Aygo Diesel 2007 glow plug question

[rogerfroud]

I presume this engine has glow plugs, but I don't know without taking a close look. I'm more familiar with Petrol Engines.

The question I have is that there's a Glowplug symbol on the dashboard that seems to briefly light up, say half a second, and then goes out and never comes on again. The car starts pretty easily, even though it's getting cold.

So the questions are...

1) Does this engine have Glowplugs?

2) if it does, shouldn't the light stay on for some time before attempting to start the car?

3) Would the time any Glowplugs are on be determined by how cold it is?

The manual we found online doesn't seem to mention anything about Glowplugs at all, so maybe there aren't any. However, if that's the case, why is there an indicator light?

Can anyone enlighten me with the answers to these questions?

Any help would be much appreciated.

Roger

[DerekHa]

Hi Roger,

Have a petrol car at present but have had several diesel vehicles over the past few years.

My experience is that all diesels have glow plugs. There are glow plugs listed on sale for the diesel Toyota Aygo if you do a search online.

My experience is that modern diesel engines will start a lot easier than the more rudimentary engines where they first appeared as it was the only way to get the fuel to ignite initially and without excessive engine cranking. Unless the temperature is really low the glowplugs won't do a great deal and the weather we're about to experience you'll definately find the glowpugs heating up to help starting. The cars computer will know how long to keep that heating circuit active if everything is working as it should.

[Bernard Foy]

Derek essentially has you covered. Yes years ago glow plugs would have stayed on longer than they do now as modern Diesel engines start much quicker than they used to. As long as your car starts right up then you have nothing to worry about.

[Cyker]

You're right - Almost all diesels have glow plugs except in rare cases, e.g. some early common-rail ones that thought they wouldn't need them (Turns out in sufficiently cold conditions they still do  )

It's normal for them not to stay on for very long - I think they would actually burn out if they ran for too long as they heat up very quickly.

All they do is warm up the cylinder enough, so that the diesel combustion process can work. If your car starts easily when it's cold, they are working properly.

The indicator light is there as, normally when you turn the key to Position 2 (Power On) the glow plug light comes on. You're then supposed to wait for the glow plug light to go out, before you twist it to Position 3 (Ignition) and actually start the car proper.

 

I'm not surprised there isn't much info in the manual as the diesel Aygo is even rarer than the Mk1 Yaris diesel and the engine is a PSA (Now Stellantis?) unit, rather than a Toyota. The manual for the diesel one only came with the car and is very difficult to find elsewhere because so few people had that model!

 

[rogerfroud]

Many thanks to you all for you rapid and detailed explanations, it's very much appreciated.

My only experience with Diesels is with Narrow Boats. We had a SABB single cylinder one which didn't have a glow plug. Instead that had a removable plug that you put a starting 'match' into. I think they were supposed to self ignite, but you had a better chance of it starting if you lit it with a match and blew on it to get a red ember on the end.

Another one had glow plugs, and the light always came on for at least 15 seconds, whatever the weather. I guess things have moved along a bit!

[Rhymes with Paris]

A pal of mine bought a pug diesel partner van new in 2005.

He never read the handbook, and churned the engine over until it started, without giving the glow plugs a chance to heat the cylinders.

He is a highly skilled bricklayer, but has no clue about mechanical sympathy,bless him.

It got hit on the offside that stove it in a bit, and bought the write off from the insurance company.

Amazingly, it is still doing it's job, and chugging along with trowels, Stihl saws, and stabila spirit levels in the back.

It is a pig pug , but fair enough, despite mechanical abuse, still going.

And yes, keep the curly wire light on the dash until it goes out before cranking the engine.

 

[rogerfroud]

8 hours ago, Rhymes with Paris said:

A pal of mine bought a pug diesel partner van new in 2005.

He never read the handbook, and churned the engine over until it started, without giving the glow plugs a chance to heat the cylinders.

He is a highly skilled bricklayer, but has no clue about mechanical sympathy,bless him.

It got hit on the offside that stove it in a bit, and bought the write off from the insurance company.

Amazingly, it is still doing it's job, and chugging along with trowels, Stihl saws, and stabila spirit levels in the back.

It is a pig pug , but fair enough, despite mechanical abuse, still going.

And yes, keep the curly wire light on the dash until it goes out before cranking the engine.

 

It's amazing what these amazing machines will put up with. I've seen some of those 'Cold start' YouTube videos of Diesel Locomotives where they just hang on the starter for what seems like ten minutes before it finally runs on its own, with flames and all sorts coming out of the chimney. I've even seen those using a flaming rag at the intake to help it along!

[Puglet]

As mentioned diesel versions of Mk1s are rare cos they got phased out as the toyota petrol was just as economical and the diesels didn't sell that well either. We had a couple of Peugeot diesel campervans for number of years and engine wise they were spot on, never had any issues, unlike rest of the van. 

As others have said, just wait for the glowplug light to go out and away you go, but even my stepdad would forget as his main car was petrol, but van would still start ok.

Glad our similar 107 has a Toyota petrol engine, cos don't think I would trust a small Peugeot petrol engine, so it horses for courses. 

 

 

 

 

[Gerg]

I thought I'd just google the origins of this engine, as it is rare in the Aygo.

Whilst there are bound to be variations between brands, this engine, on initial investigation, was used by Peugeot, Citroen, Ford, Renault, Mazda and Toyota.  And perhaps Nissan. 

I never realised this one was so popular (in other cars).

In the Aygo etc. they reduced the torque output because of the gearbox's limitations, it says.  Hmm, could have been a rival for the old Fabia 1.9 PD VRS...maybe.

[flash22]

It's the PSA 2WZTV, derived from the 1.4 HDI diesel, yes it has glow plugs turn the key wait a few seconds then start the car, in ultra cold weather, cycle the key 2-3 times waiting till the light goes out then crank it

2WZTV in the triplets is detuned 1.4 hdi as it would turn the car in to a little rocket ship, and set the tires alight at every junction 69bhp 150-160Nm of torque

It was only used from 2005 to 2007 in the aygo and killed off in 2010

 

[Puglet]

Interesting, didn't know it was detuned, and heavier probably so in a light car anyway bit pointless  probably done to keep PSA happy that they had some mechanical input into the venture? 

Our campervans were the other side of the coin cos had a few earlier ones with 2.0 petrol engines that were way underpowered, but with 2.5 turbodiesel even lugging 3 tonnes about they could still shift.  

[flash22]

iirc the 2zwtv was 47-53 bhp 120-130Nm

[Bernard Foy]

14 hours ago, rogerfroud said:

Many thanks to you all for you rapid and detailed explanations, it's very much appreciated.

My only experience with Diesels is with Narrow Boats. We had a SABB single cylinder one which didn't have a glow plug. Instead that had a removable plug that you put a starting 'match' into. I think they were supposed to self ignite, but you had a better chance of it starting if you lit it with a match and blew on it to get a red ember on the end.

Another one had glow plugs, and the light always came on for at least 15 seconds, whatever the weather. I guess things have moved along a bit!

Some of the older vintage tractors used to have a cartridge that you lit up and inserted for to enable them to start. The old Marshals being one of those. I also used to see guys twisting up a page of newspaper making sure that had a good flame and holding it to the air intake to get it to start.

[Rhymes with Paris]

Can the old timers like me remember when you used to see HGVs in sub zero temperatures stopped on the side of the road, with a small fire under the fuel tank?

Apparently there is an effective additive in diesel now that prevents what was known as waxing, which stopped the fuel flowing through the injectors in really cold weather.

Waxing being the partial solidifying of the liquid diesel.

Other solutions included a heating element in the fuel tank, or adding 10% petrol.

 

[Puglet]

Ahh, the 10% petrol method I can vouch for, cos my stepdad did misfuel our Peugeot diesel vans a few times with petrol, thankfully he realised his mistake after a few litres usually with me shouting/swearing at him and brimmed the tank with diesel and all was well. Think I read that Peugeot diesels were a bit more robust if you misfuelled unlike others that needed new injectors/pumps etc at the slightest wiff of petrol.

[Rhymes with Paris]

Aye Puglet, those old PSA diesels were tough things, I had a 92 405 with the turbo and intercooler on it.

Took it over to France a few times, and it did go a bit,as in loads of torque.

I don't think that they had DPFs and all that gubbins then,ran very well,on occasions with some cooking oil in it too,in the days when cheap cooking oil was much cheaper than diesel.

In contrast the partner I had,a 2001 had basically the same 1.9 engine, without turbo and intercooler, very comfy ride, but a bit sluggish compared with the 405, and IIRC did a few mpg less too.

Could never work that out,as a newer,less powerful engine using more fuel?

Defied the laws of physics, it did.