Electric socket flap................

[Lawnmowerman]

Or in other words - the barn door.

Had finished charging and went to close the flap but it had dropped slightly and fouled the aperture. Lifted it up and it closed ok. Opened it again and there was looseness in the assembly, perhaps a loose screw in the hinge - who knows.

Stopped at the dealership and the Service Manager had a look - he wasn't optimistic about spares availability but it is booked in for next Tuesday. And if it doesn't close will it allow you to drive?

Haven't heard of any reports of this on here - anyone else?

[nlee]

Not sure whereabouts the trigger/sensor is and whether you can simulate it being closed but it won't go into ready mode if it thinks the flap is open. I get a message on the MID display. I guess this is the interlock to stop you driving off with the cable attached.

I have to say, I've thought it feels a bit flimsy and wondered about its longevity being opened and closed more or less daily.

[Lawnmowerman]

Hi kucyk

I won't be laughing if I'm left immobile 😉

 

[ernieb]

10 hours ago, Lawnmowerman said:

Or in other words - the barn door.

Had finished charging and went to close the flap but it had dropped slightly and fouled the aperture. Lifted it up and it closed ok. Opened it again and there was looseness in the assembly, perhaps a loose screw in the hinge - who knows.

Stopped at the dealership and the Service Manager had a look - he wasn't optimistic about spares availability but it is booked in for next Tuesday. And if it doesn't close will it allow you to drive?

Haven't heard of any reports of this on here - anyone else?

That is definitely a proverbial pain in the ****.  As has been said if it does not close properly to trigger the sensor then you will get the 'flap open display' and nothing happens.  It is a massive flap and I'm not sure why it was designed to be so big.

I get frustrated with the flap locking time out when I've opened the car door. Unless you immediately remove the cable the flap re locks.

Just hope you can get it sorted PDQ.

[Lawnmowerman]

Thanks Ernie - fingers crossed 🤞

[Hayzee]

William....will be good to know how they rectify your problem. I must say that if I leave the car charging overnight I often worry about a rogue gust of wind doing damage to that enormous charging point flap. It does seem really flimsy!

[ernieb]

I bought/half fabricated a weather proof cover for mine which magnetically seals over the flap/opening and has a draw tie around the cable. So far there are no marks on the body work and it does a good job of keeping everything dry and protects the flap as the draw toggle pulls the flap and locks it to the cable.

It worked well in the snow, frost and really keeps it dry in the rain.

[Hayzee]

Just unplugged my PHEV and noticed that the flap feels loose and rocks on its hinge. Won't be at all surprised if mine suffers the same fate as William's shortly 🥺

There appears to be a single screw holding it on to the hinge. Can't see it but can feel it. No idea how to tighten it if that is the problem.

Edited June 9, 2022 by Hayzee

[nlee]

Did a trial today out of curiosity. If the flap were to come off, you can press in the plunger to the left hand side of the housing and the car will allow you go into ready mode.

[Lawnmowerman]

Thanks Nigel - good to know (just in case).

[Nick72]

Mine is slightly floppy. So is the hinge on both my flaps.

 

🤣🤣🤣

[Hayzee]

11 hours ago, Nick72 said:

Mine is slightly floppy. So is the hinge on both my flaps.

 

🤣🤣🤣

Floppy flaps are of great concern

[Lawnmowerman]

Update..........

In the dealership today and advised two parts required which are not in UK. 'Phone call from dealer later said parts due July 13th - so suspect coming from Japan. Asked if they were modified - no.

As they need to power down the system to access the assembly they would like the car for a day. Courtesy vehicle will be supplied.

Spoke to the Sales Manager about the new bZthingamyjig and availability suggested as July.

Reckons he would pay £36k for my 8 1/2 month old, 11,500 mile Dynamic PHEV. They are PDI'ing one at the moment so asked to be contacted when I can drive it. Not sure when the embargo is lifted. 

 

[Hayzee]

William.....what did you think of the pex offer?

[Lawnmowerman]

Haven't done due diligence on the price yet Colin.

Too many questions about the spec. of the launch vehicle and what changes/upgrades may follow through after the general public have given their verdict.

e.g. the unpainted plastic - how long will that last? The 11kw charger not immediately available. I'm not usually an early adopter so may want it to settle a bit.

[Nick72]

18 minutes ago, Lawnmowerman said:

Haven't done due diligence on the price yet Colin.

Too many questions about the spec. of the launch vehicle and what changes/upgrades may follow through after the general public have given their verdict.

e.g. the unpainted plastic - how long will that last? The 11kw charger not immediately available. I'm not usually an early adopter so may want it to settle a bit.

Probably a good plan.

[ernieb]

7 hours ago, Nick72 said:

Probably a good plan.

There seems to be so many 'good' reasons to hold off going fully BEV for at least a couple of years.  This has been said many times including me but the infrastructure is just not there.  So many black holes in the charging network, so many variations of account types, poor maintenance and availability.

Also for me there is the problem of a home changer as my incoming mains is relatively low and and an upgraded supply not easy, wrong incoming fuse type. Without at least a 7kW home facility I'd be dead in the water.

Then there are the people who do not have access to a drive/garage or a work based charging system???

[philip42h]

We don't have "home refuelling" for ICE and, by the same token, we don't need home charging for BEV - provided that the recharging infrastructure and 'speed' is in place (which, admittedly, it isn't). Those of us with off street parking may be able to be early adopters; others will be far more reliant on the provision of a proper infrastructure.

As for the 11kW charger, I can't see the point. The majority will be restricted to single phase power and thus 32A / 7kW charging at home for the foreseeable future. So a 6.6kW charger in the car is sufficient and will charge a 70+kWh Battery overnight. Out on the road you'd want much faster DC charging. A 150kW charger will recharge the same 70+kWh Battery in around 30 minutes; faster would be better; 11kW just doesn't cut it (for me).

[nlee]

I thought the BZ4X had the CCS2 charging socket? You can use the same Type 2 plug that the RAV4 uses with up to 7kw on a single phase supply. A home charger on a 3 phase supply will supply 22kw but for some reason, it sounds like the charger on the BZ4X is max 11kw, which seems and odd decision (11kw will give a full charge in around 7 hours rather than 10 hours on 7kw). Sounds like little advantage to get an upgrade to 3-phase, even if it's possible. 

The two additional pins on the CSS socket and plug bypass the AC pins and the on board charger and provide a direct DC current up to 150kw on public chargers, which will will charge from 20% to 80% (recommend charging range for rapid charging) in around 20 mins.

[Lawnmowerman]

12 hours ago, nlee said:

I thought the BZ4X had the CCS2 charging socket? You can use the same Type 2 plug that the RAV4 uses with up to 7kw on a single phase supply. A home charger on a 3 phase supply will supply 22kw but for some reason, it sounds like the charger on the BZ4X is max 11kw, which seems and odd decision (11kw will give a full charge in around 7 hours rather than 10 hours on 7kw). Sounds like little advantage to get an upgrade to 3-phase, even if it's possible. 

The two additional pins on the CSS socket and plug bypass the AC pins and the on board charger and provide a direct DC current up to 150kw on public chargers, which will will charge from 20% to 80% (recommend charging range for rapid charging) in around 20 mins.

Toyota state Maximum Charging Power AC - 150kwh 

I'm not sure the difference between the two  for charging purposes (AC & DC)

[Nick72]

17 hours ago, ernieb said:

There seems to be so many 'good' reasons to hold off going fully BEV for at least a couple of years.  This has been said many times including me but the infrastructure is just not there.  So many black holes in the charging network, so many variations of account types, poor maintenance and availability.

Also for me there is the problem of a home changer as my incoming mains is relatively low and and an upgraded supply not easy, wrong incoming fuse type. Without at least a 7kW home facility I'd be dead in the water.

Then there are the people who do not have access to a drive/garage or a work based charging system???

I could definitely accept the current charging infrastructure deficits with a 370 mile range BEV like the Polestar 3. Overnight charge from the 7.4kW wallbox at home. 

[philip42h]

9 hours ago, Lawnmowerman said:

Toyota state Maximum Charging Power AC - 150kwh 

I'm not sure the difference between the two  for charging purposes (AC & DC)

Clearly ... 😉  🙂

AC (alternative current) is used for home chargers and some legacy slow public charge points. Such 'chargers' include the standard wall socket (2.3kW), the normal single phase home charger (7.4kW) and the three phase charger (22kW) amongst other intermediate powers. The bZ4X includes either a standard 6.6kW onboard charger or an optional 11kW onboard charger. In either case fully charging from a standard wall socket would take around 3 days. With a 7.4kW charger the 6.6kW onboard charger would take 12h45 to fully charge the car; with the 11kW onboard charger this is reduced to 11h30.

With a three phase supply and either an 11kW or 22kW external charger, a car equipped with the 11kW onboard charger would charge fully in 7h45.

The charge rate is limited to the lower capacity of the external charger and the onboard charger.

I guess that anyone who really wanted to charge the bZ4X within an eight-hour overnight window would want the three phase option with the 11kW onboard charger. For most of us, I suspect that the 6.6kW charger and single phase power would do just fine.

DC (direct current) is used at public charging stations and is available with outputs between 50kW and (currently) 350kW. The bZ4x is capable of taking on charge at a rate of 150kW. So with an external charger capable of delivering 150kW or more the car would go from 10% to 80% charge in 32 min. At a 100kW charging station this would rise to 39 min. And at a 50kW charging station it would extend to 70 min.

There are many, many legacy public charging points out there that are pretty much useless - i.e. anything less than 50kW - and I'd consider anything less than 100kW as a last resort. Fortunately, newer public charging stations tend to be greater than 150kW and I don't see stopping for half an hour in every three or four hours driving as too much of an imposition for switching to an EV ... provided, of course, that there is an available and working 150kW charger pretty much where I need one!

[nlee]

I still struggle to see the sense of why Toyota would go for an 11kw onboard charger. If you have a 3 phase supply it will make no difference. If you have a 3 phase supply it won't make a great deal of difference. Why not have the option as a 22kw charger so you could take proper advantage of 3 phase if you wanted. It probably because it's designed with the US in mind where I presume a 3 phase supply is only capable of 11kw(?)

[Hayzee]

Nigel.....3 phase supply isn't limited to 11kw in the USA....but I've been looking at an interesting blog on the speakev.com website.....this explains quite a lot of the issues. The discussion is a UK one

https://www.speakev.com/threads/3-phase-query.166948/

[Cyker]

It is a bit weird... it would have made sense for a 7.4kW charger or 22kWh charger, but what makes 11kWh??

Even in the US, if you were going to hook up 3-phase, I'm sure the installer would use the full 220v and not the weird split-110v

 

On 6/15/2022 at 7:54 AM, philip42h said:

We don't have "home refuelling" for ICE and, by the same token, we don't need home charging for BEV

On the other hand it takes 2 minutes to give my Yaris 500 miles of range, so I think home charging is still very very needed until an EV has that sort of ability. I already resent having to go out of my way to a petrol station every week or two - The idea of having to do it every few days AND be stuck there for half an hour each time is extremely off-putting.

If they put chargers in supermarkets, then at least I'm not wasting my time charging the car as I can do some shopping too, but the idiotic strategy that's been chosen is dedicated charging areas where all you can do is drink overpriced coffee and twiddle your thumbs.

From my point of view, home and/or workplace charging is currently an essential pre-requisite of owning an EV... Without it the experience is just so much worse - You're overcharged for the electricity and it's a colossal waste of your time.

On a long road trip, sure - You'd probably have to stop anyway after 3-400 miles to stretch your legs so that wouldn't be much of an imposition, but on a regular basis? I'd much rather keep my Yaris...

This is the issue - The ownership experience of an EV *has* to be better than that of an ICE if they expect to command that kind of a premium and convince people to get them but, aside from very specific cases, it just isn't yet. That said, one of those cases seems to be "having a gigantic SUV that is only driven short distances in a city" and oh boy people are really rolling with that one down here!   

But hopefully these new fancy batteries will be less vaporware than fusion has been - When that happens it should start a tipping point...

I must confess to be slightly bitter as I highly suspect what I want (A small car that has long range, and not what EV people call long range, but what diesel people call long range!) will likely be the last type of EV made, if at all...!