Global Recall Notice

[FROSTYBALLS]

Also the person who wrote the article will be as much in the dark about what Toyota and Subaru are doing to fix the issue as anyone else outside of Toyota and Subaru.

No manufacturer will publish details of what they are doing to remedy a recall until the final solution is sorted.

Toyota will be keen to act quickly in the US after  their massive worldwide accelerator pedal and US carpet mat retainer recalls of 2009/2010. 

[AJones]

13 hours ago, fourbanks said:

it's hard to believe that the wheels would fall off, as the nuts used are in the main made in the USA for cars built in Japan and the USA.  The Lexus UX 300E would have had the same nuts, i'm sure? it's also hard to believe that the nuts could come loose on their own unless the Brake rotors nut threads are undersized, and then yes they could come loose under certain driving conditions. 

The BZ4x doesn't use wheel nuts, it doesn't use the typical arrangement of having a rotor with fixed threaded studs with nuts holding the wheels on, it is reported as using a different design, using hub-bolts, where bolts go through the wheel rim and tighten into the hub. The reports are these bolts come loose and then drop out, allowing the wheel to become detached.

It was a new one for me, I've only ever had cars with studs and wheel nuts.

[fourbanks]

13 minutes ago, AJones said:

The BZ4x doesn't use wheel nuts, it doesn't use the typical arrangement of having a rotor with fixed threaded studs with nuts holding the wheels on, it is reported as using a different design, using hub-bolts, where bolts go through the wheel rim and tighten into the hub. The reports are these bolts come loose and then drop out, allowing the wheel to become detached.

It was a new one for me, I've only ever had cars with studs and wheel nuts.

Well, if that's the case and a new arrangement for wheels, then that would be anyone's guess as to what is wrong. The lead engineer will need to explain how he overlooked this, as if that's the case the cars will need to be scrapped as i don't think you would be able to fix that problem without further concerns that would arise from putting in a new wheel assembly like the suspension  

[Stivino]

There's nothing new about using bolts instead of nuts.  

[forkingabout]

21 minutes ago, Stivino said:

There's nothing new about using bolts instead of nuts.  

Exactly, every one of the 8 Peugeot vehicles we have had in the family over the years have used wheel bolts.

I remember the 406 even came with a threaded tool to align / hang the wheel to make mounting it on to the hub easier.

[fourbanks]

1 hour ago, Stivino said:

There's nothing new about using bolts instead of nuts.  

Thanks for enlightening me 🙂 

 

[bZ4X]

I read as muvh as I can about this Bz4X bolt problem. And I believe delay is caused by belows:

1) Toyota might need to redesign the car and may be the base Bz platform. 

2) Toyota will not wnat to face up with second recall. And I strongly beleive that they are testin not only bolts but all other possible individual parts in the car to make sure that car is safe and there wont be any other issue. 

If look at the bright side, yes delay is not something no one wants. But it will be advantage that car will be very reliable and safe. We will see soon the result.

I think, first deliveries will be November in the UK. 

Regards

[Cyker]

Aygo uses bolts rather than studs IIRC.

Prefer studs myself, makes it easier to locate the wheel than just on the centre hub!

 

[fourbanks]

Scotty has just released a clip on this 

 

[Derek.w]

I have just watched the Scotty clip no technical information on why wheels fall off!.

They dont fall off other electric cars regardless of if you using 4 or 5 studs so just to say it down to acceleration and braking excessive forces is rubish.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Just waffle.

[forkingabout]

8 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

Just waffle.

Just clickbait Scotty 

[Nixy]

It's insane this "wheels fall off" saga. Toyoda should fire anyone and all involved "with this part of the project. How could the screw their reputation so badly so easily? 

[Parts-King]

53 minutes ago, Nixy said:

It's insane this "wheels fall off" saga. Toyoda should fire anyone and all involved "with this part of the project. How could the screw their reputation so badly so easily? 

I don't think anyone at the design stage ever thought the wheels would fall off, so firing any staff involved is a typical "shoot from the hip" reaction. Toyota will want to investigate fully, no matter how bad it looks on them. They cannot afford for a quick fix just in case it comes back to haunt them down the line. Yes it looks awful, but better safe than sorry 

[Cyker]

I don't suppose you have any inside info do you?  

I've heard a rumour the problem is probably the hub wasn't torqued down correctly, and the part probably won't need replacing or if it does only minor changes to it, but they're doing a full audit of the entire assembly line and production process to try and find out how it happened in the first place before they resume construction, and that's why it's taking so long...

 

[Yugguy1970]

Hasn't put me off buying a Toyota.

[FROSTYBALLS]

At least Toyota seem to be taking their time and investigating fully.

Not as bad as some manufacturers - eg. VW who had an issue with the Polo between 2018 and 2020, where the centre rear seat belt could come undone under hard braking or cornering. Their proposed solution to the recall, uncovered by Which?, was to use a cable tie to make the buckle more secure - understandably rejected by DVSA.

[Cyker]

26 minutes ago, Yugguy1970 said:

Hasn't put me off buying a Toyota.

Me neither - The stupid backwards thing about all of this is it's, like recalls - You get the press giving Toyota grief because "Yet another recall LOL!" but they don't seem to understand this is a *good* thing.

When you compare it to other manufacturers, who literally won't issue a recall until enough people have actually *died* from the problem, I know who I'd rather go with!!

 

[bZ4X]

2 hours ago, Cyker said:

I don't suppose you have any inside info do you?  

I've heard a rumour the problem is probably the hub wasn't torqued down correctly, and the part probably won't need replacing or if it does only minor changes to it, but they're doing a full audit of the entire assembly line and production process to try and find out how it happened in the first place before they resume construction, and that's why it's taking so long...

It make sense. I believe, they dont want to face another recall and doing deep investigation not only bolt but all production processes. 

Delay is an issue for the people who ordered Bz4X (one of them is me). But eventually, you will make sure that car is safe and reliable. 

[Cyker]

I just wish they'd put out a press statement or something to tell people what's happening if it's something as trivial as this. The silence just makes it seem like there is something catastrophically wrong with the car they're trying to cover up.

 

 

[flash22]

They have in the states offering rebates and buybacks

https://www.autopareri.com/applications/core/interface/file/attachment.php?id=141379&key=02b0739cccccf750ff5b0459d4dda1ef

 

https://www.theverge.com/2022/8/6/23294791/toyota-offering-buy-back-recalled-bz4x-ev

[Cyker]

I think they are required to as IIRC there's some sort of 6 month law in the USA that this has now passed. (Not sure if it's part of the 'lemon law' or something else tho' - IANAL as they say  )

 

 

Edit: That's "I Am Not A Lawyer" just so there's no misunderstanding for some of you  

[rfrancis073]

The first buy backs in the USA are going by 'Lemon Laws' of the state the customer lives in, based on new correspondence from Toyota to the customer.  In other words, they are not invoking the 'Lemon Law' but the terms are the same.  I think it's just a way for Toyota to control the narrative and get out ahead of this before someone actually invokes the LL themselves.  Also, by offering the same terms as the Lemon Law, Toyota knows that it would be pointless for someone to pursue the LL route to get more because the terms are the same.

[forkingabout]

 

[kingrikk]

5 hours ago, Cyker said:

I've heard a rumour the problem is probably the hub wasn't torqued down correctly, and the part probably won't need replacing or if it does only minor changes to it, but they're doing a full audit of the entire assembly line and production process to try and find out how it happened in the first place before they resume construction, and that's why it's taking so long...

I mean this does fit the suggestion that they’ve stopped that line because it’s a line problem. I think there was a consensus that “couldn’t” be the case due to the following wording in the US report:

”Toyota reviewed the production process at the vehicle assembly plant and did not identify any abnormalities on the hub bolt tightening history of these three vehicles. Toyota also reviewed the assembly process of the wheel and hub bolts at the assembly plant and did not identify any abnormalities. …Toyota continued to investigate and conducted a driving test using mass production wheels and hub bolts that were tightened to specification. The testing showed that the hub bolts loosened under certain severe driving patterns.”

I’m not disagreeing with you, I think it’s a likely possibility. Just explaining why random people around Internet forums had discounted it.