Driving with the aircon on

[Hornet3D]

Perhaps I am not pushing the car but I have not noticed this when driving my Aygo and I run with the air con/climate Control on most of the time.

[Chris Boddum]

2 hours ago, Hornet3D said:

Perhaps I am not pushing the car but I have not noticed this when driving my Aygo and I run with the air con/climate Control on most of the time.

You don’t feel the power drain when accelerating? Every time I need to accelerate, I feel a distinct power drain and the car slows down for 5-10 seconds until the compressor cycles. It’s my only real gripe with the Aygo, and it just seems how it is. I imagine we should just be glad that we even have AC. If anyone has any good ideas, now is the time to chime in.

[haelewyn]

I heard before that the compressor (?) or just the ventilator is switched off and (soon) back on, intermittent, when the aircon is on. The circumstances then were stop and go traffic.

Now, I went and stood outside after a short drive with an already warm engine. Didn't notice anything changing...

I am under the impression that today, 26* C here and no bright sunshine at 5 PM, the aircon is just managing to cool the interior a bit.  It doesn't go as fast as in other cars I used to have.

No idea if my manual heating system on coldest position is already switching the aircon off and on like in an other car 'ECONOMY' position of driving patterns usually do.
If it is giving max power always now, I fear from summer and real warm temperatures.

[TonyHSD]

23 hours ago, Cyker said:

That sucks  Must be a thing on the newer ones as I swear it wasn't so noticeable on the Mk1 Aygo (I don't think I've driven the Mk2, but have the Mk1 a few times, albeit in its french guises  )

The lower is the power of the engine the more noticeable will be the ac activation and deactivation. I had few different brands small petrol cars with exact same characteristics. Yaris hybrid is the best small car ever, that is powered by petrol. That’s it. I see them everywhere now. , I and like them a lot. If I had an Aygo I would have switch to Yaris without doubt. 

[Cyker]

It wasn't so much the power loss when it engaged that I was talking about, but rather that they were saying they could physically feel it jerk when it engaged and disengaged, which was definitely not a thing on the Mk1's that I drove - When it engaged you could feel you needed to put more pedal in to get the same level of performance, but it just felt like a lag on the engine like if you transition to a hill ascent, not a sudden jerk like they're describing. It's certainly something I've never experienced in any other car with AC!!

It sounds like the clutch material used is too sharp/grippy or something.

(But yeah trade it in for a Yaris Mk4 they're awesome   )

 

[haelewyn]

I could be wrong but i think the jerking is there too even when you don't use the airconditioning.

 

I thought it was due to egr and burning a lean mixture for pollutiob reasons.

Trade it in for a yaris ? I was thinking about trading it in for a Volvo, Dacia or a Mercedes .  Or is that blasphemy ? 😉

[Stivino]

Trade it in for a Mercedes?  Do you think you could live with the downgrade?

[Chris Boddum]

1 hour ago, haelewyn said:

I could be wrong but i think the jerking is there too even when you don't use the airconditioning.

 

I thought it was due to egr and burning a lean mixture for pollutiob reasons.

Trade it in for a yaris ? I was thinking about trading it in for a Volvo, Dacia or a Mercedes .  Or is that blasphemy ? 😉

The aygo will always be a little jerky when going off / coming onto the throttle, we're talking jerks while steadily cruising when the AC compressor is turning on / off. 

I had this idea the other day - there are aftermarket compressors for the Aygo, would any of you imagine that a different and brand new compressor might work differently / more efficient / has a better magnetic clutch than the OEM compressor? While I do like my Aygo, I just feel like there is room for a (lot) of work with the AC system.

[Stivino]

9 minutes ago, Chris Boddum said:

would any of you imagine that a different and brand new compressor might work differently / more efficient / has a better magnetic clutch than the OEM compressor?

Eh, no.

[Chris Boddum]

2 minutes ago, Stivino said:

Eh, no.

I guess we just need to live with it how it is. Better than sweating.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, Cyker said:

It wasn't so much the power loss when it engaged that I was talking about, but rather that they were saying they could physically feel it jerk when it engaged and disengaged, which was definitely not a thing on the Mk1's that I drove - When it engaged you could feel you needed to put more pedal in to get the same level of performance, but it just felt like a lag on the engine like if you transition to a hill ascent, not a sudden jerk like they're describing. It's certainly something I've never experienced in any other car with AC!!

It sounds like the clutch material used is too sharp/grippy or something.

Could it be a wear thing on the AC compressor clutch?

Mk1's are older so the clutch material will have had some age related wear and might engage more smoothly than the newer clutch material on a Mk2?

Personal note - I drove a Mk1 with AC for 10 years and have now driven a Mk2 with AC for 18 months and for me personally there has been no difference in the behaviour when the AC compressor engages or disengages between the two.

[TonyHSD]

It’s not from the clutch but from the engine load. Clutch doesn’t have friction materials to wear, it could become faulty but in rare occasions. The problem is when ac starts the engine is loaded more than usual and ecu reacts to maintain rpm to prevent stalling, there is some latency in the whole process and this is felt by the driver. Larger engines has enough torque at idle or while pulling the car and can’t feel the extra load from the ac compressor. The experiment done by a member with lower gas inside the system and smoother operation simply proof my explanation. Engines are loaded a lot by the alternator, power steering pump and ac. Older cars that have hydraulic power steering, ac and alternator were even worse. It might look strange how can an engine be loaded by something small but remember engine has gearbox that multiply the torque to propel the car while the auxiliary system are directly driven. 👍

[Guest]

2 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

It’s not from the clutch but from the engine load.

So I don't understand why many people are saying the effect of the AC compressor turning on & off on the Mk2 is worse than the Mk1, when my experience is that they are identical? I really cannot tell the difference between my Mk1 & my Mk2.

The worst car I have ever driven for this problem was a Mk4 Ford Escort 1.6 Cabriolet where the surge when the AC compressor disengaged was truly immense!

[TonyHSD]

23 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

So I don't understand why many people are saying the effect of the AC compressor turning on & off on the Mk2 is worse than the Mk1, when my experience is that they are identical? I really cannot tell the difference between my Mk1 & my Mk2.

The worst car I have ever driven for this problem was a Mk4 Ford Escort 1.6 Cabriolet where the surge when the AC compressor disengaged was truly immense!

Perhaps it’s more down to ecu control of the engine speed and load then anything to do with clutch of the ac compressor.   

[Cyker]

The problem is I don't know if the people reporting this are just being oversensitive or if there's actually something not right with their cars! No way to know without actually experiencing it...

[TonyHSD]

2 hours ago, Cyker said:

The problem is I don't know if the people reporting this are just being oversensitive or if there's actually something not right with their cars! No way to know without actually experiencing it...

I think it’s normal and they don’t have issues with their cars. I had experience these behaviours even in a 1.6 petrol cars that are obviously more powerful than baby Aygo but still not that big engines. In 1.8 and above you only can hear the switch and pulse in the rpm but nothing more and nothing as intrusive. 👍

[Guest]

15 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

Perhaps it’s more down to ecu control of the engine speed and load then anything to do with clutch of the ac compressor.   

I've wondered that too, is there any relationship with the different EU emissions classes as they are associated with changes to the ECU and it's calibration/tuning? Plus the latest Aygos use a different variant of the 1KR-FE with dual VVT and multipoint injection.

My Mk1 was EU4 and my Mk2 EU6.2

[haelewyn]

Just did a simple test and I invite those with a rather new Aygo especially to do the same.

I watched the engine as it was running with no aircon. Seems completely normal.

When i switch the aircon on the entire engine is shaking ... never noticed that on any other car.
What about you guys ?   Does it do this in your cars too ?

Relax warranty has been started up in my country. I am normally always going for maintenance to the dealer, so no difference (as long as their prices don't go up too much). My car goes for first maintenance in november.
Will ask them to check if this thing (shaking with aircon on) is normal in their opinion and also will ,ask them to check the clutch cable and if necessary adjust it.

I start to feel the itch to replace altough my Aygo is under 1 year old.
Been looking at articles on improvements on the new Corolla hybrid model year 2023 and it seems they are going the direction I wanted them to go years ago when I had an Auris TS.

Also been looking at some second hand Volvo's but there my warranty will be 1 year while on the Aygo I am getting +9 years longer.
I honestly think the Aygo is a fine car on the highway (esp. at the speeds I am doing) but less nice to drive in the city. Well, I don't live in a city, rather a big town.

Highway is fine with the Aygo, just as long as I don't put the aircon on cause then it doesn't feel right any more cause of lack of power for AC and engine power being reduced too much, higher fuel consumption,...

[Cyker]

That's quite funny, I'd never have thought the Aygo would be considered better on the motorway than in a city  

Going from an Aygo to a 'rolla is quite a jump tho'... You should get a Yaris!   

[haelewyn]

I was thinking of a camry as well 🙂

Better on the highway : i saw car journalists writing this and I agree strongly with them.

The efforts made starting model year 2018 make it drive really nice on the highway if you are not a fast driver.

And it saves you from using the clutch which was only improved now from model year 2022 - aygo X.

[haelewyn]

Forgot to mention it's also rather addictive to have a fuel consumption below 5 liters per 100 km. Not many other cars will do the same and I'm not going to change to a smart electric. 

[Derek.w]

On the 2014 Yaris 1.33 I never noticed any diffrance if aircon was on or off with regards to fuel consumption.

On a 2000 Yaris 1.3 it increased the tickover speed so you noticed it.

[Cyker]

1 hour ago, haelewyn said:

Forgot to mention it's also rather addictive to have a fuel consumption below 5 liters per 100 km. Not many other cars will do the same and I'm not going to change to a smart electric. 

Even more-so when you get to the 3.5-4 in the Yaris...  

(Also someone needs to come up with a better name than "litres per one hundred kilometres"...  mpg is just so much easier to say!!)

 

[haelewyn]

I know.. but if I said I consumed less than 5 mpg, that would make you all jealous and weary.

[Roy124]

Believe me, I got an unbelievable 3.17 lpt going into town yesterday in my Corolla. 

Litres 

Per

Ton (100)

Can we launch a new acronym?  Confuse the ffrench.