oil

[roger_37]

ive covered about 1700 miles since last oil change,
i usually change every six month or 3000 +miles but with convid 
only done  about halve,would it be worth changing oil anyway,
about to go uk mainland soon(manc)..would anyone bother changing.?

 

[m4rkw]

I would change it yes. Not being driven or driven very little / short distances is the worst possible conditions for a car. When I do lots of short trips I change at 3000 miles or 6 months, whichever comes first. When I've been doing lots of long motorway runs I push it out to 5000.

[Catlover]

Good oil is the lifeblood of a car. Generally speaking high mileage cars that have not had engine problems will have had regular oil changes. For what it costs, it’s well worth a change.

[182_blue]

1700 miles and you are worrying about changing the oil?  🤔, if we did that with my wife's car we would literally be changing the oil every two weeks! 

I stick with the manufacturers recommendations for time and distances, oil these days is very advanced and last alot longer than the old days, some say changing oil to often can have a detrimental effect on the engine, I just think its a waste of money and of course has a negative effect on the environment, anyway just my opinion and what do I know 😂. 

[m4rkw]

1 hour ago, 182_blue said:

1700 miles and you are worrying about changing the oil?  🤔, if we did that with my wife's car we would literally be changing the oil every two weeks! 

I stick with the manufacturers recommendations for time and distances, oil these days is very advanced and last alot longer than the old days, some say changing oil to often can have a detrimental effect on the engine, I just think its a waste of money and of course has a negative effect on the environment, anyway just my opinion and what do I know 😂. 

It depends how the car is driven. 1700 miles in two weeks is ideal operating conditions for a car, any moisture in the crankcase will be getting regularly boiled off. That oil will be in very good condition. 1700 miles in 6 months however is a very different scenario and if it were my car I would change it. Moisture gets into the oil via condensation, if it isn't driven for extended runs up to temperature to boil the moisture off that stays in the oil and sludges it up over time.

[182_blue]

1 hour ago, m4rkw said:

It depends how the car is driven. 1700 miles in two weeks is ideal operating conditions for a car, any moisture in the crankcase will be getting regularly boiled off. That oil will be in very good condition. 1700 miles in 6 months however is a very different scenario and if it were my car I would change it. Moisture gets into the oil via condensation, if it isn't driven for extended runs up to temperature to boil the moisture off that stays in the oil and sludges it up over time.

I just don't consider it a problem tbh, even in the old days of very basic oil I only ever did the oil yearly and I have never had a single issue ever, some people like to tinker and waste money I guess. 

[m4rkw]

27 minutes ago, 182_blue said:

I just don't consider it a problem tbh, even in the old days of very basic oil I only ever did the oil yearly and I have never had a single issue ever, some people like to tinker and waste money I guess. 

This is faulty logic. Your scenario is a sample size of one. If I showed you one person who had smoked 40 Marlboros a day most of their life and lived to 90 would you consider this evidence that smoking is safe? The truth is in the aggregate numbers. Extended oil change intervals were introduced sometime around the late 2000s and many garages later saw a deluge of cars with under 100k coming in needing engines because the extended intervals had sludged them up. Do you think manufacturers want their engines to last forever? Of course not, they want to sell you a new car, and longer service intervals are more attractive to fleet buyers. Again it depends how the car is driven, and it also depends on how long you want to keep it. If you’re happy to throw it away at 100k then most cars will get there without a lot if maintenance, that’s pretty much their designed service life nowadays. If you want to drive it until the wheels fall off however, perhaps reconsider.

[roger_37]

thanks all for advice

[182_blue]

4 hours ago, roger_37 said:

thanks all for advice

"faulty logic" 🤣 or not I simply don't think a car need servicing more than the manufacturer recommends especially on something like the Rav4, it's hardly a high stress sports car (my usual car choice) as I originally stated its just my opinion but I think at 1700 miles your just chucking good money away. 

[m4rkw]

26 minutes ago, 182_blue said:

"faulty logic" 🤣 or not I simply don't think a car need servicing more than the manufacturer recommends especially on something like the Rav4, it's hardly a high stress sports car (my usual car choice) as I originally stated its just my opinion but I think at 1700 miles your just chucking good money away. 

You're completely missing the point. It isn't just the miles alone that affect the condition of the oil, it's time and how the car has been driven. If it was last changed 5 years ago and had only covered 1700 miles in that time would you still be arguing that it was a waste of money to change it?

[Stivino]

Oil has a shelf life of 5 years so I can’t see why it should be changed any more often than is recommended by the manufacturer.

 

[m4rkw]

Just now, Stivino said:

Oil has a shelf life of 5 years so I can’t see why it should be changed any more often than is recommended by the manufacturer.

 

Sitting on a shelf it isn’t subjected to condensation or repeated heat/cool cycles through the combustion process.

[m4rkw]

Also if you read your owners manual carefully you’ll find they usually recommend a shorter interval for cars subjected to extreme service. Not being driven very often falls into this category.

[Stivino]

I would hardly call not doing a lot of miles “extreme service”.

[182_blue]

49 minutes ago, m4rkw said:

You're completely missing the point. It isn't just the miles alone that affect the condition of the oil, it's time and how the car has been driven. If it was last changed 5 years ago and had only covered 1700 miles in that time would you still be arguing that it was a waste of money to change it?

No I would be doing as the manufacturer recommends and what I said earlier on, I. E time or distance, so either yearly or the mileage that they recommend, you can keep trying to convince me but unfortunately I just don't think it's right to change it unless something very extreme (by extreme I don't mean sitting for a few weeks) has happened to the car. 

[olddriver]

9 hours ago, m4rkw said:

1700 miles in 6 months however is a very different scenario and if it were my car I would change it. Moisture gets into the oil via condensation, if it isn't driven for extended runs up to temperature to boil the moisture off that stays in the oil and sludges it up over time.

Plus there’s extra wear and tear on the bearings.

[Stivino]

There will never be enough water in the oil to diminish its properties to the extent that it won’t do its job.

And, what extra wear and tear would that be?

[m4rkw]

21 minutes ago, Stivino said:

I would hardly call not doing a lot of miles “extreme service”.

You might not, but the manufacturers of vehicles do. See here for further reading from someone who actually knows what they're talking about (very successful garage owner, working on toyota/lexus for decades): http://www.agcoauto.com/content/news/p2_articleid/212

[182_blue]

3 minutes ago, m4rkw said:

You might not, but the manufacturers of vehicles do. See here for further reading from someone who actually knows what they're talking about (very successful garage owner, working on toyota/lexus for decades): http://www.agcoauto.com/content/news/p2_articleid/212

Runs a garage that does oil changes?, I can Google all day long but I won't bore everyone 🤣

[m4rkw]

6 minutes ago, Stivino said:

There will never be enough water in the oil to diminish its properties to the extent that it won’t do its job.

And, what extra wear and tear would that be?

Nonsense. See the link I posted above.

Also if you stop to think about it for more than a minute or two you'll realise why blindly following the manufacturer's recommend intervals is silly if you intend on keeping the car a long time. At the point of sale, low maintenance is a selling point, especially for fleet buyers. The car looks better on paper because its running costs are apparently lower. But the company selling you the car only really care about it making it out of the warranty period, beyond that.. who cares? If it suffers catastrophic engine failure at 110k they can sell you a new one. Bonus.

Ultimately it's up to you and based on various factors that I've already mentioned, and if you don't plan on keeping your cars for more than a few years then changing it less often probably won't matter (to you at least). The only reason I'm pointing this stuff out is that a lot of people read forums and I would strongly encourage anyone reading this to do their own research and talk to actual technicians and garage owners before deciding not to change their oil.

[m4rkw]

Just now, 182_blue said:

Runs a garage that does oil changes?, I can Google all day long but I won't bore everyone 🤣

Runs a garage that also fully rebuilds engines. Which do you imagine is more profitable for them? You'll never save enough on oil changes to pay for one engine rebuild.

[182_blue]

I'm out, you know my opinion OP 👍😊

[Stivino]

10 minutes ago, m4rkw said:

Runs a garage that also fully rebuilds engines. Which do you imagine is more profitable for them? You'll never save enough on oil changes to pay for one engine rebuild.

Is he the actual guy who designs the Toyota and Lexus engines? No, I didn't think so.

He's a guy with a garage who has an interest in getting people to change their oil more often than they need to so that he makes a lot of money. 

I've built and re-built many engines too over a span of many years. Also, I am well qualified to do so.

I'm out too.

[m4rkw]

1 minute ago, Stivino said:

Is he the actual guy who designs the Toyota and Lexus engines? No, I didn't think so.

He's a guy with a garage who has an interest in getting people to change their oil more often than they need to so that he makes a lot of money. 

I've built and re-built many engines too over a span of many years. Also, I am well qualified to do so.

I'm out too.

Louis is a good guy, and honest. That wasn't just some link I found randomly, I've known him for a long time and we talk every now and then and he's taken the time to help me with many car problems over the years even though we live in different countries and he has no prospect of ever making any money from it. He has a weekly call-in radio show where he helps people with their car problems and takes a great pride in being honest and treating his customers fairly. If you'd read much of his website you'd eventually realise that his entire business and ethos is centered around saving people money.

Please think twice before implying that someone is being dishonest on the internet when you don't know them at all.

[olddriver]

1 hour ago, Stivino said:

And, what extra wear and tear would that be?

 

Lots of starting and short journeys causes excessive bearing wear.