Yaris Hybrid 2020 TNGA - Hybrid System Malfunction

[Cyker]

This has happened to enough people here that there must be some manufacturing fault in some of them; I thought it was only earlier 2020-ish ones that were affected but if that one is from June 2021 and is still affected that is more concerning.

For all you that've had that issue, what's the date of manufacture and trim level of the car?

 

[vanilla.coffee]

4 minutes ago, Cyker said:

This has happened to enough people here that there must be some manufacturing fault in some of them; I thought it was only earlier 2020-ish ones that were affected but if that one is from June 2021 and is still affected that is more concerning.

For all you that've had that issue, what's the date of manufacture and trim level of the car?

 

Mines a Design. May 2021 build date. 

[flash22]

There is no clutch, the damper is a spring-loaded plate to dampen the torque from jolting the input shaft it is bolted to the fly/flex plate

I wonder if it's an issue with the 3-cylinder engine, as it doesn't have a balance shaft - with the vibrations causing an imbalance

example of the damper "clutch"

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/383659415757

[TonyHSD]

18 hours ago, vanilla.coffee said:

Mine has done exactly this today. 
Accelerating away from a junction, engine revs suddenly rapidly rise as if a clutch has started slipping and then a loss of power and multiple fail messages in the cluster. 
Now has a permanent message Hybrid system malfunction. 
Mine has done just over 5k miles, purchased new in June 2021. 
Booked in for investigation next week. 

Have you pushed the accelerator to the floor when this happened?
You can buy a Carista obd 2 reader and check the fault codes by yourself, reset and delete, or just check and share with us. Similar thing happened to me on old Auris hybrid few weeks ago, I did run diagnostic myself and found P3147 but no other codes, which makes me think was an softer glitch or something mechanical however did checked the car and found nothing broken, after I had reset the error the car drives as usual and nothing strange or any problems afterwards 🤞🙂 

[charlbal]

On 8/27/2021 at 4:17 PM, TonyHSD said:

I am not aware of any issues with egr components on latest Toyota hybrids in Uk . I had been servicing older gen 3 models and know the egr system which is almost the same as the new ones and except carbon build up there was nothing damaged and all that needed was cleaning at around 100k miles. These latest cars are still very new to have anything similar caused, the egr system has only exhaust gases passing through, not sure if different chemicals in the fuel can change the egr operation to cause damage, also in Uk we are about to get this mew E10 petrol if this is what you mean, but the difference there is the ethanol content, I have seen a video from Italy with really badly sound 2.0 df engine and it’s scary. Here it is and it’s from Italy 

 

Seems the issue here, the misfiring and knocking was found to be a bad connection to one of the coils (bobina) "c'era un cavo bobina che non faceva contatto, altro che benzina sporca."  This is a comment I found by the author on youtube.

[RickyC]

Really strange that a defective coil caould cause a similar issue.   I expect that engine ecu would immediately stop the engine if finds that a coil is no more working instead of transforming it in an vintage diesel one.

Relating to EGR issue in Italy I often read of new cases.  What fails is is not the EGR valve but the EGR cooler.  This component is water cooled ( uses the same cooling circuit of ICE ) and chlorine ( thra what Toyota IT staes ) slowly corrodes cooler walls causing cooling fluid to enter in the exaust gas circuit. 

I think that a similar issue affected BMW designed diesel engines and Toyota recalled them to change the EGR group.

 

[Nixy]

Since I had this EGR problem last June, the car is working like a dream. So be encouraged. What I don't like at all is the engine noise when it comes on suddenly and sounds like a diesel, especially when stopped at the traffic lights noiseless and then the engine starts. It's a startling experience to say the least. In fact I believe there are 2 noises, one from the valve injection system and another from the direct one? Correct me if wrong. 

[Stopeter44]

7 minutes ago, Nixy said:

In fact I believe there are 2 noises, one from the valve injection system and another from the direct one? Correct me if wrong

I believe the hybrid only has the port injection.

[Cyker]

I also believe that is the case. Funnily enough, the non-hybrid version of the engine apparently only has direct injection!

[TonyHSD]

Hybrids are usually noisier than non hybrid equivalent engine because of the different cycles they operate and depends on if it’s starting to pull the car , to charge the Battery or to heat up itself ready to work or to provide heating into the cabin and all in between, add that is a 3 cylinder engine and has own specific voice 😉 and here we have a noisier car, I usually like how it’s sounds from the outside, never heard from inside though. 

[RickyC]

4 hours ago, Nixy said:

Since I had this EGR problem last June, the car is working like a dream. So be encouraged. What I don't like at all is the engine noise when it comes on suddenly and sounds like a diesel, especially when stopped at the traffic lights noiseless and then the engine starts. It's a startling experience to say the least. In fact I believe there are 2 noises, one from the valve injection system and another from the direct one? Correct me if wrong. 

Luckily in your case Toyota has changed the EGR group in warranty.  In Italy they're refusing the warranty because, only looking some picture remotely, they assume that the problem was caused by clorine or some other pollutant in the gasoline.  So they charge you around 1500 ( but on RAV you can reach also 3000 ) euros to replace the EGR group.

Probably it's true that in some fuel station you can get polluted gasoline, but other manufacturers have changed the EGR group on warranty. 

Moreover, reading the complaints on forums, usually the involved users buy gasoline on big fuel stations, so if the fuel is polluted it should impact a lot of cars.  

But the issue seems to involve seriously mainly Toyota cars equipped with the new engines.  So it's possible that the EGR cooler is not too much resistant to pollutants, due to the desgn or to cost saving policies.

[Nixy]

 It's really a shame that Toyota Italy refused to fix the EGR problem free of charge. Note that Toyota Greece is a wholly owned subsidiary of the UK Inchcape group. Maybe that's the difference in attitude and service. 

[TonyHSD]

2 hours ago, Nixy said:

 It's really a shame that Toyota Italy refused to fix the EGR problem free of charge. Note that Toyota Greece is a wholly owned subsidiary of the UK Inchcape group. Maybe that's the difference in attitude and service. 

Thanks for sharing that information, more I learn about dealers more I think that every car manufacturer should follow Tesla and sell their cars directly to the customers, because currently consumers are buying cars from official dealers thinking  they represent the manufacturer name (brand) but seems like not exactly and many are simply not much different than a used car sales garage which are the biggest hit and miss. 

For the egr cooler problem if it’s caused by fuel quality and acidic gasses as bio product of the combustion then petrol stations should be responsible for repair,  it strangely this had never happened before and I believe the egr coolers are quality parts hand made in Japan by people who take pride of what they do, often even small artisan manufacturers supply big producers like Toyota. While cleaning my egr I had a chance to look at it properly inside out and believe me it does look well made indeed. 

[scar]

My original post (page 1 & 2) I think was in response to Satsuki’s problem.

The elusive noise was finally heard by the top Toyota technician at the branch. They have failed to find the source and despite a request at the 1st service failed to rectify the issue. In fact the service manager has given up replying to emails from me.

Since the dealership was acquired by stoneacre the level of customer service has dropped a lot. My wife who uses the car mostly is rather disappointed with the quality of some of the materials used in the cabin, and we can see wear issues already.  We have been looking at other manufacturers hybrid models and in the next 2 weeks should have a deal in place.

To balance out this post the Yaris has many good points, excellent mpg, handling are amongst them. But my dealings with the local stonearce franchise is most certainly negative.

My RAV4 hybrid 2020, was without fault thankfully. But even the PDI on that car was very poor. This car has now gone to one of the big “ we buy your car” type organisations for a very good price. 
 

Dealership experience is a big part of ownership and I shall be sad to cut my association with Toyota. I bought my first Toyota in 1990 a carina and since then have had far too many 😊 of their cars RAV4 ( x4) MR2 ( x 3) Yaris ( x3) Aygo (x1) 

It seems my time on this forum will be ending shortly , it has been an excellent source of information and members willing to help each other out.

 

Steve

[Cyker]

Same here; The car is great but dealer experience has just sucked.

 

[flash22]

It is not just Toyota, aftersales and service are dire in a lot of dealers, currently on my 4th attempt to get the Airbag recall done

A case of once they have your money, that's it

[Cyker]

To be fair, even before they had my money they were terrible! At least they're consistent I guess...  

[Nixy]

The good news is that Toyota UK will start selling cars direct to the public very soon and will use an Amazon platform. Just read it today. 

[FROSTYBALLS]

18 minutes ago, Nixy said:

The good news is that Toyota UK will start selling cars direct to the public very soon and will use an amazon platform. 

You can already buy a Toyota online from Toyota GB - https://www.toyota.co.uk/buy-online

Toyota GB have their parts and accessories available on Amazon and eBay - 

 

[Cyker]

The problem is the dealer is still involved for the final delivery/PDI/collection, or do they deliver to your door now??

It also removes the ability to haggle and the PX quotations are abysmal...

[TonyHSD]

17 minutes ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

You can already buy a Toyota online from Toyota GB - https://www.toyota.co.uk/buy-online

Toyota GB have their parts and accessories available on Amazon and eBay - 

 

That’s right. 👍 I had my first order delivered the other day directly from Toyota uk with invoice address Surrey where their head office is located. eBay some codes also helped. If they can list more parts will be even better. 

[Graham47]

36 minutes ago, Cyker said:

……….and the PX quotations are abysmal...

That’s not my experience.  The figure I’ve been given is several ‘000s better than my dealer could quote.  A figure which was also matched by Autotrader and Honda online.

Also, I believe, you can choose which dealer you want to do the delivery.

[Cyker]

Huh, interesting... I got quoted something like £4-500 for my Mk2 in PX via the website (IIRC); Got £2000 for it through the dealer (Although this was on the scrappage scheme so maybe not a fair comparison)

[Mikw]

My dealer has been decent so far, Farmer and Carlyle. They've just been taken over by Vertu (i think that's the right name) so time will tell.....

[Cyker]

Hopefully they'll stay good! I wouldn't wish my dealers on anyone