Wheel bearing going?

[HughL]

Posting this in the Prius section but might not be just Prius-specific: please do say if this is the wrong place. Hope it's not TL:DR but I've put in some detail in in the hope that more Toyota-experienced owners than me might have some advice.

I have a Prius Gen 4 Bus Ed +, 2016. Around 60k miles, trouble-free so far. Passed MoT in January, serviced February with no problems reported. The tyres are Cross-Climates; new at the front and the rears have done 40k but still have plenty of tread depth. Usage mainly A-roads and motorways, with some around-town use.

On a recent trip to France I noticed a sound I hadn't heard before, or at least hadn't really picked up. Road surfaces are much smoother in France and there's generally much less road noise, especially on autoroutes. At first I thought it was something to do with the motor-generator elements of the hybrid drivetrain but it's a) constant, not cutting in and out and b) goes up and down with road speed. It gets hard to hear when the IC engine is under load but it's still there.

It's a lowish rumble, definitely got a pulse to it: a sort of fast "whump whump" rather than a steady hum. Audible on quiet surfaces at most speeds. From inside the car it's very hard to identify where it's coming from, but I think it's the back.

Having read around a bit, I think it might be a wheel bearing.

I can now hear it on some British roads, even when there is road noise--but that could just be because I've got more sensitive to it. But I'm pretty sure it's not my imagination. There aren't that many really quiet surfaces near where I live in Surrey to do any kind of controlled tests and I'm not sure my dealer will find it on a road test.

Everything else seems fine: performance, economy and handling are what they should be and there's no vibration or play in the steering wheel. The noise doesn't get worse under steering or cornering. There does sometimes seem to be a slight vibration at speed, but it's hard to tell across different road surfaces whether that's just the road.

I had a wheel bearing go on a Subaru in the past, but the noises and other signs were much more obvious.

I've checked the tyres, and can't see anything stuck in them.

I'd appreciate any advice people are able to give:

• Could it be something else that I haven't considered?
• Are there any further tests I can do before taking it to the dealer? Especially to identify which wheel if it is a bearing?
• If it is, any chance it could be covered by the 10-year warranty (car's always been dealer-serviced in line with the T&Cs but this is probably wear and tear)
• If not, any feel for the size of the bill? Hundreds, thousands?

Many thanks to anyone able to offer info.

[BhxTrev]

2 hours ago, HughL said:

Posting this in the Prius section but might not be just Prius-specific: please do say if this is the wrong place. Hope it's not TL:DR but I've put in some detail in in the hope that more Toyota-experienced owners than me might have some advice.

I have a Prius Gen 4 Bus Ed +, 2016. Around 60k miles, trouble-free so far. Passed MoT in January, serviced February with no problems reported. The tyres are Cross-Climates; new at the front and the rears have done 40k but still have plenty of tread depth. Usage mainly A-roads and motorways, with some around-town use.

On a recent trip to France I noticed a sound I hadn't heard before, or at least hadn't really picked up. Road surfaces are much smoother in France and there's generally much less road noise, especially on autoroutes. At first I thought it was something to do with the motor-generator elements of the hybrid drivetrain but it's a) constant, not cutting in and out and b) goes up and down with road speed. It gets hard to hear when the IC engine is under load but it's still there.

It's a lowish rumble, definitely got a pulse to it: a sort of fast "whump whump" rather than a steady hum. Audible on quiet surfaces at most speeds. From inside the car it's very hard to identify where it's coming from, but I think it's the back.

Having read around a bit, I think it might be a wheel bearing.

I can now hear it on some British roads, even when there is road noise--but that could just be because I've got more sensitive to it. But I'm pretty sure it's not my imagination. There aren't that many really quiet surfaces near where I live in Surrey to do any kind of controlled tests and I'm not sure my dealer will find it on a road test.

Everything else seems fine: performance, economy and handling are what they should be and there's no vibration or play in the steering wheel. The noise doesn't get worse under steering or cornering. There does sometimes seem to be a slight vibration at speed, but it's hard to tell across different road surfaces whether that's just the road.

I had a wheel bearing go on a Subaru in the past, but the noises and other signs were much more obvious.

I've checked the tyres, and can't see anything stuck in them.

I'd appreciate any advice people are able to give:

• Could it be something else that I haven't considered?
• Are there any further tests I can do before taking it to the dealer? Especially to identify which wheel if it is a bearing?
• If it is, any chance it could be covered by the 10-year warranty (car's always been dealer-serviced in line with the T&Cs but this is probably wear and tear)
• If not, any feel for the size of the bill? Hundreds, thousands?

Many thanks to anyone able to offer info.

Hi Hugh,

I also have a Gen4 Prius 2016. I’ve had the car from new & it’s covered about 45,000 miles. It also has cross climate tyres fitted all round, with two new tyres on the front in the last few months. I’ve also noticed some unusual noises in recent weeks & thought like you, could it be a wheel bearing. However, also like you the handling of the car is unaffected. Just wondering if this is something to do with the cross climate tyres we both have on our cars? I’d also be interested in any views regarding this matter. 

[HughL]

I've had Cross-Climates for over 40k miles and not heard this sound before, but I guess it is a possibility since the new fronts were fitted. I've no idea how to test the hypothesis, though. Swapping the tyres isn't really affordable.

[BhxTrev]

18 minutes ago, HughL said:

I've had Cross-Climates for over 40k miles and not heard this sound before, but I guess it is a possibility since the new fronts were fitted. I've no idea how to test the hypothesis, though. Swapping the tyres isn't really affordable.

It does seem strange that we both have had the front cross climate tyres replaced recently. I did think the new tyres were slightly different to the original cross climates I had, but I just thought it might be just an update on the design.
 

I’ve also experience a failing wheel bearing in the distant past & I remember the loud hum it made. This noise isn’t as bad as that but it is irritating to say the least. If you get any further info please let us know. 

[HughL]

Yes, the recent generation of Cross-Climates is two versions on from the originals. I only ever had the second generation before these new fronts and still have the second generation on the rears. I can't help feeling that anything to do with the tyre compound or tread pattern would create a more constant sound and not the pulsing sound I'm hearing. And if there was some irregularity in the new fronts I'd expect it to feel it through the steering. But I will see about taking it in to the tyre place that fitted the recent fronts and see if they can see anything wrong with them.

[BhxTrev]

6 minutes ago, HughL said:

Yes, the recent generation of Cross-Climates is two versions on from the originals. I only ever had the second generation before these new fronts and still have the second generation on the rears. I can't help feeling that anything to do with the tyre compound or tread pattern would create a more constant sound and not the pulsing sound I'm hearing. And if there was some irregularity in the new fronts I'd expect it to feel it through the steering. But I will see about taking it in to the tyre place that fitted the recent fronts and see if they can see anything wrong with them.

Thanks for your reply. If you do take your car to the tyre place you used please let me know what they say. As I mentioned previously, I’ve not noticed any bad handling either, which like you, I’d expect if there was something wrong with the front wheels. I shall certainly mention this matter at my next service, in August, that’s if the noise doesn’t get worse!

[Sooty]

Just a thought, have you tried swapping front tyres/wheels to the back and visa-versa?

I had a funny noise from the front when going around roundabouts and also had to hold the steering slightly to the left.

Swapped front to back and all sorted.

I think it may have been a slightly "sticky" spot on one of the tyres.

[TonyHSD]

Wheel bearings and tyres in certain condition can sound so similar that it will be almost impossible to extinguish the real reason for the whining noise. These cross climate and any other brands all season all weather tyres with v shape patterns has these faulty wheel bearings noises when driving on smooth surfaces and can make you think you have a bad bearings. However these tyres has ability to cancel vibrations and transfer rough road noise into the cabin and that’s why we have so many positive reviews from uk because here most of the a roads and motorways has those rough asphalt. 
You can try test for worn bearing while going through roundabouts and in turns if it’s from the bearings it will change when one or the other side gets loaded by the weight of the car. 
We have recently fitted cross climates 2 to my gf car and I noted this behaviour too. Super smooth on most roads with slight wheel bearings rumbling on smoothly asphalt, we don’t have much of it so no trouble at all., and most importantly she never noticed anything 😂👌

[HughL]

Thanks everyone for helpful suggestions. Finally had time to take it in to my tyre place, and yes, that was the problem and not a wheel bearing. Both rears had flat patches that were causing the noise. They were getting near the end of their life anyway. New ones fitted, end of noise even on quiet surfaces (so far; longer trip on Sunday/Monday so we'll see once I've done a couple of hundred miles). Possibly been under-inflating them slightly: they checked my pressure gauge while I was there and it was over-reading.

I was pleased that the tyre place didn't try to charge me for the time they spent inspecting and road testing, which was nearly an hour.

[BhxTrev]

1 hour ago, HughL said:

Thanks everyone for helpful suggestions. Finally had time to take it in to my tyre place, and yes, that was the problem and not a wheel bearing. Both rears had flat patches that were causing the noise. They were getting near the end of their life anyway. New ones fitted, end of noise even on quiet surfaces (so far; longer trip on Sunday/Monday so we'll see once I've done a couple of hundred miles). Possibly been under-inflating them slightly: they checked my pressure gauge while I was there and it was over-reading.

I was pleased that the tyre place didn't try to charge me for the time they spent inspecting and road testing, which was nearly an hour.

Cheers Hugh,

Sounds like it’s the same noise I’m hearing. The rear tyres are no where near worn out but as you say if there are flat spots, they might need replacing but obviously it seems that the cross climate tyres aren’t really a suitable choice for the Prius. When I take my car in for service I’ll get it checked out. Thanks again for coming back on this one,

Trev

[HughL]

Personally, I'm happy with the Cross Climates (have replaced the rears with CCs again) and not sure why they would be less suitable for a Prius than any other FWD car. I think my problem was that I'd inadvertently under-inflated mine and so the inside of the tread wore irregularly. In any case they were getting close to the overall tread depth I'm happy with. The improved traction and grip in winter has been very useful for me. 

[TonyHSD]

Any tyres can be fine for Prius. The thing about all season tyres and winter tyres is that they kill inertia a bit and the car loses 3-5mpg on average. Also these two types of tyres has slightly  longer braking distance when in emergency stops, they can lose grip sooner than summer tyres especially on wet surfaces. Another negative is that they are heavier with stronger carcass and slightly less comfortable drive. The good bit is that they are significantly better in cold, mud, sand, grass, gravel and of course snow and ice than any summer tyres. If winters are mild and no much of snow and ice staying on summer tyres all year around it’s fine. Hills, snowy roads, rural areas the all season will be better.

[TonyHSD]

👍

[BhxTrev]

29 minutes ago, TonyHSD said:

Any tyres can be fine for Prius. The thing about all season tyres and winter tyres is that they kill inertia a bit and the car loses 3-5mpg on average. Also these two types of tyres has slightly  longer braking distance when in emergency stops, they can lose grip sooner than summer tyres especially on wet surfaces. Another negative is that they are heavier with stronger carcass and slightly less comfortable drive. The good bit is that they are significantly better in cold, mud, sand, grass, gravel and of course snow and ice than any summer tyres. If winters are mild and no much of snow and ice staying on summer tyres all year around it’s fine. Hills, snowy roads, rural areas the all season will be better.

I live in the foothills of Snowdonia hence I opted for the cross climate tyres. However, the winter weather probably isn’t as severe as living in say the Midlands where they seem to be more prone to snowy conditions than we are, probably because we’re lower down towards the coast & if snow is going to fall it’s more likely to fall on the backdrop of the mountains. In any case if the weather’s that bad I just wouldn’t bother to use my car so I guess I ought to consider changing back to a more conventional tread pattern in future. Problem is, I had new replacement cross climate tyres fitted to the front a couple of thousand miles back but if they eventually wear I think I’ll try a different tread pattern next time. 

[TonyHSD]

8 hours ago, BhxTrev said:

I live in the foothills of Snowdonia hence I opted for the cross climate tyres. However, the winter weather probably isn’t as severe as living in say the Midlands where they seem to be more prone to snowy conditions than we are, probably because we’re lower down towards the coast & if snow is going to fall it’s more likely to fall on the backdrop of the mountains. In any case if the weather’s that bad I just wouldn’t bother to use my car so I guess I ought to consider changing back to a more conventional tread pattern in future. Problem is, I had new replacement cross climate tyres fitted to the front a couple of thousand miles back but if they eventually wear I think I’ll try a different tread pattern next time. 

Hi Trevor, 

I can highly recommend you to try Goodyear efficient grip performance 2.
I have a few sets of these and comparing to other brands or models even from the same company these tyres a technological marvel.
They are quiet, soft, comfortable and with low rolling resistance while they can maintain the best grip possible on all conditions, dry, wet, hot, cold.
In deep waters they cut through with no any aquaplaning at all, on dry asphalt in an emergency braking they are like a glued to the road. They last long time too. For me personally these are the best tyres for my Auris hybrid, the car feels lighter, comfortable, safer and efficiency it’s better than ever. 

[BhxTrev]

On 6/10/2023 at 7:20 AM, TonyHSD said:

Hi Trevor, 

I can highly recommend you to try Goodyear efficient grip performance 2.
I have a few sets of these and comparing to other brands or models even from the same company these tyres a technological marvel.
They are quiet, soft, comfortable and with low rolling resistance while they can maintain the best grip possible on all conditions, dry, wet, hot, cold.
In deep waters they cut through with no any aquaplaning at all, on dry asphalt in an emergency braking they are like a glued to the road. They last long time too. For me personally these are the best tyres for my Auris hybrid, the car feels lighter, comfortable, safer and efficiency it’s better than ever. 

Hi Tony,

Thanks for this info. Those tyres sound excellent & even though it’ll be quite a while before I need new tyres, especially as only do a few thousand miles a year these days, I’ll certainly bear in mind your advice. 

[Konrad C]

On 5/30/2023 at 8:16 PM, TonyHSD said:

Wheel bearings and tyres in certain condition can sound so similar that it will be almost impossible to extinguish the real reason for the whining noise. These cross climate and any other brands all season all weather tyres with v shape patterns has these faulty wheel bearings noises when driving on smooth surfaces and can make you think you have a bad bearings. However these tyres has ability to cancel vibrations and transfer rough road noise into the cabin and that’s why we have so many positive reviews from uk because here most of the a roads and motorways has those rough asphalt. 
You can try test for worn bearing while going through roundabouts and in turns if it’s from the bearings it will change when one or the other side gets loaded by the weight of the car. 
We have recently fitted cross climates 2 to my gf car and I noted this behaviour too. Super smooth on most roads with slight wheel bearings rumbling on smoothly asphalt, we don’t have much of it so no trouble at all., and most importantly she never noticed anything 😂👌

I can confirm that it happened with my old Avensis many years ago, tyres sounding like a worn wheel bearing. It took a while to find the problem.