2022 RAV4 stolen

[NASY]

Pedro, unless the site was Afghanistan I think the Police are really playing a lousy call. 

[forkingabout]

At the end of the day the Police will see it as an insured vehicle & not a high priority, here's a crime reference number.

The Police are under resourced, they just can't be there for or solve every crime commited.

[ernieb]

9 hours ago, forkingabout said:

 

The Police are under resourced, they just can't be there for or solve every crime commited.

I do wonder sometimes just how much the police are under resourced. Many time I can see road sides where there has been an 'accident' and there are a two or three police cars with 6 or 7 police persons milling about and never being sure what they were all doing.

[forkingabout]

1 hour ago, ernieb said:

I do wonder sometimes just how much the police are under resourced. Many time I can see road sides where there has been an 'accident' and there are a two or three police cars with 6 or 7 police persons milling about and never being sure what they were all doing.

All of them Police or are some Traffic Wombles? 

[ernieb]

1 hour ago, forkingabout said:

All of them Police or are some Traffic Wombles? 

Probably a mixture it's just the money, resources and manpower tied up standing around. In a manufacturing environment you just could not afford the over inefficiency.

[forkingabout]

1 hour ago, ernieb said:

In a manufacturing environment you just could not afford the over inefficiency.

You should look at what goes on in warehousing - sending 10 pickers on llops all to the same aisle at the same time - it's a traffic jam.

Any sensible warehouse picking system would start them at different locations to improve efficiency.

 

[mobi]

Fixing police service is beyond our capability in this thread. 

All we can do is the following.

1. DIY protection to make car less attractive to thieves.
2. Pursue Toyota for a resolution.
3. Buy a different car where this problem is not so acute (if enough people do this #2 above will happen)

[Mixstreme]

What would be the implications of removing the Hybrid Battery saftey plug as a security measure? Ive removed mine from the auris many times when leaving at the airport, without any issues?  if anyone tries to start the car it wont move and just states Hybrid system  malfunction..........    

 

The Plug is easily accesed under drivers side rear seat plastics, from a front facing plastic cover.  not sure about the RAV location of such, but I would assume its easily accesible ......

[ernieb]

9 hours ago, Mixstreme said:

What would be the implications of removing the Hybrid battery saftey plug as a security measure? Ive removed mine from the auris many times when leaving at the airport, without any issues?  if anyone tries to start the car it wont move and just states Hybrid system  malfunction..........    

 

The Plug is easily accesed under drivers side rear seat plastics, from a front facing plastic cover.  not sure about the RAV location of such, but I would assume its easily accesible ......

New one on me, you learn something everyday. Not sure where it's located on the PHEV or the implications of removing it but depending on location, ease of access it might be an option or just a pain to do every day?

[robo1]

Think it’s situated under the rear seat on the RAV like the Auris. Orange plug when pulled out isolates the traction Battery. Assume used by garage and  ? fire and rescue services.  Some concern as whether it’s designed to be pulled out on a daily basis. Likewise pain to remove the plastic cover under the seat to get to it. Perhaps could use at Airport as suggested by Mixstreme

[philip42h]

32 minutes ago, robo1 said:

Think it’s situated under the rear seat on the RAV like the Auris. Orange plug when pulled out isolates the traction battery. Assume used by garage and  ? fire and rescue services.  Some concern as whether it’s designed to be pulled out on a daily basis. Likewise pain to remove the plastic cover under the seat to get to it. 

... and will be in a different place on the PHEV since the batteries are different.

As I understand, it is there to protect the 'mechanic' against high voltage DC shock - so will be positioned as close to the positive terminal of the traction Battery as possible. There's more information in the appropriate "Hybrid Vehicle Dismantling Manual" (HVDM).

[philip42h]

I've been thinking about where one could fit a kill switch if one was so inclined ...

As I understand, the current CANbus exploit simply generates the 'key present' signal so that the thief can open the door, depress the brake pedal and press Start to get the car into Ready mode and then drive away.

And we know that when the brake pedal is depressed, the brake lights come on, the brake servo is pressurised, and if there isn't enough oomph in the 12v auxiliary Battery the car won't go into Ready mode.

So, could it be as simple as fitting a switch in series with the brake light switch (somewhere down by the brake pedal)? With the kill switch open the car won't be able to complete it's "pre departure checks" and it won't be going anywhere ...

More amusing would be to introduce a two pole switch. In position B it simply completes the circuit and enables the car to function normally. In position A it would take advantage of whatever voltage becomes available via the brake light switch to trigger an alarm - that would continue to sound until disabled by the owner with a secondary key.

Like all of Baldrick's cunning plans, it may well be doomed to failure but I can't, offhand, think why it shouldn't work ... 😉

[mobi]

Will Toyota honour warranty if they discover owners fudged with cars' electrics? 

[FROSTYBALLS]

14 minutes ago, mobi said:

Will Toyota honour warranty if they discover owners fudged with cars' electrics? 

If there is a warranty claim involving the area or components which have been altered, owners stand the risk of the warranty no longer covering the area/component in question.

[mobi]

Why don't you guys fit Ghost Immobilizer or similar devices? It involves pressing few specific buttons of existing car switches in sequence which works as PIN and customizable. 

It costs around £500 but you can negotiate with dealer during purchase to get suitable discount due to weak security of RAV4

Having said that, wonder why Toyota themselves don't implement this feature retrospectively in all RAV4s. Probably they don't care.

[ernieb]

I’ve looked at the Ghost but have concerns about the warranty. I’ve also read, somewhere, that fitters tend to fit in the same place for specific cars types and so can be vulnerable.

When I first looked at these I didn’t quite understand the ‘service function’ it seemed to be time limited and the system re-enabled if the car I’d driven and then stopped?

I probably need to revisit the company and re look at this again in more detail and maybe contact my local dealer about warranty concerns?

[Terry10]

Well I feel that I have done a pretty reasonable job now of stopping access to that plug.It involved metal/ welding ect. But is bolted to existing body holes with castellated nuts and split pins that you need to lift the bonnet to get to.Can be removed in 5 minutes when car goes in for service.

So I am being a bit vague about this as it has rightly been pointed  out on this forum that we are telling the scroats which plug it is and how their mates get in.With a very long wait list for a new car I had to do something to make life difficult for them. If it happens I can live with minor damage.I probably will reluctantly buy a steering wheel lock for trips away where the car is left in hotel car parks overnight.

My invention cost about £20.00 but I already had the metal, but I did have to visit my local metalwork shop to get the welding done.If I did a mk 2 model  there are things I would change and suspect it would be cheaper.

regards Terry.

 

 

[Gerhard_Corolla]

On 1/12/2023 at 10:18 PM, forkingabout said:

At the end of the day the Police will see it as an insured vehicle & not a high priority, here's a crime reference number.

The Police are under resourced, they just can't be there for or solve every crime commited.

I heard they are not under resourced to pursue lousy jokes on Twitter...

[Gerhard_Corolla]

It's unbelievable that a critical part of the vehicle can be accessed by removing a plastic cover, by hand, and steal a vehicle within 60 seconds...

For sure something could be done to protect those cables, something that at least requires to remove the wheel to have maneuvering space and use some kind of tools. It's just mind blowing that two lowlifes can damage a hard working individual with so little effort and risk, and that they could face no punishment whatsoever for their deeds because the police is "under resourced" and the taxpayer should be insured and taken other security measures. 

Hopefully those affected can recover soon a little bit of peace of mind!

😢

[Yugguy1970]

Aye, but you can bet the police would turn up pretty quick if you smacked one of the scrotes with a tyre iron.

[Ravirules]

2 hours ago, Gerhard_Corolla said:

I heard they are not under resourced to pursue lousy jokes on Twitter...

One of my neighbours has just retired from the Police force (he could not wait to get out I can tell you). For the last year he ‘worked from home’ looking into Facebook complaints! That said, after 20+ years on the beat, he deserved a cushy job to serve out his time..

Bottom line for me here is :- it should not be the job of the police to search down for stolen cars, it is the job of the manufacturer to make a car that cannot be stolen easily. Part of me suspects that certain manufacturers (JLR especially) aren’t too bothered about making their vehicles difficult to steal, as it just leads to more sales!

I am currently driving a Tesla (company car) and that is just about impossible to steal. The Tesla mobile tech guy told me they can just shut one down any time if it gets reported stolen.

To stop the remote key access problem, the cars now have a four digit pin requirement before it will start….If Elon can figure it out why can’t Toyota. If all manufacturers took this seriously, the police would have far more time to do the jobs we want them to do. (Comments about the Met police today, I best keep to myself)!

 

[mobi]

40 minutes ago, Ravirules said:

If Elon can figure it out why can’t Toyota.

Because Toyota is not interested until it affects their sales & reputation in a way to reduce profit margin.

Toyota can retrospectively fit similar techniques that Ghost Immobiliser does. I had great respect for Japanese design in the past but now it seems they are on free fall now. Mistakes can happen but not willing to rectify the mistake is the problem.  

[Yugguy1970]

1 hour ago, Ravirules said:

ently driving a Tesla (company car) and that is just about impossible to steal. The Tesla mobile tech guy told me they can just shut one down any time if it gets reported stolen.

 

 

You see that gives me other worries about the car being remotely hacked.

[Strangely Brown]

48 minutes ago, mobi said:

Because Toyota is not interested until it affects their sales & reputation in a way to reduce profit margin.

Toyota can retrospectively fit similar techniques that Ghost Immobiliser does. I had great respect for Japanese design in the past but now it seems they are on free fall now. Mistakes can happen but not willing to rectify the mistake is the problem.  

In the interests of balance and fairness, you don't know that Toyota are not willing to rectify the problem.

As was pointed out previously, first they have to identify the exact way that the attack happens - all that we know here is summation and guesswork. Then they have to design a mechanism to prevent that exploit and do it in such a way that it can be retrospectively applied to any affected car.

It is not necessarily as simple as you may think.

[forkingabout]

1 hour ago, Ravirules said:

To stop the remote key access problem, the cars now have a four digit pin requirement before it will start….If Elon can figure it out why can’t Toyota.

 

Sounds similar to the old PSA Peugeot / Citroen keypad immobiliser from the early 1990s.

Was an excellent system as even with the keys, you couldn't start the car unless you knew the 4 digit pin code - only flaw was if the owner was to lazy to change there vehicle pin code from the factory default.