PHEV specification versus price cut musings

[Flatcoat]

When the price was chopped last year would buyers have preferred less of a price cut in return for a higher spec? I personally would have settled for say £1000 less reduction in return for the full works, ie heated steering wheel, screen, 360 camera and whatever else other markets offer. 

[Lawnmowerman]

I don't know what the bean counters were thinking. Without the large price drop I may not have been attracted to it. 

Given that it knocks every other PHEV out the park on Battery range - was the price so wrong or were sales disappointing? Hence the reaction. For sure, having dropped the price it would be hard to add kit and a price hike now.

 

 

[philip42h]

The fact that Toyota UK don't offer an Excel spec PHEV has always seemed 'odd' - and that would effectively have given you what you might have wanted ... ?

There will always be those who want all the toys more or less regardless of cost, but I suspect that the price cut was reasonably successful for Toyota in increasing demand.

To answer your question differently, if I could have had a Design spec PHEV for more or less the same price that I paid for my HEV Excel with Premium pack, I'd have been torn but would, probably, have gone for the PHEV Design - I've always preferred engineering to toys.

[Flatcoat]

1 minute ago, Lawnmowerman said:

I don't know what the bean counters were thinking. Without the large price drop I may not have been attracted to it. 

Given that it knocks every other PHEV out the park on battery range - was the price so wrong or were sales disappointing? Hence the reaction. For sure, having dropped the price it would be hard to add kit and a price hike now.

 

 

I agree although the competition is rapidly catching up on and overhauling with range improvements. 

[Broadway One]

Hi......yea, really miss several what I thought were staples on my previous HEV but sadly missing on the new PHEV.

I miss the memory powered seat, heated steering wheel, cargo net, sure there is more yet to surface.

Plenty of headroom IMO within the generous price reduction for other self funded USA style goodies.

Barry Wright, Lancashire.  

[Flatcoat]

1 minute ago, philip42h said:

The fact that Toyota UK don't offer an Excel spec PHEV has always seemed 'odd' - and that would effectively have given you what you might have wanted ... ?

There will always be those who want all the toys more or less regardless of cost, but I suspect that the price cut was reasonably successful for Toyota in increasing demand.

To answer your question differently, if I could have had a Design spec PHEV for more or less the same price that I paid for my HEV Excel with Premium pack, I'd have been torn but would, probably, have gone for the PHEV Design - I've always preferred engineering to toys.

That is the crux of the problem. The HEV and PHEV ranges do not align. However I am now at the age I want both! 

[Yugguy1970]

Is the PHEV awd?  I'd pay for that but not for toys.

[HSDish]

34 minutes ago, Yugguy1970 said:

Is the PHEV awd?  I'd pay for that but not for toys.

Yes I think all PHEV are AWD (at least here in Sweden) but Im sure You can get AWD PHEV in UK too

[philip42h]

6 minutes ago, HSDish said:

Yes I think all PHEV are AWD (at least here in Sweden) but Im sure You can get AWD PHEV in UK too

All PHEV are AWD - you can't get a FWD PHEV (anywhere, I think)

[Roger_N]

1 hour ago, philip42h said:

To answer your question differently, if I could have had a Design spec PHEV for more or less the same price that I paid for my HEV Excel with Premium pack, I'd have been torn but would, probably, have gone for the PHEV Design - I've always preferred engineering to toys

You can now, it's cheaper then the Excel AWD plus Premium pack.

[philip42h]

13 minutes ago, Roger_N said:

You can now, it's cheaper then the Excel AWD plus Premium pack.

... and had that been true 18 months ago I could well now be driving a different car. And I wouldn't have missed my heated steering wheel or PVM since I never would have had them - but now ... 😉

[NASY]

I thought the price cut on PHEV RAV4's was to make the PHEV Lexus NX seem like a reasonable deal.

 

[Flatcoat]

8 minutes ago, NASY said:

I thought the price cut on PHEV RAV4's was to make the PHEV Lexus NX seem like a reasonable deal.

 

Quite possibly was. 

[Nick72]

I would have been happy to pay an extra 5k for all the USA gear.

[Cyker]

Maybe we should start a petition to Toyota for Kitchen Sink edition specs  

[Flatcoat]

25 minutes ago, Cyker said:

Maybe we should start a petition to Toyota for Kitchen Sink edition specs  

And they can give it a new name….. maybe Luxury, Luxur, Luxus, I know they could call it Lexus! I do think Toyota are inconsistent and not making it easy to choose a RAV over some competitors. Most car buyers are not remotely interested in the unseen techy stuff and only the bling count of which the RAV has gaps. 

[Cyker]

Toyota tend to bundle a lot of tech as standard compared to other manufacturers (e.g. VW). The complaint we have is specifically with the optional stuff, where you can get one thing but not the other, or stuff available in one market is not available in another because e.g. Toyota UK don't think customers would pay extra for it.

But some of us would, and a kitchen sink model would sell better than I think they think it would as there are plenty of us who're after specific features and if that's the only way to get it we'd get that one.

For instance, if I could pick and choose, my optimal choice would have been a blue Design-spec Mk4 with a HUD and all-around sensors. However, as that isn't a choice, I went with the higher-priced Excel spec Mk4, despite the fact it came with loads of stuff I explicitly did not want (No blue, keyless entry, light-coloured interior, auto-dimming mirror, 17" alloys, just to name a few!).

I think even Lexus have the same problem - A Lexus is basically a Toyota with german-levels of interior quality and fit'n'finish. But you pay a lot more for them. For me, I don't care about any of that - I'm all about function over form, so Lexus is not a great choice for me. Also doesn't help that almost all their cars are now massive land boats which are no use to me!

[Flatcoat]

I agree about the kitchen sink model but the current PHEV Dynamic Premium is a hotch potch. Heated rear seats and HUD but no 360 camera or heated steering wheel to name but a few anomalies. It is difficult to go down the German manufacturers model of optioning everything for a manufacturer importing from the other side of the world. However perhaps 2 or 3 option packs plus a combined all bells and whistles version would better meet customers aspirations. 

[ernieb]

Surely the issue is not that Toyota are not prepared to bundle the ‘kitchen sink’ into the car already, we’ve seen people from different regional locations define exactly that. It’s down to Toyota UK to specify the spec and the price point and traditionally since I can remember buying cars the UK has suffered downgraded specs and significantly higher prices.  If one manufacturer jumped then the rest would follow.

[Flatcoat]

I think it is understood by inference of the thread comments and those elsewhere on the forum that the problem lies with Toyota UK. However you are also correct that historically the UK usually pays more money for less spec, a factor driven by the high company car/fleet sales we have in the UK. 

[Nick72]

It definitely needs the 360 camera. It's a real pain not having it. And a much better reversing camera because that's like watching VHS long play with a dodgy RF lead and an old CRT. 

[Flatcoat]

10 minutes ago, Nick72 said:

It definitely needs the 360 camera. It's a real pain not having it. And a much better reversing camera because that's like watching VHS long play with a dodgy RF lead and an old CRT. 

Agreed although I manage with the camera. My previous car used 2011 technology and was on a par. I also still use my mirrors for reversing, a habit I cannot break! 

[Cyker]

I would also love a 360 degree camera in my Mk4... with such poor visibility it would really benefit from one!!  

(And the top-spec JDM one has it so I know it's possible!!)

[Nick72]

My Merc from a couple of years ago had an amazing high resolution, special ops grade night vision, reversing cam which popped out of a little housing under a lip so it was always automatically cleaned and dry. So I've been spoilt by what was possible on Merc when I got that car about 5 years back. But I'd be happy with something between the two cases of Toyota and Merc. 

Just seems like 15 or 20 year old reversing cam tech on the R4. Wonder what it is like on the BZ4X123456789 whatever it is called EV from Toyota.

[Rav Rob]

Realistically, although they can work well for private owners, PHEVs mainly exist for the company car market due to the drastic BIK tax advantage.

I believe the PHEV price drop was a response to competition from others for this lucrative market.

The Kuga PHEV is only £1300 more than the full hybrid Kuga in ST line trim now. And whilst the RAV PHEV is a superior car in all respects, the old prices made if look very pricey compared to the Ford, enough that people not so picky or car enthuiastic would be happy with the Ford instead.

At the new prices, and with Toyota's superior residual values the lease costs look a lot more competitive.