yaris cross 4 wheel drive capability

[anchorman]

2 hours ago, IT Troll said:

The same could be asked of the the automatic systems for wipers, lights, steering, brakes, etc. A mixture of safety and convenience.

In the case of the AWD-i it is meant to intelligently adjust torque delivery depending on the driving conditions. I would argue that if the car is stuck and the wheels are spinning it should automatically adapt the drive mode to re-establish grip. The buttons are a useful manual override but it seems to me like the system needs some more intelligence.

Funnily enough, I forgot I had the snow button and it it switched seamlessly and drove in unbelievable snow conditions.  Never take these so called tests (Toyota ignore such rubbish) at face value.  You can’t see what they are doing and roller tests are none representative because not only are some wheels subject to zero friction but the car has to be pulled out of the rollers.  Furthermore, it isn’t a Toyota official test as suggested.  They don’t play games, they have fully instrumented vehicles on purpose made tracks.  

[anchorman]

1 hour ago, Yugguy1970 said:

I'm finding all these videos interesting and I really like the one from Garth that shows how all the different cars with different types of system behave.

And I really want an awd RAV, time to start saving and hope interest rates fall in a couple of years 🤣

Will you have AWD or do you feel FWD is good enough for your needs?

[SinglePointSafety]

I'm also finding these videos (thanks Garth) interesting, if only to see the effect of selecting the different drive modes, both for the hybrid and petrol. It's also a good reminder for me: when I go mountain biking, I sometimes end up parking in places where access (and parking) is a bit 'off-road' and I've certainly been in situations where one wheel has minimal grip, so I need to remember to switch modes

[Garth.]

24 minutes ago, anchorman said:

Furthermore, it isn’t a Toyota official test as suggested

Read and understand:

On 4/13/2023 at 11:06 AM, Garth. said:

Toyota Yaris Cross roller test made in Japan during presentation of the model. Presentation included a few "offroad" obstacles, one of them was roller platform, used for lateral μ–split test (different grip between right and left wheels)

On 4/13/2023 at 11:06 AM, Garth. said:

There's quite a lot of other videos from the same event as many automotive journalists were there

 

15 minutes ago, SinglePointSafety said:

I sometimes end up parking in places where access (and parking) is a bit 'off-road' and I've certainly been in situations where one wheel has minimal grip, so I need to remember to switch modes

Trail mode is doing really good job when the combustion engine is on, traction control intervention is immediate. It helps not only in moving on but also can save the tyres on rocky trails.

[Yugguy1970]

1 hour ago, anchorman said:

Will you have AWD or do you feel FWD is good enough for your needs?

No, I definitely want AWD - I know it might be the crappy Dunlops but the FWD Rav really struggles to get power down in the slightest damp conditions.

And I want the little rotary dial and the modes and the Badge on the back 🤣

 

[TonyHSD]

I was thinking to keep quiet, but let me be honest., the awd I in Yaris cross definitely  won’t make me buy this car, but the ground clearance, approach and departure angles, plus the low end torque from the electric motor and TC switch off button along with the light weight will make even the fwd models the perfect small suv for daily commute or holidays in the nature.
My personal opinion, no offence to any awd owners , is that the front wheel drive Yaris cross is as capable if not even more than the awd car as long as you have the right tyres. Can’t wait for direct comparison between both examples. 👍
In most road and off road conditions in uk all that people ever need are more suitable tyres and not an awd system. 
The test from Japan, that’s so easy and it’s an tc software set up , nothing more and pretty much any other Toyota hybrid fwd can pass with ease. 

My answers to the title is it capable awd Yaris cross hybrid, imo No. , but it’s good enough for some customers and this is most likely the original plan from Toyota, marketing strategy to sell more cars.
The rotary switch between the different terrain modes it’s also the same gimmick, IT it’s right about it, no need to switch to rocks to get you going , the car tc should figure out automatically, but hey then it won’t have the fancy rotary switch. , I won’t deny , it looks cool together with the decent control button,  but in reality not much of a help. 
In normal driving conditions, not pushing the car to the limits no one will ever notice any difference in suspension set ups between both models fwd or awd, independent rear suspension are better in fast turns and that’s all. The comfort comes from the shocks and springs and the fwd cars also has a good set up as seen in the moose test.
Conclusion, buy whatever model you like and it’s best suited for your needs, they all are very capable small suv but neither of them including the awd -i is real 4x4 aka awd suv, just a front wheel drive hybrid and some comes with rear motor assist. 

[Max_Headroom]

3 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

My personal opinion, no offence to any awd owners , is that the front wheel drive Yaris cross is as capable if not even more than the awd car as long as you have the right tyres. Can’t wait for direct comparison between both examples.

Surely if you have the right tyres on the Cross AWD it will perform better in slippery conditions than a front wheel drive Cross with the same right tyres on it.

[anchorman]

2 hours ago, Max_Headroom said:

Surely if you have the right tyres on the Cross AWD it will perform better in slippery conditions than a front wheel drive Cross with the same right tyres on it.

100% correct.  

[Tel 2]

AWDi rear suspension does improve ride/handling characteristics & the 4x4 drive engagement has numerous scenarios programmed in to enhance road contact & gives the Driver confidence, particularly in very poor weather conditions.

When working, I had to respond to Call Outs ,whatever the weather & my Lovers Mini 850 was the only car on our Estate that was usable in every scenario. In '92,

Heavy Snow around Derby lead to massive power cuts all week-end & our Mini never failed me.I was confident.

In 2023, in my Cross , I have only driven in huge thunderstorms that instantly flood Motorway Gulley's yet my Confidence remained high & I literally sailed through.

Tel

[IT Troll]

20 hours ago, anchorman said:

Funnily enough, I forgot I had the snow button and it it switched seamlessly and drove in unbelievable snow conditions.

I think the Snow button only tempers acceleration, it doesn’t change the power distribution. So only going to have an effect if someone is a bit aggressive with the accelerator.

[anchorman]

1 hour ago, Tel 2 said:

AWDi rear suspension does improve ride/handling characteristics & the 4x4 drive engagement has numerous scenarios programmed in to enhance road contact & gives the Driver confidence, particularly in very poor weather conditions.

When working, I had to respond to Call Outs ,whatever the weather & my Lovers Mini 850 was the only car on our Estate that was usable in every scenario. In '92,

Heavy Snow around Derby lead to massive power cuts all week-end & our Mini never failed me.I was confident.

In 2023, in my Cross , I have only driven in huge thunderstorms that instantly flood Motorway Gulley's yet my Confidence remained high & I literally sailed through.

Tel

The mini,s secret was the thin tyres giving it high contact pressure.   That’s the same principle as a train.  If your mini had AWD it would be formidable.   I had loads of them and the only thing that would stop it was beaching it in deep snow.  I went into snow that was deep enough to beach most cars in the Cross and it ploughed through.  It was amazing.  

[SinglePointSafety]

3 hours ago, IT Troll said:

I think the Snow button only tempers acceleration, it doesn’t change the power distribution

Interesting....in the video that Garth linked to, there is a clear difference in behaviour when the AWD selector is changed to 'trail'. Will have another look at the manual to see if there's more info on what the different modes are intended to do

[Garth.]

21 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

low end torque from the electric motor and TC switch off button along with the light weight will make even the fwd models the perfect small suv for daily commute or holidays in the nature.

Check what Japanese are doing, looks really cool:

 

5 hours ago, IT Troll said:

I think the Snow button only tempers acceleration, it doesn’t change the power distribution. So only going to have an effect if someone is a bit aggressive with the accelerator.

Correct. Here's info by Toyota about Snow mode:

- tempers accelerator openness and supports starts that limit slippage on a slippery road surface

- tempers accelerator openness during acceleration and limits slippage

- tempers throttle response to help pull away securely from stationary or accelerate to maintain controllability when driving on snow or ice

 

1 hour ago, SinglePointSafety said:

in the video that Garth linked to, there is a clear difference in behaviour when the AWD selector is changed to 'trail'.

Yes, Trail Mode changes significantly the operation of traction control system. 

[IT Troll]

2 hours ago, SinglePointSafety said:

Interesting....in the video that Garth linked to, there is a clear difference in behaviour when the AWD selector is changed to 'trail'. Will have another look at the manual to see if there's more info on what the different modes are intended to do

Toyota say, "Trail Mode - Applies the brake to the spinning tyre and allocates torque to the tyre touching the road surface". Which explains why this enables the car to escape from the rollers once enabled. What seems odd to me is that the "intelligent" AWD system doesn't try to do that automatically. But at least the test shows it working.

[IT Troll]

1 hour ago, Garth. said:

Check what Japanese are doing, looks really cool:

Looks cool. Shame they didn't actually get those Monsta Mud Warrior tyres muddy.

[TonyHSD]

Correct, and all that “ trail mode help”  is available automatically in fwd version of Yaris cross and all other Toyota hybrids since Prius gen 2.
No need a “ trail mode” as rotary switch, but it’s cool isn’t it. 
Snow mode is simply another “cool future “ where actually it’s eco mode in all other fwd hybrids. 
All comments above are correct including awd with same tyres as fwd will have better traction, no doubt about it.👍 

The question is when you lose traction what happens and how much help you can get from the rear axle, very little and in some cases non.

This for me and some other drivers will define the answer how capable is the awd-i in Yaris cross, and this is what I and Garth are trying to explain.
It will be very helpful to some new comers who are deciding either to go fwd or awd.
Bob’s  test on icy incline driveway, this is where the awd version will beat the fwd because of the pure physics of weight distribution and torque distribution between both axles. I believe that if he had pushed the accelerator harder to get front wheels spinning and lose traction the rear axle wouldn’t be capable of pushing the car forward in any mode, with or without traction control on. , which make the awd -I basically not much different or more capable from the fwd Yaris cross.
This is clearly seen on the video of Lexus ux awd shared earlier posts. 

People from other countries like USA and Australia are using lifted up Priuses fwd for going camping, hiking, and anywhere off road. They show and comment how good these cars are although only a fwd hybrids., and all they ever needed were extra ground clearance and more suitable tyres. Here an example and please look through the comments. The Greek video test of Yaris cross fwd shows very similar results. At the end driving axles aren’t so important as many believe, it’s more about tyres, torque, tc or diff lock and driving skills. 👍

[anchorman]

17 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

Correct, and all that “ trail mode help”  is available automatically in fwd version of Yaris cross and all other Toyota hybrids since Prius gen 2.
No need a “ trail mode” as rotary switch, but it’s cool isn’t it. 
Snow mode is simply another “cool future “ where actually it’s eco mode in all other fwd hybrids. 
All comments above are correct including awd with same tyres as fwd will have better traction, no doubt about it.👍 

The question is when you lose traction what happens and how much help you can get from the rear axle, very little and in some cases non.

This for me and some other drivers will define the answer how capable is the awd-i in Yaris cross, and this is what I and Garth are trying to explain.
It will be very helpful to some new comers who are deciding either to go fwd or awd.
Bob’s  test on icy incline driveway, this is where the awd version will beat the fwd because of the pure physics of weight distribution and torque distribution between both axles. I believe that if he had pushed the accelerator harder to get front wheels spinning and lose traction the rear axle wouldn’t be capable of pushing the car forward in any mode, with or without traction control on. , which make the awd -I basically not much different or more capable from the fwd Yaris cross.
This is clearly seen on the video of Lexus ux awd shared earlier posts. 

People from other countries like USA and Australia are using lifted up Priuses fwd for going camping, hiking, and anywhere off road. They show and comment how good these cars are although only a fwd hybrids., and all they ever needed were extra ground clearance and more suitable tyres. Here an example and please look through the comments. The Greek video test of Yaris cross fwd shows very similar results. At the end driving axles aren’t so important as many believe, it’s more about tyres, torque, tc or diff lock and driving skills. 👍

 

So you think but you’ve never driven at all let alone tested one in real life situations.  I’ve been in places where a FWD would have been stuck but you think you know better.  Now you claim every FWD Toyota has snow and trail mode.  There’s 2 of us with practical experience and you ignore the feedback based on YouTube roller test.  Crack on Tony, keep ignoring the facts and pontificate like some expert on a subject you’ve never witnessed.  

[TonyHSD]

3 hours ago, anchorman said:

So you think but you’ve never driven at all let alone tested one in real life situations.  I’ve been in places where a FWD would have been stuck but you think you know better.  Now you claim every FWD Toyota has snow and trail mode.  There’s 2 of us with practical experience and you ignore the feedback based on YouTube roller test.  Crack on Tony, keep ignoring the facts and pontificate like some expert on a subject you’ve never witnessed.  

No, 

I have never said that but as I have my rights to express personal opinion and experience you have yours, so thank you for replying back to me. 
I don’t need to try Yaris cross awd to see or understand how it works or how capable is. It is obvious and already proven few times and seen by many. You have your justification why you made your choice to have awd, I have mine and if I ever get Yaris will most likely be fwd only for all the reasons in my previous posts. But if I need an awd car with real benefits of been awd I will definitely look elsewhere. , Subaru, Suzuki, Dacia 👍 

Toyota hybrids are the best hybrids but not the best awd cars. 

[Yugguy1970]

Yeah but Max is right earlier when he says that if you have a YC, or a Rav, if they both have the same kind of tyres on you'll get better grip with the awd than the fwd.

[TonyHSD]

Here would like to share a super interesting video about fwd car and how simple traction control and driving skills can make a front wheel drive car almost as capable as awd. Of course it is not going to be exactly the same but close. The author explains something very important around the 50 seconds in the video, he says -“as long as you keep both front wheels on the ground the car will be good to go over terrain. “  And here is my personal opinion that in situations like that which can happen even on a flat surface the rear axle of the awd -I instead of helping you keep going may actually stop you going further or make the whole process more difficult. Thanks 

 

[Max_Headroom]

While i don't dispute the Suzuki is a capable  car this is not snow and most of the mud is dry i am not surprised a car with decent ground clearance and short overhangs driven by a guy that obviously knows how to drive it in those conditions did so well, i would have loved to see how it got on in deep snow like in the video below.

 

 

 

 

 

[Max_Headroom]

Any car can drive off-road i think i prefer the Cross  😉

 

 

[Garth.]

12 minutes ago, Max_Headroom said:

While i don't dispute the Suzuki is a capable  car this is not snow and most of the mud is dry i am not surprised a car with decent ground clearance and short overhangs driven by a guy that obviously knows how to drive it in those conditions did so well, i would have loved to see how it got on in deep snow like in the video below.

 

 

 

 

 

It's on the same channel:

 

[Tel 2]

So ,Tony, I can inform you that the Mk1 RAV was a permanent 4x4 &. the Hi Lux & Land Cruiser models are The Global Chariots of choice even in War Zones where maintaining Traction is key.

Clarkson could not destroy one &  top JD Power Performance in The States & Europe never falters.

Your views above are not correct.

Tel

.

[TonyHSD]

1 hour ago, Tel 2 said:

So ,Tony, I can inform you that the Mk1 RAV was a permanent 4x4 &. the Hi Lux & Land Cruiser models are The Global Chariots of choice even in War Zones where maintaining Traction is key.

Clarkson could not destroy one &  top JD Power Performance in The States & Europe never falters.

Your views above are not correct.

Tel

.

I agree with that 4x4 cars are much more capable in slippery conditions and terrain and that’s why I made the point.
What I am saying it’s 100% correct, and it’s only that Toyota hybrids are not as good awd cars as their petrol only models.
The benefits of having a rear motor assist are very small and if you push the car slightest more than an easy start on slippery incline the car will fail to move. Plenty of examples people got stuck in Toyota hybrids awd and their disappointments on YouTube. 
Does anyone ever question the capability of a petrol Toyota, Mitsubishi, Subaru, Suzuki all wheel drive capabilities? 
No, because it is obvious.