So Much Noise!

[fred88]

2 hours ago, Don Mac said:

Do you mean 67dB for the Falkens? (Ziex ZE-914B Ecorun)

I believe that the numbers quoted in tyre specifications are for the noise external to the car and that the internal noise is not necessarily proportional to this.

I don't know of any sites with information about comparative internal noise, possibly because it varies from car to car.

I do.

I suppose it can only be the external noise because, as you say, the internal will be affected by so many car specific variables, but nevertheless I would expect a quieter tyre externally to also be quiter internally.

[fred88]

Sorry, I read your reply without picking up your correction. Yes 67dB not 97dB.

Thanks.

Arrrggg.

[AisinW]

But it is not true for Corolla TS top trim.  The 2.0L Hybrid mid level trim (Team Deutschland)  is slightly quieter than similar Golf base on ADAC test.   Corolla has different trims with different specs of windows glass and tires. The top trims/Longue has accoustic windows like Camry and reduce the wind noise significatly.  So, if you want to upgrade the sound insulations, getting Longue/Excel windows could be the first step upgrade for wind noise reductions. 

https://assets.adac.de/image/upload/Autodatenbank/Autotest/AT5923_Toyota_Corolla_Touring_Sports_2_0_Hybrid_Club/Toyota_Corolla_Touring_Sports_2_0_Hybrid_Club.pdf

https://assets.adac.de/image/upload/Autodatenbank/Autotest/AT5988_VW_Golf_1_5_eTSI_Style_DSG/VW_Golf_1_5_eTSI_Style_DSG.pdf

 

[TonyHSD]

So basically the top trim level like excel in uk but you need to buy a 16” wheels from the entry level car and put some nice summer tyres.
And you will have the best from both worlds plus gain some extra mpg.
 Job done. 

[shufman]

Change the Falkens before anything. 
 

I put on Primacy 4s and noise dropped to normal levels and grip improved no end. Best thing I did. 
 

I wouldn’t accept a Corolla without changing the tyres 

[NxJohn]

7 minutes ago, shufman said:

Change the Falkens before anything. 
 

I put on Primacy 4s and noise dropped to normal levels and grip improved no end. Best thing I did. 
 

I wouldn’t accept a Corolla without changing the tyres 

Thanks.  Just what I wanted, someone with real-life experience.  Everything I've managed to piece together points to the Falkens being bad.

[fred88]

On Blackcircles the Falkens are shown as the same or quieter than the Primacy 4's. Not being funny and appreciate that personal experience is a great guide, but can't the Blackcirles figures be relied on then?

[Roy231]

That only applies to external noise.

[GTX]

14 hours ago, shufman said:

Change the Falkens before anything. 
 

I put on Primacy 4s and noise dropped to normal levels and grip improved no end. Best thing I did. 
 

I wouldn’t accept a Corolla without changing the tyres 

Which tyre size do you have? Rim protection?

Thx

[shufman]

10 minutes ago, GTX said:

Which tyre size do you have? Rim protection?

Thx

Morning,

 

225/40 R 18 … not much rim protection from the Michelins so that’s a problem and I just nicked the near side front which annoys me when I think about it!

The lower the profile then the more sensitive to the road surface the car becomes. The Falkens just seemed to amplify rough surfaces a hell of a lot more and I found the level and sound frequency really problematic to deal with. Spoiled the car imo

I used the same noise level app with the same phone/speed/road etc and there was a 2/3 db drop at speed on rough tarmac that took the edge off and I can actually hear the rather average stereo now. 

[AisinW]

Tony's ide is right. Get 16" and it will be more comfortable, cheaper, and quieter. The handling is reduce a bit but the comfort increases a lot from 18 yo 16.  For the best rim protection, Goodyear is the best so far from 3 different summer tires I ever tried. Goodyear> Continental>Dunlop

[Roy231]

On 8/6/2023 at 11:17 AM, GTX said:

Which tyre size do you have? Rim protection?

Thx

18x225x40 the falkens do have rim protection.

[pmf]

I also have the Trek, I am still switching between original Falkens in summer and Michelin cross climates in winter. The cross climates in my opinion produce less road noise and do improve things. Not perfect, as others have mentioned, road noise is a common complaint in all Corolla TS models. I was also looking at sound insulation on boot floor but we'll see, as it seems a bit of a hassle. Definitely sticking to Michelin cross climates once the Falkens have worn out.

[AisinW]

Goodyear summer tires are cheaper than Michelin and has quieter and good treadwear 340 too.  Continental is pretty loud too. 

[fred88]

Where do you get the data regarding tyre noise? 

[AisinW]

17 hours ago, fred88 said:

Where do you get the data regarding tyre noise? 

It is on the tires specs "noise level" in dB.  However the freq. pitch may be different and how our ear sense it.   https://www.amazon.co.uk/Goodyear-EfficientGrip-Performance-Summer-Tire/dp/B00AZTVYJ2/ref=sr_1_2?crid=5M12MZ8WE0OF&keywords=goodyear+efficientgrip+performance+2&qid=1692624180&sprefix=goodyear+perfo%2Caps%2C85&sr=8-2

[fred88]

Ok, thanks, its just everyone says the Falkens are noisy but their dB rating is lower than most.

[TonyHSD]

Just now, fred88 said:

Ok, thanks, its just everyone says the Falkens are noisy but their dB rating is lower than most.

This is for drive by noise with idea to reduce noise pollution from the cars. The dB  is measured outside the car , usually near front tyre. , fender area. 
Often tires with higher ratings are in fact quieter with less noise transmission into the cabin. 
V shaped all seasoned and winter tyres are quieter on rough roads and noisier on smooth asphalt, where the typical summer tyres with straight lines are noisier on rough roads and quieter on smooth surfaces. For England with most of the roads in horrible condition and very rough these v shaped are probably best for road noise cancelling , but they have some negatives too, slightly heavier with higher rolling resistance and less bump absorbing ability due to the strength in their carcass structure. I personally do not like them at all. The best tyres for Toyota hybrids are touring summer tyres with straight lines and small gaps between the tread pattern, best comfort, best efficiency, best wet and dry performance, best braking capability, they only lack grip on snow and ice. , and lose comfort when temperatures goes down below 7C° . 

[Cyker]

As Tony says, the noise rating is how loud they are to people outside the car; Since they introduced the noise rating, I've been finding that tyres with lower noise ratings are actually noisier in the car, so I usually favour ones with higher noise ratings  

 

[AisinW]

I found new tires are always noisier if the are identically brand. It simply deeper tread patters, but it is softer on bumps too. 

That's why never buy low rolling resistance tires, because they start from shallower tread. 

[dcweather]

Not sure if some of the info here is scientifically fact or just subjective. What I do know is there are some well off people here! i can't contemplate changing the rims or buying 4 new tyres on a car i have just bought (Yaris Cross in my ccase but with same issues). The biggest problem is the ridiculous wheel and tyre size forced on you in te "luxury" Excel version. 18" wheels are noisier, bumpier and worse on fuel consumption - so why oh why do they put them on with no option.
Is it true that increasing the tyre pressure may reduce noise levels. I'd always assumed the opposite and as tyre becomes harder and more "drum" like at higher pressures?

[Cyker]

Unfortunately us lot that think smaller rims = better are vastly in the minority; Toyota would get criticised heavily by the automotive press and pretty much everybody if they put small rims on the top-spec model, as having ridiculously impractical giant rims is seen as a premium feature these days.

If you're not worried about bling, downsizing the rims isn't that bad - The steel rims for my Mk4 were about £50 each IIRC, and that was from the Toyota dealer!!

The TPMS sensors can just be swapped over, and then you just need a load of conical wheel nuts (The flat-faced alloy ones won't seat properly), and some wheel trims - The latter two can be had a lot cheaper from Halfords than the dealer, but I got them from the dealer because lazy.

Getting alloys is much more expensive...

[NxJohn]

An update:

I finally got around to replacing my front tyres (most noise seems to come from the front; I think the seats/trim damp the rear noise).

I did a lot of searching for quiet tyres, and noticed that tyre noise ratings didn't correlate at all with reviews.  Many owners reported noise problems or no improvement with so-called "quiet" tyres, so I based my decision mostly on owner experience, and settled for the Yokohama Advan dB V552. 

Owner experience was consistently good and technical data highlighted noise-reducing technology in the tread pattern.

I've only done a few miles so far, but it's clear they're an order of magnitude better than the awful Falkens (which are allegedly the same noise rating). 

The car is still noisy (and it will certainly be my last Toyota purely because of this) but the Yokohama tyres have made it, I suspect, as good as it can be.

[NxJohn]

On 8/6/2023 at 9:12 AM, fred88 said:

On Blackcircles the Falkens are shown as the same or quieter than the Primacy 4's. Not being funny and appreciate that personal experience is a great guide, but can't the Blackcirles figures be relied on then?

I don't think they can.  I read a lot of reviews of "quiet" tyres where owners complained of noise.  To choose, I selected several A-category tyres and checked lots of owners' comments.  Of all of them, only Yokohama had consistently good owner experience.

Now mine have done a few miles, it's clear just what a difference they've made.  They're supposed to be the same rating as the Falkens, but they're chalk and cheese.

I think also, I was right that the vast majority of the noise comes from the front, and even with Falkens still on the back it's clear the biggest bang for buck is changing front tyres.  

Looking at suggestions for soundproofing, you could spend a fortune for limited benefit, so my advice would be to change front tyres and accept that's as good as it gets.

I ordered through Blackcircles and got them fitted locally, which was a massive saving over garage prices, never mind dealers.

[Delta01]

There are “special” tyres against road noice, with foam inside. 
Think Goodyear has them maybe that can help with the problem.