncs]

Hopefully there will be a fault code logged making it easier for the dealer to diagnose the fault.

 

[MagicBoy]

1 hour ago, ian rooke said:

Hi on my Prius I trigger the TSS every time I pull into the garage it being only 4 inches longer than the car and it doe's not switch off the drive  

There's a substantial difference between the pre-collision alert and autonomous braking.

 

@scar I'd definitely speak to the dealership. One thing did occur to me - is that the first time you've driven down that road in the RAV4?

[scar]

18 minutes ago, MagicBoy said:

There's a substantial difference between the pre-collision alert and autonomous braking.

 

@scar I'd definitely speak to the dealership. One thing did occur to me - is that the first time you've driven down that road in the RAV4?

Yes booked in to be checked out. Was offered Monday but my wife cares for her parents 91 and 87, with one disabled so she needs the car on Monday. So its 8.30 Tuesday. She uses that road every day, but usually there are cars parked to the left. Today none.

It seems certain functions in the TTS can be turned off. That includes the pre collision system (PCS) . See attached video. 

 

[ian rooke]

Hi sorry if i did not explain myself properly when you drive too close to anything depending on your speed the autonomous braking well come in and slam on the brakes it however does not stop the engine not in the case of the Prius

[scar]

Update. The car has been in the dealership today. Full diagnostic check and road test. No faults stored and all systems working as they should. Technicians have been liaising with Toyota UK and have supplied them with what info they have. Plus the video. I would post a copy of the work sheet but the case is still classed as open and awaiting action from Toyota UK.

The sharp eyed amongst you will notice my time stamp is way out. The event occurred Friday 7th August. That makes the car 4 weeks 3 days from first registered. About 500 miles on the clock at the time. 

So I await Toyota UK response.

[Peterd23]

I have to confess that I am intrigued by this case, especially as I have been driving a RAV4 Excel (previous model) with TSS for nearly three years.

Looking at the video quite a few times it certainly looks like PCS activation in terms of the amount of braking applied although the screeching sound does not sound like the 'BRAKE' warning although I have no experience of the new model to know what it sounds like. Your car stops in a very short distance and the bonnet dip supports this. While no faults have been stored, thinking back I believed that the TSS system acts as a 'Black Box' and stores relevant data - including, I thought PCS activation. Hopefully the dealer checked this.

My experience of this braking system has been altogether positive. Yes, it gets annoying when I don't pull our round parked cars early enough to prevent the 'BRAKE' warning, I have had no false applications and trust the system. I have tested it once (unplanned) and the system saved me running in to the back of a car that stopped suddenly. I must have passed millions of those bike symbols without a problem. Now the RSA system is something else and often amusing with its random observations, telling me on a twisty 20 mph limit housing estate that the limit was 100 !

I will be interested to hear how this case progresses.

[Rav Rob]

Just an off the wall idea, the lane markings on the left have just curved sharply left as the cycle lane ends, the car is obviously going straight on, its almost as if the car thought you had gone off the road by not following the line and stopped the car. But as far as I know the car doesn't have this function, even with lane assist switched on, it just warns or steering corrects if set.

[scar]

16 hours ago, Peterd23 said:

I have to confess that I am intrigued by this case, especially as I have been driving a RAV4 Excel (previous model) with TSS for nearly three years.

Looking at the video quite a few times it certainly looks like PCS activation in terms of the amount of braking applied although the screeching sound does not sound like the 'BRAKE' warning although I have no experience of the new model to know what it sounds like. Your car stops in a very short distance and the bonnet dip supports this. While no faults have been stored, thinking back I believed that the TSS system acts as a 'Black Box' and stores relevant data - including, I thought PCS activation. Hopefully the dealer checked this.

My experience of this braking system has been altogether positive. Yes, it gets annoying when I don't pull our round parked cars early enough to prevent the 'BRAKE' warning, I have had no false applications and trust the system. I have tested it once (unplanned) and the system saved me running in to the back of a car that stopped suddenly. I must have passed millions of those bike symbols without a problem. Now the RSA system is something else and often amusing with its random observations, telling me on a twisty 20 mph limit housing estate that the limit was 100 !

I will be interested to hear how this case progresses.

You identified the issue that concerns me the most, the screeching. 

Yes will let the Forum know when I get some some feed back.

[PeteB]

I amongst the prelaunch blurb before I got my RAV4, there was mention that the Safety Sense Version 2 software did look for cycles (in daylight) and pedestrians (including in darkness!).

I find it hard to believe, however, that it mistook a painted cycle symbol on the road for a cyclist, but who knows, anything is possible!

[scar]

Today Thursday 13th August about 3.15pm my wife was driving the RAV and there was another emergency braking issue. Recorded on my dash cam. Here it is 

[scar]

This should really be attached to my last post with the video. I contacted the garage and its going in tomorrow morning. They are supplying a courtesy vehicle, a Yaris. They know my wife cares for her parents 91 and 87 both with medical issues. I think the garage might have to up their game on the loan vehicle. We need space for a wheel chair and 3 adults minimum. If we didn't need the space I would have got a RAV4.

They have been told that a number of times. Lets see if the can come up with transport more suited to the people that use it.

Ive rather gone off the RAV, shame.

[PeteB]

That's certainly very worrying, nothing in view to explain what might have set it off and I can understand your feelings towards the RAV.  A shame though, as I think you've been very unlucky.

Out of all the owners on here who've had AEB (it was on my 2016 Prius, which covered 39,000 miles and I've done just over 11,000 in the RAV with no AEB-related incidents) this is the only report I've seen of a problem like this.

I hope they sort it to your satisfaction quickly.

Like Peterd23 I've experienced the odd BRAKE warning and beeping when heading for a parked car and moving out late due to oncoming traffic, but not very often.  I've only experienced activation a handful of times, at very low speed, in my old Prius in a restaurant car park where I would back into some long grass.  Even at 2-4 mph, it was sudden and abrupt and would be mildly startling if unexpected (as it was for a friend I let drive it to that restaurant and had a good laugh when it did it to him [the poor guy thought he'd dumped something in my then new car!]).

[Peterd23]

Hmmm, my wife just came to the PC as I was watching the latest clip and I quote "Well that's not right". She used to have a Yaris with TSS and is used to the odd BRAKE warning but agrees that the screeching noise is nothing like the noise that is expected.

Toyota dealers vary in their service levels but should be able to provide you with something more suitable than a service courtesy Yaris, but I expect you to push on this as I am sure you will.

The latest clip is quite alarming. I think I would be thinking about putting a letter in to the dealer principal indicating that you intend to reject this car and ask what they intend to do. Certainly I would not be happy driving it as it is.