2022 RAV4 stolen

[dannyboy413]

If we did do something like that, as @Hayzee says, we would be the ones to get prosecuted, not the poor thief who was only out for a bit of fun, as he was an abused child and now was his only carer for his poor Granny etc., etc.

[Derek.w]

Car mfg come up with new ways to defeat theves and theves come up with a device to render it inoperative.

Its a never ending circle.

[AJones]

2 hours ago, atartan said:

I understand that many new cars can be stolen easily but it does not make it right  

I quite agree, given the cost of the vehicles it is reasonable to expect a decent amount has been devoted to security measures which make it difficult to steal and that vehicle features have been robustly tested to ensure they are secure.

When you look at recent car security issues, the manufacturers have really dropped the ball. The catalytic converter thefts, when all it has needed is a few quids worth of steel plate to protect it. The replay thefts, largely solved by a couple of quid movement sensor in the keyfob to switch off the broadcast when they keys arent use.

There's something going badly wrong within the car manufacturers when they're churning out vehicles with ever more extras but they can't get basic security right. We shouldn't be having to faff about with steering locks in 2022.

 

[Rhymes with Paris]

11 minutes ago, atartan said:

How much these cost ? can they be plugged into the hybrid battery directly ?😁

£399 + vat on Amazon, and yes they plug into the hybrid Battery via a heavy duty relay.

[atartan]

13 minutes ago, Rhymes with Paris said:

Well that looks ok, but a little on the mild side for thieves really.

Humour aside, it must be terrible for the OP, my thoughts for atartan and all targets of the criminals who regard their ruining of honest people's lives as "work".

 

Thank you. It is not nice to have a 5 month car stolen. I tracked down the car and found it but not in the condition it was... I have to deal with the insurance company ..I also know that I will end up paying higher insurance premiums and the excess !  Top of these I won't be able to drive my car for days.. They already told me that it won't be easy to source the parts..

All these because someone wanted to make easy money instead of working. 

[Bper]

Unfortunately for every technical advance in car security there's always some hack to overcome this.

When living in London this was a regular thing for cars to be broken into. Police are not interested and if you don't have protected no claims on insurance you end up paying for the damage yourself. 

 

[atartan]

On 9/30/2022 at 10:17 PM, Bper said:

Unfortunately for every technical advance in car security there's always some hack to overcome this.

When living in London this was a regular thing for cars to be broken into. Police are not interested and if you don't have protected no claims on insurance you end up paying for the damage yourself. 

Protecting No Claims insurance doesnt make much difference. Insurance companies look at the claims you made in the past and price it up accordingly. I have 12 years no claim and it is protected. I know it will go up once I make a claim.

[Bper]

Had our lexus broken into 3 times claimed on one and did not loose no claims bonus . Not sure if this is the same today but it was a good few years ago so it may of changed.

Edited September 30, 2022 by Bper

[atartan]

2 minutes ago, Bper said:

Had our lexus broken into 3 times claimed on one and did not loose no claims bonus . Not sure if this is the same today but it was a good few years ago so it may of changed.

Your insurance premium didn't go up following years?

[Bper]

No it remained the same. There was a time years ago when insurance covered you for most things and protected bonus meant protected. Insurance stayed the same year in year out providing you did not make multiple claims.

Today ever year accident or not premiums rise. Oh yes it's the algorithm I am told😟

[Cyker]

This is what I've been telling people - So many are afraid to claim on insurance because they're terrified the premium will skyrocket, but generally this isn't the case unless you loose your NCB and thus get reset to new-driver levels of insurance cost. (This is why I do recommend protecting your NCB!!)

Usually your premium will only go up by the same level of hike it would have gone up anyway, so it's not worth trying to do some dodgy stuff to avoid involving the insurance company, which may back-fire even worse if they find out!

And even if it does go up, just changing to another insurer often fixes that!  

[Lawnmowerman]

1 hour ago, Derek.w said:

Car mfg come up with new ways to defeat theves and theves come up with a device to render it inoperative.

Its a never ending circle.

Absolutely.

Car manufacturers do not approach security with a criminal mindset - unfortunately.

And, if they did, there will always be one criminal who will be smarter.

Much to our dismay and cost.

[Roger_N]

On 9/30/2022 at 12:12 PM, atartan said:

I have not been on this forum for while but my 2022 March car was stolen last night. Fortunetly I used MYT app located the car and recovered. Entertainment Screen and some other stuff were removed and the hybrid multifunction error was on the screen.  I took it to the Toyota service and asked for explanation how someone managed to drive away without keys.. The service manager said it is really easy to start the car from left frot headlight and it takes 5 minutes.

Really bad they can take a car so quickly and easily and it leaves an uneasy feeling every time you leave it after you have got it back. Between this and the engine fault were it just stops, I’m beginning to think maybe it was not the best choice of make in some respects. It’s a shame because there is a lot I like about the car.

I hope you get things sorted soon.

[PCM]

I emailed a well regarded local car alarm fitting company two weeks ago for a quote for my wife's car and mine.

Never heard back. 😞

Too busy, too lazy... who knows?

[TonyHSD]

10 hours ago, atartan said:

Protecting No Claims insurance doesnt make much difference. Insurance companies look at the claims you made in the past and price it up accordingly. I have 12 years no claim and it is protected. I know it will go up once I make a claim.

Not necessarily plus you can switch to another company on renewal which is actually a better move. Tell them you had a claim but because you are new customer you will likely to get better quote than your existing insurance. Try aviva directly or call Adrian flux, later also offers discounts for Toyota forum members. Insurances are for that here, to pay for incidents and not only as a legal requirement. 

[ernieb]

Depending on your age try SAGA, I got a fixed for 3 years plus NCP when I bought my PHEV in ‘21. Mine was £100’s less than all the others even though the price was protected for 3 years.

[philip42h]

29 minutes ago, ernieb said:

Depending on your age try SAGA, I got a fixed for 3 years plus NCP when I bought my PHEV in ‘21. Mine was £100’s less than all the others even though the price was protected for 3 years.

Likewise ... and now that it's up for renewal in the second year there are plenty of competitive quotes that are cheaper so I'm very likely to switch from Saga after only one year. It still appears that the only cost effective way of getting insurance is to check and switch annually ...

[atartan]

The latest update: Toyota told me also the front left headlamp unit completely need changing too. All will cost £6000 to replace/repair not working head-unit and the headlamp. I called my insurance company and they told me if I go with Toyota directly it will cost me extra £300 excess and I will not get a courtesy car. 

As I needed a car for a trip that was planned, I wanted to get the courtesy car. I decided to go to Toyota service and collect my car without phoning them first. Ohh boy they weren't expecting me there.. They didnt want to return the car.. I insisted that I want my car. (Lots of swearing etc. Unfortunately I had to do..)

I got my car and  drove home 20mins... I decided the check the headlamp ... guess what it is working perfectly fine. I decided  to connect the head-unit and see if that's working too.. Few loose cables on the connectors but I said it is worth trying.. Guess what.. Yeap, it is working as well. Only thing I can see that it is not working is the GPS/antenna I can see that Thieves broke the connector and it needs replacing.. Did I say they wanted £6000 to fix my car ? There is hardly anything wrong with it.. Just  few connector need replacing, that's all

I drove back to the Toyota Center and asked for explanation.. They told me the technician worked on the car is not there and they usually record videos of the faults but They didnt do this time. Another technician was saying that if I connect head-unit or head-lamp myself, it could catch a fire and they wouldn't be responsible. I asked him why he doesnt connect it.. He refused to help.

To cut long story short . My car was stolen by thieves.. I managed to recover but I took it to Toyota center service, Hoping they will help.  They were the real thieves.......... I extremely regret buying a car from Toyota now.. £6000 to replace a few connectors...

[atartan]

In case someone thinks I am making this up..

[flash22]

You will need to check the loom for damage in the front arch the broken aerials are for the DCM that's why they pulled the radio if it's just the locking tabs on the connectors that are broke these can be repaired is this why the quoted the whole loom. Quoting for the touch2 without testing is just poor - this sounds the sort of **** Jemca Croydon/Bromley/Sidcup pull

do you have pics of the connectors inside the car

I see how its done now, they pull the loom in the arch to get at the headlight plug (headlight uses can bus for control)

ps. get a Disklok asap

[Rhymes with Paris]

1 minute ago, atartan said:

In case someone thinks I am making this up..

 

I doubt anyone would think you are making it up atartan,on the contrary, I think most on here are only too familiar with the antics of dealers.

It might be a blessing in disguise that you did not get a courtesy car, I had one some years ago from a insurance directed crash repair place.(nothing to do with Toyota)

They tried to pull the same tricks that some car hire places do, claiming damage that was already there, such as scratches low on the sills etc.

You must feel that,as you say ,you have been done over twice, first by the thieves,then by the supposedly honest system to put things right.

,A very sorry state of affairs.😟

[Cyker]

One thing to remember with dealers is they do not repair things - They only replace them.

e.g. a leaky pipe - A normal mechanic would repair the damaged section or cut it out and put in a new section; The dealer will replace the whole pipe.

I think they're not actually allowed to repair things by company policy or something, or maybe because they don't trust their mechanics abilities as there won't be any instructions for custom work like that so such work would be down to the mechanics abilities and personal style and not consistent between repairs, but there will be detailed instructions for replacing the whole unit and it will only be done one way, the same way, every time, according to the instructions.

 

[kucyk]

Does anyone know how this is exactly done? My understanding is they get access to the can bus via the headlight cable, then they unbind the key fobs, do they bind a new key fob at this stage or they open the car using Techstream?

I thought to bind a key you need to hold it near the immobiliser/steering wheel but somehow they open the car. 

I think it's a design flaw that that Toyota has all cans exposed in the headlight cable, so the headlight cable allows you to unbind key fobs. I guess they could also break in to the car, then connect to the ODBII port and do the same but by going with the headlight cable they don't break the window, so nothing suspicious when drove off.

This one is interesting so be warned - I saw the post on reddit where somebody was claiming he found a car with broken window one morning, fixed the window on his expense, then after a few days car was gone. What likely happened is they broke into the car, connected to the ODB2 port, bind a new key fob and then they came back later to "collect" the car. It's mad that you can do this stuff with the software from eBay, Toyota should secure this function better. I think most of the cars if not every have this function exposed as required by some EU law, it's for the independent garage to be able to perform key bind/unbind without going to the dealer, that's my theory. F***cking hell.

If nothing is done about it, these cars will be disappearing from the streets once they get a little bit older and the demand for the parts is bigger.

[forkingabout]

EU anti competition laws prevents vehicle manufacturers securing access in to the vehicle systems via the OBD port.

The vehicle manufacturers could easily fix theft via the OBD port method but the EU law makers just won't let them.

[robo1]

According to Wiki

CAN is a low-level protocol and does not support any security features intrinsically. There is also no encryption in standard CAN implementations, which leaves these networks open to man-in-the-middle frame interception. 

looks like the only way to secure it is physical protection not software changes.