Route Planning - Help !

[lightboxcar]

We need to go from London to Scotland soonin the bz4X

Have never used a public charger, so quite nervous really, can't get stranded as will have dog on board !

At present only have the Toyota card which says "provided by Digital Charging Solutions GmbH"

Believe the bZ4X Toyota navigation will only suggest a charger when at around 10 to 15% SOC ?   If correct, that is totally useless in the highlands of Scotland !!

So we need to know :

what is best method/app to plan route that will show fast chargers ?  ( the destination is remote, almost for sure no charging possible ).

how to pay for the charge ?  ( don't think we can just use our debit card )

is there is "one card accepted by all" solution ?

Any help gratefuly received

Thanks very much

 

[tfc]

Have you looked a zap map app, I haven't  got a EV but have heard its pretty good.

[Malop]

Zap Maps or ABRP (A better route planner) are two good options. ABRP wins on the actual route planning side but ensure it has the worst case efficiency for the car setup rather than a WLTP based efficiency and that you sent the start Battery % correctly.

Zap Map is slightly better for finding charge points when out and about and you can create a filter so it only shows charge points within specific KW ranges (50-250 KW for example). 

For paying, in my opinion, the best option is still to download a truck full of apps onto your phone, one for each provider. Zap Map is close to being universal and if you sign up for Zap Pay it is quite good, but not 100% coverage. 

Research the charge point providers on route and download their apps. Using the apps you can normally view the current status of a charge point, pay and start charging, monitor charging remotely and even stop charging. InstaVolt is a great one to have as many McDonalds have an InstaVolt charge point now.

[G S]

I have avoided all the apps other than Zap Map and I fast charge regularly. certainly on a weekly basis and sometimes a few times a day.

I have an ALLSTAR EV RFID card £3 per month) and my usual contactless debit card. I just look on Zap Map for one that takes either of those. In fact you can use Zap Map to select only Allstar ones. 

I certainly second the suggestion on MacDonalds cos although the food is dire, the coffee is surprisingly good and by the time it has cooled down to a drinkable temperature (I have it black) the Instavolt charge has done its job and I am on my way.

I don't use Zap Map for route planning though, I just use google maps for that. For this weekend I have to go to Kent from Somerset. I work on a range of 150 miles glanced at Zap Map, found chargers at Fleet Services and Clacket Lane services and off I go, it doesn't need to be any more complicated than that. I have been doing this for years as my other car is LPG and that is harder to find than EV charging.

To the OP, I planned a trip to Scotland from Somerset and it looked super easy, chargers everywhere on route if you are going up the A9 (look at Charge Scotland) a little more limited on A82 (in the end though I took the other car as needed towing ability)

[egg]

I also got myself a chargeplace scotland rfid card, as sometimes there may be no signal up there for contactless or app to work. Not used it yet, but only cost a tenner, just bear in mind it could take 10 days to arrive 

[lightboxcar]

4 hours ago, Malop said:

Zap Map is slightly better

Great info , thanks.

Is it worth paying for Zap maps premium ( it says it can then show on Apple Carplay )  ?

[lightboxcar]

2 hours ago, G S said:

I have an ALLSTAR EV RFID

RFID ?  is that the same as contactless payment card ?

Looked at the ALLSTAR card website, it looks just like a credit card, but am guessing it it just for charging payments ?

[lightboxcar]

53 minutes ago, egg said:

got myself a chargeplace scotland rfid card

Thanks , good tip !

Applied for the card, you're right, it says 10 to 14 days !!!

Also mandetory to enter vehicle details "for enforcement purposes....."

The website stated "In the meantime, you can look to activate a charge for your vehicle via the mobile appSo installed the app...." so installed the app ( which seesm to have a very porr rating ) and can see no way to 'activate/pay' for a charge.

[lightboxcar]

Ok, now have these apps:

Zap Map

ChargePlaceScotland

Electoverse ( Octopus Energy )

Pod Point

Edited March 16, 2023 by lightboxcar
added another ap

[lightboxcar]

5 hours ago, Malop said:

sign up for Zap Pay

Yes, just done that too

Thanksfor all the help, feeling a bit more confident now

[lightboxcar]

So have

3 hours ago, G S said:

I planned a trip to Scotland from Somerset

So just planned a route from London to Edinburgh using Zap Maps.  Route is 422 miles.

It is saying only two charging stops, 174 miles then another 156 miles ( total 330 miles ) .  Sounds good but will probably want to add another as need to arrive with maximum possible charge

[Malop]

8 hours ago, lightboxcar said:

Is it worth paying for Zap maps premium ( it says it can then show on Apple Carplay )  ?

I haven’t yet as I either share the location to Apple Maps and use that or type it into the in car navigation. All the subscriptions and card costs soon add up.

Try using zap maps locally before you go on the Scotland trip and see how you get on.

[G S]

9 hours ago, lightboxcar said:

RFID ?  is that the same as contactless payment card ?

Looked at the ALLSTAR card website, it looks just like a credit card, but am guessing it it just for charging payments ?

Pretty much. As I am a business user, it is rally hard to get receipts etc from charging but the Allstar just puts it all in one place, sends me an invoice and gets paid via DD so I don't need to worry about it until the accountant asks

[G S]

8 hours ago, lightboxcar said:

So have

So just planned a route from London to Edinburgh using Zap Maps.  Route is 422 miles.

It is saying only two charging stops, 174 miles then another 156 miles ( total 330 miles ) .  Sounds good but will probably want to add another as need to arrive with maximum possible charge

Looks like you are AWD like me. I would say 174 on the motorways is possible as long as you don't have 5 people, loads of luggage, soft tyres and the AC/Heating etc running but you will prob get a low traction Battery warning. I work on 150 miles between charges as my safety net as 2 hrs stints is about the same as my need for caffeine and my bladder.  Having said that, I have also managed over 200 on the motorway in an empty car when it was about 14 degrees air temp. 

[Mister Mike]

On 3/16/2023 at 10:06 PM, lightboxcar said:

Great info , thanks.

Is it worth paying for Zap maps premium ( it says it can then show on Apple Carplay )  ?

It’s a great pity that Toyota haven’t enabled Apple Maps CarPlay integration with the car’s current state of charge and range, because ev charger route planning on Apple Maps looks good on cars that do have this integration.

[lightboxcar]

So we have now loaded up a lot of apps for charging, and installed Zap Maps and ABPR ( a Better Rour Planner )

London to Edinburgh, approx 422 miles.

ABPR shows jouney time of 6 hours 26 mins driving and 1hr 57 mins from FIVE charges ( guessing that's total journey time of 8 hours 23 mins )

Zap Maps shows 12 hours 34 minutes with TWO charges

Problem is this: 

1.  why the massive difference in journey time ?

2.  FIVE fast charges ...  we understand that after two fast charges, the charging speed goes much slower !

3.  Despite setting the charger locations to max 1.5 miles from route, both apps tend to want to show chargers NOT on motorway service stations ??

motorway service stations would seem the easiest ( albeit probably not the cheapest ) option rather then come of the motorway to drive somewhere else.

Does this mean that there is a lack / absence of EV charging points at motorway service stations ?

 

[lightboxcar]

Ok just tried Zap Maps again, it's weird, at the top it shows the route with 422 miles and 12 hours 34 mins

But in the summary at the bottom it says Driving Time 7 hours 16 mins, and now 3 charging stops

Hope that doesn't mean about five hours waiting at chargers ? ( they are all rapid chargers )

 

[philip42h]

8 hours ago, lightboxcar said:

3.  Despite setting the charger locations to max 1.5 miles from route, both apps tend to want to show chargers NOT on motorway service stations ??

motorway service stations would seem the easiest ( albeit probably not the cheapest ) option rather then come of the motorway to drive somewhere else.

Does this mean that there is a lack / absence of EV charging points at motorway service stations ?

I can't offer much help but as I understand GRIDSERVE Electric Highway have pretty much a monopoly of EV charging at motorway service stations in England. They appear to be largely 50kW chargers which would extend the recharge time compared with more rapid chargers.

[dab1054]

17 hours ago, lightboxcar said:

Ok just tried Zap Maps again, it's weird, at the top it shows the route with 422 miles and 12 hours 34 mins

But in the summary at the bottom it says Driving Time 7 hours 16 mins, and now 3 charging stops

Hope that doesn't mean about five hours waiting at chargers ? ( they are all rapid chargers )

 

On longer journeys, rather than rely on route from ABRP or Zap Map,  I have found it best to have a plan to stop when about 20% Battery is left- maybe after 120 - 150 miles, 2-3 hours driving. Plan route in Google Maps (or whatever). Zap Map is good at finding convenient charge points, especially if you filter for only 100kW and faster chargers. Look at Zap Map user comments to see if there are problems at your selected EV charger. Also, some 20+ Tesla superchargers are now available for non-Teslas including several on your route- it is easy to download the Tesla app and use it.  Also worth having a second EV charger lined up in case the first is busy. Sites with multiple EV chargers give a better chance of success. The in-car navigation also picks up most of the EV rapid chargers if you select these as POI- and will then give directions (also in Google or Apple Maps). 

Let us know how the trip went.

[lightboxcar]

14 hours ago, philip42h said:

They appear to be largely 50kW chargers

Ah !  That'll explain it, we set it to check for higher rated chargers only, thank you.

 

14 hours ago, philip42h said:

GRIDSERVE Electric Highway have pretty much a monopoly of EV charging at motorway service

And that'll explain why it was not showing others, as we had the route planning set to no more than a mile from route !

[lightboxcar]

5 hours ago, dab1054 said:

Zap Map is good at finding convenient charge points

Yes, thanks !

We tried it today and Zap Maps seems briliant at showing all nearby chargers .  Your strategy seems the best way.

We decided to pay for the premium Zap maps just so we could get iot showing in Apple Car play, have to say it works really well.

Now think we may have a sporting chance of surviving the journey.....

 

[TonyHSD]

Well, I had my first ever long drive in an electric car. Was a really pleasant experience with only minor hiccups on the return journey.
We went from London to York in ioniq electric , 4 people and some luggage but not much. The car did brilliantly, efficiency was great as always been 4.4-5m/kWh., very comfortable car too. The lower the speed the better 60-65mph is the perfect cruising speed, the gf was driving a bit faster on the outbound drive but overall all ok.
The charging now as this car has a small Battery and we needed to make one stop to recharge. We did on the M1 services J25/26 place called GRIDSERVE Charging Station, there were few charging points but only two available ccs 50kwh fast chargers cost 65p/kWh. There was only one car and us, what a luck.
On the return journey we had to stop at the same place , however we had no luck this time. The chargers were taken, one didn’t work and there were people waiting plus everyone on the lower side of the Battery charge 😂.
My gf uses this zapmap to locate chargers and she was keep saying- “ there aren’t many fast chargers available along the way”.
I couldn’t believe that and I used the trusty Google maps. I found plenty of chargers, the trick is to avoid services and go to hotels , or enter the towns or villages. We found a place called Osprey Charging Station, located in the car park of Travelodge Lutterworth, just of the M1 J20, with a couple of more chargers in nearby, 5-10 min drive. It was pricey to fill up the Battery but hey, we had it almost full in one hour, we had a nice walk around the town centre, taken some pictures of beautiful old houses  and then we had continue the journey home. No cars, no waiting, no drama. A tourists couple from abroad renting a Zoe turned up too, we helped them plug their car and happy days. 
Simple Google maps search can help a lot when looking for chargers. 🪫🤣

  

 

[Roy124]

58 minutes ago, TonyHSD said:

The lower the speed the better 60-65mph is the perfect cruising speed, the gf was driving a bit faster on the outbound drive but overall all ok.

Since I had my Toyota I set a speed about 10mph below the 60/70 limit. I find there is much less disruption than trying for the higher speeds and I find journey average speeds probably very similar. 

An exception of course would be a free flow motorway but even an hour at a steady 70 would only save 10 minutes. 

[JonathanP]

On 4/10/2023 at 8:59 AM, TonyHSD said:

Well, I had my first ever long drive in an electric car. Was a really pleasant experience with only minor hiccups on the return journey.
We went from London to York in ioniq electric , 4 people and some luggage but not much. The car did brilliantly, efficiency was great as always been 4.4-5m/kWh., very comfortable car too. The lower the speed the better 60-65mph is the perfect cruising speed, the gf was driving a bit faster on the outbound drive but overall all ok.
The charging now as this car has a small battery and we needed to make one stop to recharge. We did on the M1 services J25/26 place called GRIDSERVE Charging Station, there were few charging points but only two available ccs 50kwh fast chargers cost 65p/kWh. There was only one car and us, what a luck.
On the return journey we had to stop at the same place , however we had no luck this time. The chargers were taken, one didn’t work and there were people waiting plus everyone on the lower side of the battery charge 😂.
My gf uses this zapmap to locate chargers and she was keep saying- “ there aren’t many fast chargers available along the way”.
I couldn’t believe that and I used the trusty Google maps. I found plenty of chargers, the trick is to avoid services and go to hotels , or enter the towns or villages. We found a place called Osprey Charging Station, located in the car park of Travelodge Lutterworth, just of the M1 J20, with a couple of more chargers in nearby, 5-10 min drive. It was pricey to fill up the battery but hey, we had it almost full in one hour, we had a nice walk around the town centre, taken some pictures of beautiful old houses  and then we had continue the journey home. No cars, no waiting, no drama. A tourists couple from abroad renting a Zoe turned up too, we helped them plug their car and happy days. 
Simple Google maps search can help a lot when looking for chargers. 🪫🤣

  

 

I've seen that a number of hotels have charging points, but how does that work with parking restrictions. So many now seem to have Parking Eye installed that even driving in and back out again without checking into the hotel can land you with a massive fine.
Do you have to register at reception as a diner or go in for a drink?

[TonyHSD]

48 minutes ago, JonathanP said:

I've seen that a number of hotels have charging points, but how does that work with parking restrictions. So many now seem to have Parking Eye installed that even driving in and back out again without checking into the hotel can land you with a massive fine.
Do you have to register at reception as a diner or go in for a drink?

Back from my second long drive with the ioniq last week and we had used again hotel chargers. Yes, there are parking restrictions and best way is to pop up into the reception and speak to the staff.
This time they told us to register the car and no need to pay. They said it’s free for ev charger users.
On the way back the hotel the charger was owned by the council and parking was free also, “ stay as long as you want” reception told us, so all good.