Different 'grades' of Corolla

[AndrueC]

1 hour ago, Biomecanoid said:

What are the advantages of an automatic transmission in a non hybrid car offered both in auto and manual apart from compensating for people that can't be bothered to shift ?

Talk about pre-historic, lol!

The advantage is handing off a menial task to a computer which when equipped with a good box will do the job better than the human can, thus freeing up a bit more of the human's mental capacity for the more difficult job of driving the car. Manual gear boxes are last century and thankfully now going out of fashion. They should join the long list of automotive features that have been left on the scrap heap of history. One of the best things about the EV future is removing the need for humans to waste their time moving a silly stick around. Even the most determined of luddites will have no choice but to give up their manual gear shifting. Hands can now remain on the wheel, brains can now concentrate more on the road and what's going on around them.

Old auto boxes had issues with hunting and upshifting inappropriately but CVTs do not have this problem. A CVT equipped car will always either be in a better gear ratio than a manual or the same one. They do a better job on the public highway and (as has been proven) on a race track. And actually having driven a modern 'conventional' auto I can say that computer control appears to have mostly fixed selection choices. The one I drove for a few hundred miles occasionally shifted down when I lifted off going round a roundabout but only a few times. I think modern gear boxes finally understand about engine braking so are less likely to change gear when you are decelerating.

[Catlover]

Chris, it is obvious you like manual gearboxes. Until 2017, when I was 70 and been driving a looong time, I had never owned a auto, and only drive 1 and that was when I visited my brother in USA (that was 1974). Then in the summer of 2017 I bought my first hybrid, a 2010 Auris hybrid that the wife now drives. I loved the car, but really wanted a Prius, so I bought a 2009 Gen3 (same hybrid train as the Auris), loved it so much I wanted a Gen4 Prius and thats what I now got. My love for automatics, no, sorry, Toyota hybrid automatics (e-cvt) is so deep I cant see myself moving off them.  Why?  They are so easy to use, seemless (no gear changing), economic with fuel, and overall part of the so relaxing package Toyota has brought to the market. I can leave cars behind at traffic lights if I want (not very often) because there is no gear changing, just put your foot down and go - and thats in eco mode what I normally use.  Yesterday or the day before, a guy on here took a dealer test drive and one of his comments was "so relaxing to drive", and that is an important factor with driving, being uptight can tire you out and lose concentration. So there are many reasons why I like Toyota hybrids, probably as many reasons why you like manual boxes. We are different, thats ok.

[TonyHSD]

Same as Joe here, no way I am moving away from Toyota hybrids drivetrain except full ev which has the same feeling when driving. Manual gearbox cars are in general more fun to drive as there is more engagement, this is the reason why Yaris GR is manual, but that has also negative sides too as been proven already some owners missed shifted a gear and blown their engines, something  impossible to happen with automatic gearbox. Manual cars are really yesterday, it is good to have some on offer for people who drive very occasionally and really enjoy manual shifting, I do too but no way will pick manual over auto if can only have one car. And if my circumstances change and I have spare £30 k happy to spend on a new car as second car that Yaris GR will be the one because it’s manual, it’s awd and it’s turbo petrol. Born a legend. ✌️ 🚗 

[Biomecanoid]

1 hour ago, AndrueC said:

Talk about pre-historic, lol!

The advantage is handing off a menial task to a computer which when equipped with a good box will do the job better than the human can,

The computer does not know when you want to downshift or upshift it is using algorithms / inputs from the engine and produces likely scenarios, can not shift better than a human because it does not know what you really wanna do ( its not wired to your head ) it just estimates, so there are delays.
The only time a automatic will shift better than a manual it when you are a new driver just learning to drive.

 

thus freeing up a bit more of the human's mental capacity for the more difficult job of driving the car.

Yes I have seen what the freed mental capacity is used on the road, multitasking on the phone :P.  You make it sound like driving is difficult requiring higher mental capacity and we need help in driving a car because its just an overwhelming task.

 

Manual gear boxes are last century and thankfully now going out of fashion.

Old does not mean bad and new does not mean better. It is not a fashion statement

 

They should join the long list of automotive features that have been left on the scrap heap of history. One of the best things about the EV future is removing the need for humans to waste their time moving a silly stick around. Even the most determined of luddites will have no choice but to give up their manual gear shifting.

Electric vehicles are a totally different story, such vehicles don't need a transmission at all because the motor has torque from virtually 0 RPM which is not the case with normal cars.  EVs don't classify as automatics they have no transmission at all. There are cases that even EVs need a transmission but that is for special offroad vehicles where you need a high and low gear for crawling and it is a rarity.

 

Hands can now remain on the wheel, brains can now concentrate more on the road and what's going on around them.

If you drive on the road you know that this is not true

 

Old auto boxes had issues with hunting and upshifting inappropriately but CVTs do not have this problem. A CVT equipped car will always either be in a better gear ratio than a manual or the same one. They do a better job on the public highway and (as has been proven) on a race track.

Who has proven it ? :P

 

And actually having driven a modern 'conventional' auto I can say that computer control appears to have mostly fixed selection choices. The one I drove for a few hundred miles occasionally shifted down when I lifted off going round a roundabout but only a few times. I think modern gear boxes finally understand about engine braking so are less likely to change gear when you are decelerating.

Appears, Think and Likely don't provide much assurance I prefer being in control.

Most of the above sounds like people defending their laziness. It seem as time goes by human generations tend to lose their motor skills. Plus you didn't address the fact that manual cars are cheaper to buy for the same car, Cheaper to repair the gearbox, No computer module to go bad,  They perform better and a lot more fun. 

I guess there are people that like to be chauffeured around with a Tesla butler in the drivers seat :P This is not driving you are just along for the ride.

[Catlover]

Yes, ok

[john p williams]

2 minutes ago, Biomecanoid said:

Most of the above sounds like people defending their laziness. It seem as time goes by human generations tend to lose their motor skills. Plus you didn't address the fact that manual cars are cheaper to buy for the same car, Cheaper to repair the gearbox, No computer module to go bad,  They perform better and a lot more fun. 

I guess there are people that like to be chauffeured around with a Tesla butler in the drivers seat 😛 This is not driving you are just along for the ride.

How old are you Chris ?

[Biomecanoid]

1 hour ago, Catlover said:

Chris, it is obvious you like manual gearboxes. Until 2017, when I was 70 and been driving a looong time, I had never owned a auto, and only drive 1 and that was when I visited my brother in USA (that was 1974). Then in the summer of 2017 I bought my first hybrid, a 2010 Auris hybrid that the wife now drives. I loved the car, but really wanted a Prius, so I bought a 2009 Gen3 (same hybrid train as the Auris), loved it so much I wanted a Gen4 Prius and thats what I now got. My love for automatics, no, sorry, Toyota hybrid automatics (e-cvt) is so deep I cant see myself moving off them.  Why?  They are so easy to use, seemless (no gear changing), economic with fuel, and overall part of the so relaxing package Toyota has brought to the market. I can leave cars behind at traffic lights if I want (not very often) because there is no gear changing, just put your foot down and go - and thats in eco mode what I normally use.  Yesterday or the day before, a guy on here took a dealer test drive and one of his comments was "so relaxing to drive", and that is an important factor with driving, being uptight can tire you out and lose concentration. So there are many reasons why I like Toyota hybrids, probably as many reasons why you like manual boxes. We are different, thats ok.

Toyota hybrids are by design automatic because of the dual input on the transmission and they are FINE like that.  You can leave cars behind at traffic lights because the electric motor kicks in with the instant torque and you can blow everybody away, its not cause or the transmission.

Toyota Hybrids should be automatic, normal cars benefit from manual transmission.

[Biomecanoid]

2 minutes ago, john p williams said:

How old are you Chris ?

Well it does not matter because if I am old you will say:   He is an old f@rt clinging onto the old days  and if  I am young you will say:  He has not lived long enough to know any better.

There is not escaping criticism.

[FiestaRed]

Sorry folks but this is descending into a Manual v Automatic argument when the original question was about the different grades of Corolla.

[Biomecanoid]

16 minutes ago, FiestaRed said:

Sorry folks but this is descending into a Manual v Automatic argument when the original question was about the different grades of Corolla.

You are right

[Cyker]

The grade thing is a bit annoying - With my Mk4 I actually wanted it in blue with a HUD and a key, but this is an impossible combination!

It's been a criticism with a lot of the current range - The different grades all have things that you can't have on other grades.

On paper I should have gone with the Design spec (Blue, Key, 16" rims) but because I really wanted all the sensors and a HUD due to my driving a Mk1 and Mk2 for so long (I just can't get used to not being able to see the speedo without having to look down and refocus!), I had to go for the Excel, which doesn't have Blue as an option (just shades of grey!), and forces keyless entry, 17" rims (Which honestly are awful on the pothole-ridden urban roads and badly-filled pothole motorways I trundle around!) and the light interior (which is already starting to look bad...).

I wouldn't mind so much if that was the fixed spec, but the sensors and HUD are options so I don't get why those options couldn't be had on the Design-spec, only on the higher grades!

 

I've seen many GR Yaris owners that also don't understand why they can't just get a car with everything on it rather than being forced to choose between the torsen diffs+forged wheels or HUD, sensors, JBL Speakers, etc.

It's not like these things conflict with each other in some way so I and many others really don't understand the reasoning behind it...

 

[Timmon]

On 6/13/2021 at 12:36 PM, FiestaRed said:

WOW!  WOW!  WOW!

I'm sat here wondering why I've been driving manual cars for so long. I had my test drive this morning and was a bit concerned about driving an automatic for the first time. Making it even worse the salesman just gave me the car and said I'll see you in 20 minutes. All I can say is I'm really impressed, not only with the car but how relaxing an automatic is to drive.

My only problem now is having to decide between the 'grades' that are available. It has to be a Sports Tourer and I was originally thinking of the Design grade. Now having seen the GR Sports I can't make my mind up. Any help or views about the differences in two 'grades' would really be appreciated. The dealership did mention the Design was a bit more comfortable.

Glad you enjoyed your test drive!

I always said I would never have an "Automatic", as I have always been one to want to drive a car, rather than have it drive for me, after all, without the need to change gear, what is there to stop you getting bored?

But like you, when I had my test drive of the CVT, I was converted. It is more like taking off in a plane, no jerky spasms of acceleration, just a smooth increase in speed. I had a 2 ltr turbo manual before, but the 2 ltr Hybrid takes off faster than a manual, and keeps on going, so I found that I did not notice the transition to a less powerful car so much as I thought I would.

When we were allowed to travel, I visited friends in Devon, and noticed that I arrived fresher, not exhausted from slipping the clutch and constant gear changes on the M5 in all the tail backs. So you should enjoy your drive more.

My choice was the 2ltr Excel, with panny roof and JBL system. Main reason was because I had my last car 17 years, and it was my first ever new car purchase, so I felt it time to spoil myself! In fact, I don't use many of the extra's, but enjoy the sun roof and sound system.

The Design is a good choice, in my view, only go for the GR Sports if you prefer the cosmetics and Heads Up display.