Toyota Auris 1.6 132HP and LPG

[olsi20]

General discussion about LPG experience. Any experience with LPG and Toyota Valvematic petrol engines?

[TonyHSD]

Hi,

you can check Avensis posts, there are some information threads for 1.8 petrol which is similar. In Uk not very popular lpg on small engine cars. 👍

[gezhenry]

I've converted my 1.8vvti (140hp 1zzfe engine but not valvematic) last year and it seems to run v well I've looked into this with other previous owners with the same engine with pretty good reports over reasonable mileage s on this engine before I did it.

There are pro's and con's of it, the biggest +ve being that equivalent mpg can go right up, it's quite hard to work out and it's only early but I reckon I could be getting equivalent 70mpg+ now.

Is this something you're considering, and whereabouts do you live cos it can be a factor now if you don't live in a city.

There is a specific lpg forum that's v good.

[1.8 hybrid]

many years ago i had an lpg conversion on a 1.8ltr petrol engine

it was the worst thing i had done in my motoring life,

it cost me £1900 and my mpg went from 33mpg on petrol to 21mpg on Lpg

the only way i found it was economical is on a long journey, i drove from the Wirral to

south devon for £8 but for round town and daily commuting its really awful

i wouldn't advise anyone to have the change in fuel.

[BigRedSwitch]

I thought one of the selling points of an LPG conversion was that you could also use regular petrol, if needs be.  A simple y-connection from the two fuel sources to the fuel pump with a switch controlling the source to be used. 

[furtula]

The only issue with LPG is the cold starts in winter. That's why the cars who have sequential systems now, automatically start on petrol, once the car warms up, they switch to gasoline. You could also start on LPG if you have some switch to tell the car to do so, if it's 0C or warmer, it should work ok, when going to minus, it gets much harder.

If you do a bunch of short trips and you have sequential system, which more or less all cars use now, they you wont be saving that much money in the winter time. I don't know about Auris, but some cars have issues with valves and LPG, as they use the gasoline as lubrication. So once the conversion is done, and if this is the case, they install some kind of lubrication system with a special tank, where you need to top up the oil from time to time to.

My brother has his 4th car on LPG, driving on LPG like 90% from 2005, and never had any engine related issues (older and newer cars, 4 different brands).

I would have one too, except where i live, there are too many regular controls for it which you need to pay for, and i don't drive that often, so not really worth to get it installed.

 

[olsi20]

Well, i am driving my Auris the last 25.000km with LPG. The cost of the kit was around 400 pounds for Stag model (cost in Albania). The cost for 100km with petrol is around 8lit x 1.25 euro = 10 euro/km while with LPG for the same distance 10lit x 0.37 euro = 3.7 euro/km. Regarding economy it is obvious the difference. 

My concern is for Valvematic engines because i have a P1047 error which mean Faulty Valvematic. I am suspicious, since LPG the first thing may in long run  damage are the valves and Also valvematic controls the (intake) valves i wonder if there is any connection with my Faulty Valvematic Lift and LPG. From the info i found in some forums it seems to be No connection but i opened the topic just someone has experience. 

Generally with 25.000 km with LPG (except Valvematic Lift) i am totally satisfied. No other issues with the car. I found some info that VVTi engines runs fine with LPG but with Valvematic Lift did not find any empirical information.  

[Parts-King]

Toyota do not recommend LPG for use on ANY engine, vehicles with shimmed valve clearances suffer worse as the valve seats become worn and burnt. Running cars on LPG long term will have a detrimental effect on the longevity of a modern engine 

[furtula]

32 minutes ago, olsi20 said:

My concern is for Valvematic engines because i have a P1047 error which mean Faulty Valvematic. I am suspicious, since LPG the first thing may in long run  damage are the valves and Also valvematic controls the (intake) valves i wonder if there is any connection with my Faulty Valvematic Lift and LPG. From the info i found in some forums it seems to be No connection but i opened the topic just someone has experience. 

Valvematic issue is sadly common for the Auris, i think they fixed it from 2013  onwards. LPG might, or might not contribute to the fault, but then again, it's a common fault for the early valvematic engines.

I do understand what Kingo wants to say, the cars were builts for petrol, just like old  diesels were builts for diesel, but you have people driving them on frying oil, or heating oil, and some claim cars run fine, others i presume end in a scrap pile.  It's just a personal risk. Issue with valve seats is pretty well known, that's why people install valve lubrication kits to try to remedy the issue.

[TonyHSD]

Conclusion: 

lpg worth it when you are doing a lots of miles,

after you had covered some miles through the years the engine is worn out, high cost repair. 
Should you convert?., well up to the owner, I personally won’t even though I have seen few gen 3 hybrids in Uk converted. 

[olsi20]

40 minutes ago, furtula said:

Valvematic issue is sadly common for the Auris, i think they fixed it from 2013  onwards. LPG might, or might not contribute to the fault, but then again, it's a common fault for the early valvematic engines.

I do understand what Kingo wants to say, the cars were builts for petrol, just like old  diesels were builts for diesel, but you have people driving them on frying oil, or heating oil, and some claim cars run fine, others i presume end in a scrap pile.  It's just a personal risk. Issue with valve seats is pretty well known, that's why people install valve lubrication kits to try to remedy the issue.

Well i dont think the issue is fixed with the Valvematic Lift, mine has a part number 222A037013 and now toyota sell the part with 222A037025 which mean 12 different parts. And No recall for the problem. 

I think i belong to the owners who drive a lot ... 25.000 km since May 2020. I converted the car after many examples of people who use LPG for more than 4-5 years and more than 200.000 km LPG use. I took the risk knowing the possibility that will face valve problems but got surprised with Valvematic Lift. 

 

[1.8 hybrid]

14 hours ago, BigRedSwitch said:

I thought one of the selling points of an LPG conversion was that you could also use regular petrol, if needs be.  A simple y-connection from the two fuel sources to the fuel pump with a switch controlling the source to be used. 

you have to use petrol as the car will always start on petrol and then switch over

to Lpg when the car has warmed up if not the gas regulator can / will freeze and

stop the lpg fuel flow,i believe spark plugs dont last as long on lpg as the cylinder

is a dry enviroment as opposed to a wet petrol enviroment so the plugs have to

work harder on lpg, i found accelleration wasn't as good on lpg and i often switched

back to petrol to have the get up and go i wanted, dont forget you need to have a

pressure test certificate for the Lpg tank and this is valid for 10 years you'll then

need to have the tank replaced or re certified.

[gezhenry]

I don't think the recommendation against using Lpg in petrol engines is surprising or isolated. I'm not sure about the valvematic engine's, but Toyota's I think have softer valve seats, and aren't as easily adjusted. However valve seat wear can be mitigated against by several means and running Lpg can be kinder to engines in some ways as it burns as a cleaner fuel.

You would have to weigh up the costs/benefits with regards your particular car and engine whether the chance/likelihood of engine wear over the time and mileage you do as opposed to the cost of remedy and value of your vehicle over the savings.

You can mitigate in several ways against long-term engine damage tho.

Running Lpg can still uncover large savings, however, it would depend upon the system being set-up well, cost and availability of Lpg in your local area, or where you'll use your car, the sort of journeys you take as it doesn't kick in straightaway until warm on modern systems, and obviously the cost of conversion, you'll have to cover quite a few miles in that car before re-couping a 1-2k conversion.

However, it can still be a really good thing under certain provisos, I use it on an older (classicish) car to still get good modern day mpg.

[1.8 hybrid]

there is no Y connector for the 2 fuels

instead you have the inlet manifold drilled and tapped

and a new set of gas injectors are fitted, the 2 fuel systems

are then completely independant of one another

if you buy a 50ltr gas tank you will probably only be able to

fill up with 40ltrs to allow for expansion of the gas so you may have

to have a large tank to get the range you want and lose a lot of boot space