Terrible Tyres

[TonyHSD]

4 hours ago, Tomfromfife said:

I changed the Dunlop Grandtreks on my new RAV4 Hybrid to Michelin Cross Climates. Excellent tyres. Also changed my wife’s Lexus to Michelin Cross Climates. Excellent wet grip and comfort.

Thanks for sharing experience. How quiet are they on motorways? I am thinking of eventual purchase of cross climates when my summer and winter sets are gone. 

[ACameron]

3 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

Thanks for sharing experience. How quiet are they on motorways? I am thinking of eventual purchase of cross climates when my summer and winter sets are gone. 

Can't say how the Michelin Cross Climates will perform on your Toyota, but I had them on my Volvo V40 prior to me changing to a Corolla HB/TS last week. Not much difference sound wise from the Michelin Primacy 3's.

 On the Volvo they where great, but during warmer weather ( +22c )you do feel it a bit soft, but living in Scotland that doesn't happen too often!...... The first winter I had them fitted it was the winter of the beast from the east! ... snow up to the sills...& they performed brilliantly.... although the V40 was only 2wd I was passing various 4x4's  stuck in the snow on hills etc. Immediately fitted them to the wife's audi a3. I will be changing to them on the Corolla HB/TS before this winter. 

[TonyHSD]

1 hour ago, ACameron said:

Can't say how the Michelin Cross Climates will perform on your Toyota, but I had them on my Volvo V40 prior to me changing to a Corolla HB/TS last week. Not much difference sound wise from the Michelin Primacy 3's.

 On the Volvo they where great, but during warmer weather ( +22c )you do feel it a bit soft, but living in Scotland that doesn't happen too often!...... The first winter I had them fitted it was the winter of the beast from the east! ... snow up to the sills...& they performed brilliantly.... although the V40 was only 2wd I was passing various 4x4's  stuck in the snow on hills etc. Immediately fitted them to the wife's audi a3. I will be changing to them on the Corolla HB/TS before this winter. 

Thanks for sharing experience 👍

[Biomecanoid]

On 5/27/2021 at 3:05 PM, PaulDM said:

Having had a number of squiriily moments and a lot of wheel spins, I have finally given up on the tyres supplied with my 2019 Prius. The tyres actually feel dangerous at speed on wet roads They have done less than 14k miles and are still at 7mm tread. Before anyone asks , yes they are inflated to the correct pressure.

Has anyone else had bad experiences with the Dunlop Enasave EC300+ 195/65r15 91H ?

I’m swapping these for Dunlop BluResponse in the same size. 
These I had on my 2016 Prius for years with no issues. 

If Dunlop is not working for you, I would not buy the same brand again. Try something else

[MyOpinionIsWorthless]

21 minutes ago, Biomecanoid said:

If Dunlop is not working for you, I would not buy the same brand again. Try something else

You missed the point. I changed to a tyre I trust from previous experience. 

[Biomecanoid]

19 hours ago, PaulDM said:

You missed the point. I changed to a tyre I trust from previous experience. 

I didn't missed a point but if I got a "bad" tyre from a specific brand I would not buy a different model for that brand. Why give them more money if I had a bad experience ?

[FROSTYBALLS]

19 hours ago, Biomecanoid said:

If Dunlop is not working for you, I would not buy the same brand again. Try something else

 

19 hours ago, PaulDM said:

You missed the point. I changed to a tyre I trust from previous experience. 

The Dunlop brand is owned by two manufacturers - for Asia, Sumitomo and for Europe, Goodyear. However, some manufacturers fit the Sumitomo made Dunlops as original equipment on their Japanese made vehicles which are destined for the European market. 

Goodyear don't list the Enasave tyre on their Dunlop.eu website, so presumably that tyre is made by Sumitomo and was OE on the Prius when new.

A similar situation occurred with early examples of the current Rav 4, where Sumitomo made tyres were OE, weren't readily available in Europe, and the Goodyear Dunlop equivalent was a different tyre.

[MyOpinionIsWorthless]

Yup

Exactly

4 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

The Dunlop brand is owned by two manufacturers - for Asia, Sumitomo and for Europe, Goodyear. However, some manufacturers fit the Sumitomo made Dunlops as original equipment on their Japanese made vehicles which are destined for the European market. 

Goodyear don't list the Enasave tyre on their Dunlop.eu website, so presumably that tyre is made by Sumitomo and was OE on the Prius when new.

A similar situation occurred with early examples of the current Rav 4, where Sumitomo made tyres were OE, weren't readily available in Europe, and the Goodyear Dunlop equivalent was a different tyre.

 

[Ten Ninety]

As usual, this thread proves that nobody (including me) can be trusted to offer any advice on tyres, as every car will respond differently to a particular tyre and we as drivers have our own particular preferences and priorities.

I have recently switched from the OEM Bridgestone Ecopias to the Dunlop Sport Bluresponse on the PHV. I don't think I've ever changed tyres and experienced such a noticeable improvement in road noise. After 1000 miles they're scrubbed in and not quite as amazing, but they remain particularly good on poor surfaces. Very impressive, and it's narrowed the noise gap considerably between the Prius and the GS.

Unfortunately, the Dunlops have had a disappointingly negative impact on fuel economy. I was expecting some kind of hit here but it's worse than I thought it might be - I've actually lost around 5 miles of summer electric range and my warm-day commute average (over ~65 miles) has dropped from achieving a consistent 199+mpg to being lucky to exceed 150mpg. Obviously at these rarefied heights the impact of all factors is magnified compared to a Prius ordinaire doing 70-80mpg, but even at that level I imagine it would be noticeable to anyone paying real attention i.e. sad old gits like me who enjoy squeezing every last mile out of the gallon or kilowatt hour.

I'm really happy with the noise improvement, but knowing that I'll now never be able to beat my personal best for efficiency is taking the shine off things somewhat.

As for 'handling', I'm sure the Dunlops are considerably better in this respect. However, I rather liked the Bridgestones' total inability to grip in a straight line or around corners. It reminded me that if I was troubling the tyres, I was probably driving the car wrong. 😄

[Cyker]

If they're not low-profile tyres, you can try adding, say, 3-4 PSI to the tyre and see if that gets you some mpg back - That's the poor man's LRR tyre :P

I'm glad you were finding the Ecopia's loud; It's not just me! - I was a bit disappointed how much road noise the Mk4 has - People keep saying hybrids are quiet but mine is anything but at any kind of speed! Will hopefully be swapping these ridiculous 17's to 15's and Hankook VP3's next week so I hope I get similar improvements to road noise that you've experienced!

 

[TonyHSD]

Wheel size although make affect on tyre noise the biggest difference comes from the tyre rubber, thread pattern and pressure more than the size and low profile.  I had experience better noise levels from 17” set than a 16” set.. I had try a few new Toyota hybrids with different tyre makes as oem, Yokohama, Bridgestone, Toyo, plus aftermarket Nexen, Goodyear and found out best of all are the Goodyear efficient grip performance, then Yokohama, then Nexen. The problem with low profile tyres is that often they come in HP and UHP variants and those types are always noisier than touring tyres, which actually are the most comfortable and seats between HP and LRR tyres as performance and efficiency. I am rolling on Goodyear’s now and my Auris is ultra quiet, even I can hear the wind noise created by the wipers, I had recently changed my wipers aero twin to classic ones and these make wind noise, will go back to Aeros next time. 👍👌🚗

[MyOpinionIsWorthless]

On 6/20/2021 at 3:53 PM, Ten Ninety said:

As usual, this thread proves that nobody (including me) can be trusted to offer any advice on tyres, as every car will respond differently to a particular tyre and we as drivers have our own particular preferences and priorities.

I have recently switched from the OEM Bridgestone Ecopias to the Dunlop Sport Bluresponse on the PHV. I don't think I've ever changed tyres and experienced such a noticeable improvement in road noise. After 1000 miles they're scrubbed in and not quite as amazing, but they remain particularly good on poor surfaces. Very impressive, and it's narrowed the noise gap considerably between the Prius and the GS.

Unfortunately, the Dunlops have had a disappointingly negative impact on fuel economy. I was expecting some kind of hit here but it's worse than I thought it might be - I've actually lost around 5 miles of summer electric range and my warm-day commute average (over ~65 miles) has dropped from achieving a consistent 199+mpg to being lucky to exceed 150mpg. Obviously at these rarefied heights the impact of all factors is magnified compared to a Prius ordinaire doing 70-80mpg, but even at that level I imagine it would be noticeable to anyone paying real attention i.e. sad old gits like me who enjoy squeezing every last mile out of the gallon or kilowatt hour.

I'm really happy with the noise improvement, but knowing that I'll now never be able to beat my personal best for efficiency is taking the shine off things somewhat.

As for 'handling', I'm sure the Dunlops are considerably better in this respect. However, I rather liked the Bridgestones' total inability to grip in a straight line or around corners. It reminded me that if I was troubling the tyres, I was probably driving the car wrong. 😄

Well my original post was voiced as a “I’m experiencing this - and this is what I’m doing about it” As Frosty has said the tyres were not really for our market - draw from that what you wish. I think sitting on my drive during lockdown was also a contributor to their performance. As an aside I didn’t see a tremendous drop in mpg. And yes I also miss the odd “torque steer” moment 🙂

[Phil T]

I had OEM Toyos “Poxes” on the phv and they spun up in the dry! The wet was like driving on ice, so at 7000 miles (hardly any wear) I fitted Goodyear Vector 4. They grip in all conditions, economical, quiet, and cheap, what a revelation. I thought Toyota would fit at least decent tyres on their cars, never thought to check before but I will in future.

[MyOpinionIsWorthless]

5 hours ago, Phil T said:

I had OEM Toyos “Poxes” on the phv and they spun up in the dry! The wet was like driving on ice, so at 7000 miles (hardly any wear) I fitted Goodyear Vector 4. They grip in all conditions, economical, quiet, and cheap, what a revelation. I thought Toyota would fit at least decent tyres on their cars, never thought to check before but I will in future.

I also always thought, with all its electronic aids, it was quite difficult to wheelspin a Prius 🙂 apparently not if the tyres are ….

[TonyHSD]

Some facts about the tyres.
Recently noticed how tyres gets hot while driving on motorways, did measurements the other day and all tyres were around 35C° after a 70 mile trip, interestingly the all 4 brake discs were similar temperature, even after a long moderate to hard deceleration on the exit ramp . One more interesting thing I did wipe the tyres and got a black rubber dust on my fingers, that’s similar to diesel particulate matter that you  can get from diesel cars exhaust, especially the older once, which means IMO the way towards cleaner air is not only alternative fuel cars but less cars in general. , at least ours together with EV’s produce less brake dust. 👍®

[Cyker]

Oooh I forgot about this thread; Well, a report of the change from 17s to 15s if anyone's interested!

Had OEM 205/45R17 Bridgestone Ecopias (Performed well, but NVH and bump absorption horrible), changed to 185/65R15 Hankook Kinergy Eco2s (They were supposed to be Ventus Prime 3's but... dealers 'eh).

They have literally transformed the car! It's sooooo much quieter! And the ride comfort is much better too. MPGs seem about 1-2 better on average but TBH I've not had the car long enough for a good comparison and that's small enough to be within margin of error.

It's also a lot more relaxing to drive knowing that if I fail to dodge a pothole I won't have to worry about the rim getting damaged or my spine being compacted!

[Catlover]

I agree with cyker, 15" all the way for me. Our Auris has 17", the wife had to drive me to hospital a few weeks ago and it didnt help my situation with all the speed bumps and pot hoes she didnt or couldnt dodge. It was a painful journey.              

When I was buying the Prius it was going to be "used" and I wanted the Excel which I knew came with 17" as standard. Very surprised that I managed to find one, and in the hypersonic red I wanted, and only 100miles away in a Toyota dealer. The 17" do look nice but first choice was 15". Tyres are cheaper too.

[TonyHSD]

Agreed, smaller wheels are way better than bigger ones with low profile tyres. I did myself conversion too from 17” to 16” on Auris and the ride has changed, fuel consumption perhaps not or not enough to warrant the change itself, but the tyres prices, the ride quality and the ability to keep the wheels clean without worrying of kerb them worth the change. Tyre pressures and the correct tyre type according to the season makes big difference too. 

[MyOpinionIsWorthless]

On 7/3/2021 at 3:27 PM, Catlover said:

I agree with cyker, 15" all the way for me. Our Auris has 17", the wife had to drive me to hospital a few weeks ago and it didnt help my situation with all the speed bumps and pot hoes she didnt or couldnt dodge. It was a painful journey.              

When I was buying the Prius it was going to be "used" and I wanted the Excel which I knew came with 17" as standard. Very surprised that I managed to find one, and in the hypersonic red I wanted, and only 100miles away in a Toyota dealer. The 17" do look nice but first choice was 15". Tyres are cheaper too.

Excel 2019 onwards is available with 15 inch (and spare) as an option 

[Cyker]

Ooh you're right - I guess they did listen and decided to target the Prius for maximum economy while keeping the Corolla for 'normal' people.

I also didn't know you could get a Prius with AWD in this country now! 

[Catlover]

1 hour ago, Cyker said:

Ooh you're right - I guess they did listen and decided to target the Prius for maximum economy while keeping the Corolla for 'normal' people.

I also didn't know you could get a Prius with AWD in this country now! 

but the 1.8 Corolla has the same engine and other hybrid stuff as the Prius. The Prius has a lower coefficient of friction then the Auris and Corolla. That helps to make it more fuel efficient.

[PeteB]

3 hours ago, PaulDM said:

Excel 2019 onwards is available with 15 inch (and spare) as an option 

Indeed.  When I got my 2016 Prius Excel, I did order the 15" wheels and got a £400 rebate.  I also chose the no cost option of the spare wheel.

When I bought my 2019 RAV4 Excel, I'd have loved the choice to specify the basic model's 17" wheels instead of the Excel's 18".  More recent RAV4 Excels come with 19" wheels and no spare wheel, I wouldn't want at all, and doesn't seem to have gone down too well with some other member of the RAV4 forums on here.

More and more I find myself wondering not what Toyota UK's decision makers think, I wonder IF they think!

[Chris Dance]

When I bought my Prius I insisted on 15 inch wheels and a skinny spare. Pete B wrote about this at the time of buying my car so it you Pete who I thank for that knowledge. I do not understand why cars are being sold with no spare wheel. My niece was stuck on a dual carriage way in the early hours. The can of gunge supplied instead of a spare was useless. It took ages to get recovery. 

[PeteB]

17 minutes ago, Chris Dance said:

... so it you Pete who I thank for that knowledge. I do not understand why cars are being sold with no spare wheel...

Glad it helped.

An AA man once told me no end of people had no idea their car didn't have a spare wheel until they had a flat tyre!

I've heard a number of stories of people waiting ages late evening in bad weather for recovery, in one case after being delivered home spent more on taxis to & from the nearest tyre shop get a new tyre than the cost of the tyre.

[BhxTrev]

1 hour ago, Chris Dance said:

When I bought my Prius I insisted on 15 inch wheels and a skinny spare. Pete B wrote about this at the time of buying my car so it you Pete who I thank for that knowledge. I do not understand why cars are being sold with no spare wheel. My niece was stuck on a dual carriage way in the early hours. The can of gunge supplied instead of a spare was useless. It took ages to get recovery. 

Chris you’re spot on there. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but whatever I buy will have a spare wheel even if I have to buy one to put in the boot. My Gen 3 had a spare wheel but when I swapped it for the Gen 4 Prius I chose 17inch wheels missing the fact there was no spare. Never again mate. Next time if the car hasn’t got a spare or there’s no way I can put a spare wheel in the boot, I simply am not buying the car. In fact it’ll be the first question I ask when I want to change my car.

I hope both Toyota & other car manufacturers are reading this because I’m sure there are plenty of people out there want a car with a spare & when you think people Shell out £30,000+ for a new car these days, not providing a spare is nothing short of pathetic penny pinching!