YC Excel v. RAV4 PHEV how does it stack up....

[Lawnmowerman]

Nearly 1700 miles into YC ownership how is it stacking up?

Very well is the short answer.

I find the seats more comfortable for a start. And the HVAC controls fall more naturally to hand for me. Whilst no rocket ship, its overtaking abilities seem adequate for my needs. Only the o/s/f window switch is illuminated (and a faint blue at that) so not very visible. Radio reception surprised me in our local multi-storey - perfect (usually lose football coverage as I enter on a Saturday). Lost a physical button to switch off the radio - you need to adjust the volume from the steering wheel and then a speaker icon is displayed that you can tap to mute the radio (not clever - cheaper solution maybe - but not clever). Pleased that I didn't opt for the PVM option (8in. screen) the 9in. screen has much better resolution than the RAV. Noticed there are 'transparent foils' behind the front door handles to minimise scratching of the paint - nice touch 👍.

Only managed to get the tailgate 'kick' opener to work once - need to read the manual. Tried cruise control (once) scary - invoked lane centring (was like a pinball). Need to RTFM on that one. Tried the rear seats - this is definitely a 2+2. The aperture is tiny - once in its OK. Fortunately not a key consideration for me. Front seat belts are not adjustable for height - but they are perfectly positioned for me.

Economy? Now that's tricky, tank to tank it is averaging 68mpg - very impressive for our terrain. But, no doubt influenced by the lower average speeds achieved due to the amount of tourists on the road. The PHEV would manage about 75% of my daily commute in EV mode in the summer. Less than 50% in the winter. Given the variables of electric tariffs, I suspect the RAV could be marginally cheaper to run in those circumstances in the summer but more expensive in the winter. 

The boot floor arrangement - words fail me.

Finally, a big plus over the RAV - the rear screen stays much cleaner (much less use of the wiper required).

Anyone else with good or bad that I have missed?

[Graham47]

9 hours ago, Lawnmowerman said:

Lost a physical button to switch off the radio - you need to adjust the volume from the steering wheel and then a speaker icon is displayed that you can tap to mute the radio (not clever - cheaper solution

If you hold the top LH button (Home) for a couple of secs the display switches off.  It does, however, come on again next time the car is started.

[CruxisCore]

I believe one of the physical buttons on the steering wheel will also mute radio when held for a few seconds, but not sure which lol

[Vainona70]

It's the mode button. A long press until it beeps to mute radio or whatever. This works on Yaris & RAV4, so hopefully carried over to YC.

[TonyHSD]

Thanks William. 
How is the road noise and overall comfort in comparison to the rav4 ?
Can the Yaris cross be a good long drive car ? 
Thank you. 

[Lawnmowerman]

33 minutes ago, TonyHSD said:

Thanks William. 
How is the road noise and overall comfort in comparison to the rav4 ?
Can the Yaris cross be a good long drive car ? 
Thank you. 

Given that I am unable to sustain 70 mph for long (holiday traffic) it seems OK. I do think road noise is less - probably a tyre thing (narrower 18 in rubber as against wider 19 in rubber - of course tyre brand will be a factor). When stationary you hear passing traffic easily (no laminated side windows like the RAV). 

Comfort matches the RAV and I feel the seats are more comfortable.

[Lawnmowerman]

1 hour ago, Graham47 said:

If you hold the top LH button (Home) for a couple of secs the display switches off.  It does, however, come on again next time the car is started.

Ta - must scan the manual (though not keen on War & Peace).

[Lawnmowerman]

1 hour ago, CruxisCore said:

I believe one of the physical buttons on the steering wheel will also mute radio when held for a few seconds, but not sure which lol

Many thanks.

[Lawnmowerman]

50 minutes ago, Vainona70 said:

It's the mode button. A long press until it beeps to mute radio or whatever. This works on Yaris & RAV4, so hopefully carried over to YC.

Cheers - like to mute the sound so I don't hear the F1 results when I have recorded it.

[Lawnmowerman]

One thing I forgot - ABS is far better. The RAV scared the heck out of me when braking and you come to a broken surface - it just released the brakes. I have no idea how many yards it added to your braking distance but it certainly extended it.

No such issues under the same conditions I'm glad to say.

[Dezzer21]

I have same model and colour but I find the suspension very harsh and bumpy  dealers checked it typically says that’s what they’re like. Only thing I don’t like about it.

[Lawnmowerman]

Also, after the RAV I expected it to be as stable as a tent on wheels. Surprisingly not, we have had some belters of cross-winds recently and it was very stable 👍

[Mojo1010]

Nice, seems very well stacked up v the rav. In a few years the YC 130 will be high on my list to get. 

[Tommy X]

No interior rear courtesy light,now that is penny pinching, a lot of tyre/road noise especially from the rear, soundproofing virtually non existent, the split boards in the boot would have been better on all models rather than the cheap flimsy boot liner on Design/ Icon, who at Toyota thought it a good idea to restrict rear vision with those rear headrests, I remove mine and replace when needed, would have liked a proper rear parcel shelf, engine noise under acceleration takes a bit of getting used to but this is one of the easiest cars I have owned to drive, love the smooth ecvt and the steering and handling are great, fun to drive.      

[RonYarisX]

It's a long one - sorry.

I was going to wait another week before posting my initial thoughts but will use the above as it highlights some differences. I'd point out I'm not the main driver ( just the accountant !  🤣 ) and the car was purchased for mainly short distances around town with one person on-board. The main driver is absolutley in love with the car so whatever I have to say dosn't matter a jot.

Seats: I find them very comfortable. Plenty of shoulder room and a lumbar adjustment which actually works ( though only horizontally which means it won't suit different height drivers ). So glad we opted for the suede-like seat material.

Controls: There's far too many of them on the steering wheel. Like the steering wheel itself, not overly chunky. The buttons on the climate are pretty small. Plenty of other manufacturers have better ergonomics.

9" Infotainment: I actually like watching the power display which is lucky for me because I can't find anything else good to say about the rest of it. I think the resolution is crap, there are far too many uneccessary messages pop up, the reverse camera resolution is yuck, the lines aren't dynamic and if you keep the red line away from the kerb, you find yourself parked in the middle of the road. Those guidelines are way out. When I park say parallel a foot away from the kerb, the reverse guidlines are actually on the pavement !   I'll need to drive another YC to see if that's the same.

Parking: Well if the reverse camera is useless...  The door mirrors are mounted low so I don't find the view clear. And coming from VW where the mirrors auto dip when reversing, the Toyotas do not so I can't see the kerb therefore have to rely on the low res camera with non-dynamic guidlines that are out. It stinks of cheapness IMO. 

Radio reception. Again, crap. I was setting up the radio for the driver and was amazed at the lack of available stations. Went to our Skoda parked next to it and there had to be at least 50% more stations available. And where as I can bring up all available stations in a single list on the Skoda, Toyota ( like other japanese brands I might add ) seem to group them, why, what's the purpose of that? So searching for a particular station can be a right pain. Why not just have everything in alphabetical order?  Was also surprised about the sound. I've always thought the std systems in Japanese cars OK but the system lacks clarity. I've played around with the settings but I just don't rate it. Again they've used the cheapest of the cheap.

Boot: This was one of the main reason we bough the car. For our needs it's perfectly shaped, much better than any other cars not only in this class but many the class above. The dual floor split arrangement is weird, a very cheap solution, but at least it works. For our needs it's actually better to have one half of the floor at ground level and the other half raised which at least means you can access the underfloor area without having to remove or use a hand to hold up one section. The 40/20/40 split rear seat is a nice touch. But as for the rubber protectors...  awful, simply awful design. First thing I had to do was take scissors to the floor mat for it to fit properly. The middle protector covers the rear cupholders. It's all rather stupid.

Economy: Far too early days to say but initial thoughts are it's improved around 10mpg over a VW 1.5tsi.

Ride quality: I'm pleasently surprised. Didnt expect much from what I'd read about the GR Sport,was kinda expecting the Ford experience of it crashing thru potholes but nope, none of that. It goes over a level crossing with no drama whatsoever. Was only able to test drive an Excel which I felt a little bouncy, but think ride in YC GR is one of it's better qualities. It's a thumbs up from me.

Engine: It's surprisingly sprightly off the mark up to speed limit around town and is way powerful enough for the pupose it was intended. The least said about faster roads the better but the car was never bought for that purpose. I'd also add the car produces substantial wind noise at motoway speeds, something I haven't really noticed in many cars. If I was a betting man, I'd say they knew they had a problem and applied a cheap solution. Look at the A-pillar beside the mirror and on the door you'll see a 2" ridge in the plastic trim, that'll be to counteract the main design for aerodynamics. I don't see that on any other Toyota. For those who can remember, it's akin to when Ford first launched the Sierra, they too had to modify the design soon after launch when folk started complaining about the aerodynamics which in their case caused stability issues.

The petrol engine is much louder than I remember on the test drive and diesel-like when accelerating with any revs. The gearbox is just plain weird. It sounds like it's holding on to revs when accelerating, so much so, I'm looking to manully paddleshift.  Which brings me on to my biggest gripe of all...

Quality:  Shockingly poor. No wonder there's cabin noise. Pulling the boot cubby door where the jack sits - I though it was going to snap off. That plastic is so thin. I'm sure Toyota will call it weight saving. The doors, especially the rear, close with a tinny sounding ping that I have not heard in any other car, not even the cheapest airport rental car. (It'll be weight saving again). many years ago I used to install hifi systems in cars, and removing/replacng trim is a great way to see how well a car is built. ( hand washiing it is another ) I had to remove some trim to install the Dashcam. It's easy to see why reliability is so good in japanese cars when you look a the wiring looms and the way they're protected and routed and this Toyota is no exception. I also found it hard to find a ground simply because there was no bare metal - everything had been coated in paint and had a protective layer over it. I had to remove a small area of paint to get that ground - can't think of any car I've had to to that with. I can say for fact that even Mercedes aren't finished to this quality - it's impressive.

Less impressive though are the plastics. Removing say the glovebox is very easy, you just bend plastic. Of course that has obvious knock on effects. I'm shocked it's so cheaply built. One look at the carpets and it's plainy obvious why the cabin is noisy - there's zero sound proofing. Cheap thin nasty carpeting material with no sound proofing, what do you expect? The headlining - you don't need any trim tools to pull that back as there's enough of a gap to just push the wirng in from the Dashcam. Gaps allow noise thru. Lower trim pieces are held in place with plastic nuts. Plastic nuts WTF.

I'll stop there. All of this could be forgiven in say the cheapest Dacia be we're now talking of a car that exceeds £30k. The driver is happy which is the only thing that matters and as the accountant I was very happy with the deal, but if the car was to be used by say more that two people and out-of-town, I wouldn't go near it with a barge pole, there are far better built cars I'd chose for that purpose.  I'm just shocked how cheap the whole thing feels. They couldn't even be ar5ed to put felt or rubber in the cup holders or glovebox or any other cubby for that matter. 

Edit: Two last gripes: 

I found the analogue faced dash difficult to read. Changing from analogue display to digital display helped but unlike VW Group, I can't configure the information I want to see displayed, rather Toyota give you a small selection to choose from.

And finally, vision. As a driver I have less than half a windscreen to my left. Why such a large rear mirror? There's hardly any windscreen from the top of the dashboard to to bottom of the rear mirror so forward visibility is the worst of any car I've ever driven. It's supposed to be an SUV not a Lotus Esprit.

 

 

 

 

 

[Cyker]

re. the reversing line,s yeah they are not help for parking against a kerb, but I've discovered they're positioned for most parking bays - I find in most bays the lines will lay perfectly on the parking bay lines when I reverse into it.

The general material quality isn't anywhere near the germans or even the french - They've clearly ploughed the lions' share of the budget into the drivetrain and reliability! But as compromises go, I'm fine with that rather than having it the other way round, which is what most other manufacturers do now (Hence the decline of the german reputation for reliability. The french marques never had one of those to begin with so no change there  )

 

[Primus1]

I agree with most of what’s said, coming from a ford puma I had a few concerns, the megabox in the puma is a really clever idea, but I find the yc arrangement not too bad, I could hide the shopping bags in the megabox, but they fit ok under the split floor,, I was worried about the noise but I’m finding it’s ok, not really any noisier than the puma , the rear doors were a concern regarding access but as we only carry the mil she finds it ok, the radio, is a pleasant surprise as well, coming from a b&o equipped car with a subwoofer I don’t find it bad at all, in fact, as I listen to local radio, I’m finding the dab doesn’t drop out, unlike the puma which could only be listened to via fm, I’ve not been on any long runs as yet so can’t comment on the noise on, say, a motorway, but as we don’t rush, there’s no need to push on, the seats are comfortable and the controls easy to use, it’s our first auto, and we both love it, my wife finds it so easy to drive, I suspect the Lexus lax will be a much quieter car, but this will reflect in the price…

[Lawnmowerman]

Hi Ron

I don't know which grade you have. The Excel offers a City Pack for £100 which includes a Panoramic View Monitor and it also includes reversing guide lines (PVM much sought after by RAV customers). I didn't choose this option as you got the earlier 8in. screen - that may have tipped you over the edge.

Personally, coming from a technical background I can forgive most because of their fabulous ECVT transmission based on an epicyclic design - extremely robust. 

[Primus1]

I forgot to mention mine has the city pack, I find it really useful when reversing ( not that I have any problems reversing as I drove vans for 30 years) I don’t think the screen is bad at all, the kick activation works perfectly for me , unlike the ford where it looked like you were auditioning for riverdance, the traffic sign works flawlessly, again unlike my previous car which could be linked to the speed limiter, fun if you were travelling at 30 and it picked up the 20 sign in an adjoining street, ( which it often did, when it worked) , I think any car is going to have it’s little idiosyncrasies, they’re all different..

[Lawnmowerman]

Kick activation working perfectly now that I have read the manual 🤣

[CruxisCore]

I think the Yaris (and Yaris Cross and Aygo X) current steering wheel is hands down the best I have ever used. I find it has just the right amount of buttons and they actually make sense. There is no steering wheel from Toyota at least I'd take over this steering wheel, but maybe thats just me.

I just test drove the new Prius too, that was... an interesting button layout.

[TonyHSD]

3 hours ago, CruxisCore said:

I think the Yaris (and Yaris Cross and Aygo X) current steering wheel is hands down the best I have ever used. I find it has just the right amount of buttons and they actually make sense. There is no steering wheel from Toyota at least I'd take over this steering wheel, but maybe thats just me.

I just test drove the new Prius too, that was... an interesting button layout.

Lol, the new Prius, how lucky you are. 
Would you like to share some experience with us? Dashboard and steering wheel, sound proofing, general feel and fuel consumption, performance? Everything will be very helpful. We are not going to get one here but the new chr will be very similar. 
Thank you. 

[CruxisCore]

7 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

Lol, the new Prius, how lucky you are. 
Would you like to share some experience with us? Dashboard and steering wheel, sound proofing, general feel and fuel consumption, performance? Everything will be very helpful. We are not going to get one here but the new chr will be very similar. 
Thank you. 

It was just like a 30 min drive for the fun of it as Im not really in the market for a plug-in (we dont get the HEV version at all) since I have nowhere to charge.

I did try to switch it into some auto HV/EV mode but it still didnt use the ICE, so cant say anything about the ICE as I drove fully with electricity.

The dash is really cool and the new infotainment seemed to match. No idea how functional it really is, I feel most car related things are probably still in the dash and surprisingly little outside navigation in the actual infotainment.

I only drove 80 km/h speed at best and it seemed pretty typical in the CHR/Corolla-category as far as sound proofing goes (read: nothing to write home about, but you can live with it). The steering wheel, as I mentioned, felt really busy and I wonder why Toyota doesnt have any sort of baseline. Basically every single category of cars has its totally own and different steering wheel setup. I personally think the Yaris one (including Aygo X) is hands down the best as I wrote. But im sure you get used to this too, but it feels like everything was shuffled just for the sake of it 😄

I cant say it was that much of a "Wow, gotta have one!", but more like "Yep, this is a sweet Toyota". In that test I cant feel any difference with 4th and 5th gen hybrids and tbh the plugin part probably makes it moot anyways. If I was in the market for a plugin hybrid in that form factor, it would definitely be attractive. It looks almost like a sports car.

The "gear stick" was all new to me and felt weird. I guess many thinks its better than what for example Yaris Cross had but I feel YC has it much simpler. The Prius one to me felt like they had to redesign it to be weird just.. to have it redesigned 😄 Sorta same with as with the steering wheel, I dont see how its anywhere near an improvement, but at least its different.

Could easily tell its a one-up on the Yaris Cross though, as interior quality and overall quality (and well, as a plugin its made in japan) is definitely higher than on the Yaris Cross. That said, I dont feel current CHR was in most ways much higher quality to the Yaris Cross, which is why I chose YC over CHR although I initially thought ill pick the CHR.

Not much help with the above opinions, but I think the baseline for Prius and new CHR etc will be that it will definitely be a fine car with worthy upgrades in pretty much everything. It likely wont blow anyone away although it feels like it has taken some of the extra focus on interior design the frenchies tend to have and put it into a Toyota. But in general it's still the Toyota we know and love and be a damn fine one at that too.

[Roy124]

The steering wheel functions ln Corolla and Yaris Cross are the same.  However the YC switches are better defined and easy to operate than the Corolla.   Unlike the Corolla, you can adjust the YC ACC in 1 mph increments. 

[CruxisCore]

Dunno about Corolla but i recall CHR buttons being really mushy. Like a cheap toy feeling while Yaris/Aygo has really satisfying feel to them, maybe what you mean by defined too?