Lost any remaining trust in main dealer

[TonyHSD]

35 minutes ago, Saxmaniac said:

If only we had people like Car Care Nut in UK! Does anyone know what all those taxi drivers do with their hybrids? Not main dealer surely?

Indi garages for sure, perhaps some will be ok but I am afraid I will not be going to those either.
I used work in the trade for a couple of years  used car sales, car parts distribution, car valeting plus a general experience as diy car owner and enthusiast. I had seen so many issues with people involved in the trade that I don’t think I can easily trust anyone.
What I noticed here in UK particularly as a problem with main dealers mechanics it’s not lack of competence or knowledge, but a serious lack of motivation and satisfaction caused by the dealer management. 
Long hours, stress, pressure, low pay, lack of tools, equipment, space and the list goes on.
Even the best men involved in this business get to the point that dealer failed to provide quality on all above the customer service is doomed. That’s why a man like the car care nut is probably the best you can get for your car outside of diy service. Sadly I don’t know anyone here In UK who can name as equivalent to tccn USA. Perhaps an opportunity to some of us to open a garage and serve the community. , the proper way. 👍

[Saxmaniac]

I'm a semi retired manufacturer service engineer in another field and it's sad fact that some of the other engineers simply don't care whether they do a good job or not even if they are capable (which many are not, particularly at diagnosis)   I try to treat clients like I would like to be treated and do best I can for them but I see first hand the attitude of these other engineers and it's frightening if the car trade is the same 

[Eddiefh]

I’m doing my servicing from now on after a few poor experiences; filters not being changed but paying for , wrong oil , a questionable brake fluid change a relax warranty that covers nowt 

[Puglet]

Same here, I always done my own routine servicing, but when I treated myself to a newish car years ago, let Ford do a routine service to maintain warranty and it came out with an oil leak. Their excuse was wrong oil filter, which was strange cos every time I used their parts dept for oil, filters etc I always got given the correct parts, even when they ordered stuff in for me they were spot on and very helpful, unlike the sales and service side of the dealership. I've always found independents when I needed them pretty good round our way, but they have more to loose, if they mess up they don't last very long.

[AisinW]

6 hours ago, Saxmaniac said:

If only we had people like Car Care Nut in UK! Does anyone know what all those taxi drivers do with their hybrids? Not main dealer surely?

Usually they have their own shop that maintain the fleet regularly. They work with the same cars and know better than most mechanics. Just like Lucious Garage in LA, California. 

[TonyHSD]

When we had my gf Auris the dealer promised to change the oil and filters, brake pads etc  as part of the deal. It was again Steven Eagell different location. When she collected her car she came straight to me and I checked myself, nothing as promised was done. After she went back they serviced the car so so , not 100% as promised but most things. Then a year later I went to do oil service and guess, the oil filter was a mission impossible to undo, I used 1/2 75cm breaker bar and all human power plus a couple of attempts, I did it at the end and found the paper cartridge was starting  to disintegrate inside, perhaps was 3-4 or more years old. Low mileage, one owner, full Toyota service history car. 👌😢

[AisinW]

5 minutes ago, TonyHSD said:

When we had my gf Auris the dealer promised to change the oil and filters, brake pads etc  as part of the deal. It was again Steven Eagell different location. When she collected her car she came straight to me and I checked myself, nothing as promised was done. After she went back they serviced the car so so , not 100% as promised but most things. Then a year later I went to do oil service and guess, the oil filter was a mission impossible to undo, I used 1/2 75cm breaker bar and all human power plus a couple of attempts, I did it at the end and found the paper cartridge was starting  to disintegrate inside, perhaps was 3-4 or more years old. Low mileage, one owner, full Toyota service history car. 👌😢

It sounds so bad back there. I never had this experience during 6 years warranty period even with $10 oil change with dealership coupons.  I only found Stealership often scare us by saying so many things broken, need all fluid changes, and the car is not safe to drive. They also often do not do the free recall properly, especially when my car is 10y old and 200k+ miles. 

It is important to see that the filter is new (shiny clean). 

In Germany, the dealership are pretty good although sometimes they are ignorance about how important 0w-20 in newer engines is. They often put 5w-30 if we do not ask them here and cost €20 per L. 

[xrhstosgr]

17 minutes ago, AisinW said:

Ακούγεται τόσο άσχημα εκεί πίσω. Δεν είχα ποτέ αυτή την εμπειρία κατά τη διάρκεια της περιόδου εγγύησης 6 ετών, ακόμη και με αλλαγή λαδιών 10 $ με κουπόνια αντιπροσωπείας. Βρήκα μόνο ότι το Stealership συχνά μας τρομάζει λέγοντας τόσα πολλά πράγματα σπασμένα, χρειάζονται όλες τις αλλαγές υγρών και το αυτοκίνητο δεν είναι ασφαλές στην οδήγηση. Επίσης, συχνά δεν κάνουν σωστά τη δωρεάν ανάκληση, ειδικά όταν το αυτοκίνητό μου είναι 10 ετών και έχει 200k+ μίλια. 

Είναι σημαντικό να δείτε ότι το φίλτρο είναι καινούργιο (γυαλιστερό καθαρό). 

Στη Γερμανία, η αντιπροσωπεία είναι αρκετά καλή, αν και μερικές φορές αγνοούν πόσο σημαντικό είναι το 0w-20 σε νεότερους κινητήρες. Συχνά βάζουν 5w-30 αν δεν τους ρωτήσουμε εδώ και κοστίζουν 20€ το λίτρο. 

For what brand of 5w30 oils do you quote 20 euros per liter? However, in Greece one of the good oils Motul X-Clean+ 5W-30 C3 synthetic 5 liters cost 48 euros

[AisinW]

10 minutes ago, xrhstosgr said:

For what brand of 5w30 oils do you quote 20 euros per liter? However, in Greece one of the good oils Motul X-Clean+ 5W-30 C3 synthetic 5 liters cost 48 euros

It is just how dealership marks up the price. I can always get Toyota 5w-30 or 0w-20  from ATO24 for €10 per liter or less.  But I prefer cheapest PAO oil 0w-20 certified 508/509. The newest Toyota oil 0w-20 is also much better, with pouring temp below -50C. The old one was only -40C

[TonyHSD]

Petrol stations along the autobahn in Germany are selling engine oil at extortionate prices, I remember when travel through Europe always to have some spare litre in boot. 

[Derek.w]

Last week I looked at the oil at a petrol station and none avaible below 0W30 well at a push that do  rather than NO OIL.

[AisinW]

1 hour ago, TonyHSD said:

Petrol stations along the autobahn in Germany are selling engine oil at extortionate prices, I remember when travel through Europe always to have some spare litre in boot. 

Yes. That's right.  Something that i have  never seen before.  I think Italy, France,  Swiss,  and Austria too.  So,  just visit grocery or home improvement stores instead. 

[Puglet]

Reminded me of the oil prices that Ford used to charge at service per litre, you would think it was liquid gold! I could buy 5 litres of same stuff from their parts dept for a lot less and that still expensive compared to their big service oil drum cost. Fair play to the parts guys cos if you got some decent discount it was often cheapest oil in town! 

[Saxmaniac]

I've even given up on tyre places, I'm not even talking Kwik Fit and Halfrauds which are notorious, but non chain local places. Last straw was wheel nuts overtightened so much I had to use a 3ft scaffold pole extension and broke the security key trying to undo a nut they had just fitted. I have always simply taken wheels to shop but fit them to the car myself, torqued correctly 

[TonyHSD]

28 minutes ago, Saxmaniac said:

I've even given up on tyre places, I'm not even talking Kwik Fit and Halfrauds which are notorious, but non chain local places. Last straw was wheel nuts overtightened so much I had to use a 3ft scaffold pole extension and broke the security key trying to undo a nut they had just fitted. I have always simply taken wheels to shop but fit them to the car myself, torqued correctly 

I always had friend of mine who was taking care of my car tyres and alignment, unfortunately he left the business and now I do wherever I can. Last two visits where to local ats garage, they did as I told them, they had used the torque wrench too, so far so good. Had to return once to re check rear wheels for balance as I was getting some vibrations. They did checked and didn’t even charge me for that. Probably will go back to them when it’s time for a new tyres. 

[forkingabout]

My local fast fit garage always spins the wheel nut / bolts on finger tight then torque wrench to the correct torque figure. 

Some customers if they see the wheel being refitted seem surprised as they have never seen a torque wrench before. 

[Saxmaniac]

When I went back to the tyre place to complain that their incompetence has cost me 35 quid for a new locking nut set the reply was that we "torque" up the wheels. I got the monkey who'd done mine to demonstrate. His torque wrench was a spider and a pair of very beefy arms. When I attempted to undo the nuts he'd just "torqued" they were still vastly overtight. They simply hadn't got a clue, and this is a long established independent business supposedly with a good reputation. DIY is the only way!

 

[Corollanutter]

On 1/27/2023 at 9:35 PM, Saxmaniac said:

Btw I might as well name and shame, Steven Eagell at Wolverhampton, avoid for sales and service 

WOW - I'm a bit shocked as I've had great (and at times exceptional) service from those guys over the past 13 years during ownership of three Toyotas. On the other hand I purchased my current (used) car from a Toyota dealer in Bromsgrove - and they were the pits. Suffice to say I didn't even take it back there for the free service they offered me in way of an apology for such bad performance in the sales process. 

[Saxmaniac]

I bought the car from them 4 years back at 10 months old, got it home and immediately had to sort the bodged touch up on a rear wheel arch that I hadn't noticed before buying. The headlamp beam pattern was all over the place and it went through 2 services with them assuring me they had corrected it. They obviously hadn't touched it. Eventually I gave up and looked at it myself and it was the bulb just loose in the holder. 2 second job. So that's how much they care. I was talked into a 5 years service plan with them when I bought it so was somewhat stuck with them. There's other similar experiences with them so before this episode, but it's had it's final service under 5 year plan and I'll simply DIY and forget the relax warranty 

[Corollanutter]

28 minutes ago, Saxmaniac said:

I bought the car from them 4 years back at 10 months old, got it home and immediately had to sort the bodged touch up on a rear wheel arch that I hadn't noticed before buying. The headlamp beam pattern was all over the place and it went through 2 services with them assuring me they had corrected it. They obviously hadn't touched it. Eventually I gave up and looked at it myself and it was the bulb just loose in the holder. 2 second job. So that's how much they care. I was talked into a 5 years service plan with them when I bought it so was somewhat stuck with them. There's other similar experiences with them so before this episode, but it's had it's final service under 5 year plan and I'll simply DIY and forget the relax warranty 

It just goes to show how variable things are!!  TBH, most of my time using this dealer has been when they were part of the Charles Clark group. Now it's under Steven Eagel let's see how they perform in the longer term.

[TonyHSD]

Since pandemic every service every business has worsened to the rock bottom levels. Perhaps even at Dorchester hotel the door men won’t  open your car door on arrival anymore., and used to be an umbrella meet and greet.,seriously everything is bad. Being an intelligent human does not need chipset or software code , so no supply shortages excuses. 

[Saxmaniac]

I will avoid the Dorchester in future: one has standards to maintain 🥴

[Cyker]

2 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

Since pandemic every service every business has worsened to the rock bottom levels. Perhaps even at Dorchester hotel the door men won’t  open your car door on arrival anymore., and used to be an umbrella meet and greet.,seriously everything is bad. Being an intelligent human does not need chipset or software code , so no supply shortages excuses. 

The problem is the service industry, esp. in the hospitality and food sectors, lost a lot of really good people because the businesses utterly  them over during the pandemic instead of e.g. furloughing them (Or in some cases, furloughing them then firing them and taking the furlough money) and I think it still hasn't fully recovered as, after being treated like that, those people have gone on to do other things, often becoming self employed or some sort of contractor or going into a completely different industry.

I know people who were so angry at how they were just abandoned at their time of greatest need that they swore never to go back, and even when they'd gotten calls later from the companies begging them to come back with pay offers etc. because they're having so much trouble recruiting ready-to-work staff/staff with the right experience, but they just told them to  off or otherwise ignored them.

There's still fallout from that that people don't realize and it's going to take a while to fill, esp. because we've cut off our supply of low-wage workers from the EU, and modern youngsters don't want to do 'menial' work when they're getting college and university qualifications.

A lot of the people that have come in to fill those roles are often just doing it because they need the work, rather than because they had any passion or interest for the job, and/or just haven't got the experience that the people who'd left after doing it for years had, so the levels of customer service aren't going to be there, esp. in sectors where experience counts for more than training.

The loyalty thing works both ways and I think the way a lot of companies treated their staff means they're going to have a high staff turnover for a long time as a lot of people no longer feel they owe their employers that loyalty and won't think twice about moving to a better paid job.

The people in charge in general need to better realize the value of their staff or it'll just keep happening again until they're wondering why their company collapsed.

 

[xrhstosgr]

9 hours ago, Cyker said:

The problem is the service industry, esp. in the hospitality and food sectors, lost a lot of really good people because the businesses utterly  them over during the pandemic instead of e.g. furloughing them (Or in some cases, furloughing them then firing them and taking the furlough money) and I think it still hasn't fully recovered as, after being treated like that, those people have gone on to do other things, often becoming self employed or some sort of contractor or going into a completely different industry.

Ξέρω ανθρώπους που ήταν τόσο θυμωμένοι με το πώς απλώς τους εγκατέλειψαν την ώρα της μεγαλύτερης ανάγκης τους που ορκίστηκαν να μην επιστρέψουν ποτέ, ακόμη και όταν είχαν λάβει αργότερα κλήσεις από τις εταιρείες που τους παρακαλούσαν να επιστρέψουν με προσφορές πληρωμής κ.λπ. δυσκολεύονται τόσο πολύ να προσλάβουν έτοιμο για εργασία προσωπικό/προσωπικό με τη σωστή εμπειρία, αλλά απλώς τους είπαν να  σταματήσουν ή τους αγνόησαν.

Υπάρχουν ακόμα συνέπειες από αυτό που οι άνθρωποι δεν αντιλαμβάνονται και θα χρειαστεί λίγος χρόνος για να γεμίσει, π.χ. επειδή έχουμε κόψει την προσφορά μας σε χαμηλόμισθους εργάτες από την ΕΕ, και οι σύγχρονοι νέοι δεν θέλουν να κάνουν «μεσηπωμένη» δουλειά όταν αποκτούν πτυχία κολεγίου και πανεπιστημίου.

Πολλοί από τους ανθρώπους που έχουν έρθει για να καλύψουν αυτούς τους ρόλους συχνά το κάνουν απλώς επειδή χρειάζονται τη δουλειά, παρά επειδή είχαν κάποιο πάθος ή ενδιαφέρον για τη δουλειά ή/και απλώς δεν έχουν την εμπειρία που οι άνθρωποι ποιος είχε φύγει αφού το έκανε για χρόνια, έτσι τα επίπεδα εξυπηρέτησης πελατών δεν θα είναι εκεί, π.χ. σε τομείς όπου η εμπειρία μετράει περισσότερο από την κατάρτιση.

Το θέμα της πίστης λειτουργεί αμφίδρομα και νομίζω ότι ο τρόπος με τον οποίο πολλές εταιρείες αντιμετώπισαν το προσωπικό τους σημαίνει ότι θα έχουν υψηλή εναλλαγή προσωπικού για μεγάλο χρονικό διάστημα, καθώς πολλοί άνθρωποι δεν αισθάνονται πλέον ότι οφείλουν στους εργοδότες τους αυτή την πίστη και θα το κάνουν». Μην σκεφτείτε δύο φορές για να μετακομίσετε σε μια καλύτερα αμειβόμενη δουλειά.

Οι υπεύθυνοι γενικά πρέπει να συνειδητοποιήσουν καλύτερα την αξία του προσωπικού τους, διαφορετικά θα συνεχίσει να συμβαίνει ξανά μέχρι να αναρωτιούνται γιατί κατέρρευσε η εταιρεία τους.

 

User Cyker's statements are correct, but they are only observations. The ultimate recipient and ultimate loser of this story are us consumers The criteria for buying a car should not only be the brand from now on, as the facts have changed, of course always at the expense of consumers

[TonyHSD]

Again perhaps Toyota UK head office should lay more attention to how dealers are treating their customers and penalise or revoke rights to sell Toyota cars and products in the future. Perhaps it’s time all brands to follow Tesla model for direct sales to consumers and jump the middle men (dealers).