12v battery maintenance, issues, etc.

[Cyker]

I would have liked that as an option - I think they should just produce one body type instead of two (i.e. the current pano-roof/no-pano-roof) and if you don't want the pano roof stick a solar panel where the pano roof would have gone!  

You can get very cheap low efficiency solar panels that are literally printed onto a flexible polymer substrate so they are light and can even conform to the existing double-bubble shape of the non-pano roofs.

It could charge the 12v and maybe even supply some power to the traction Battery - While a solar panel on a roof the size of a Yaris' isn't going to output much power, when the traction Battery is only 700Wh (0.7kWh!) capacity, it's a sizeable fraction!

I'm surprised EVs don't have such things as standard, especially given how massive their footprints are - It'd be a drop in the bucket of their massive 70kWh batteries but free power is free power, and if you get stranded somewhere at least it'd be able to put in some power to get you going!

[anchorman]

You can switch the later ones on remotely from anywhere in the world if it needs a little boost.  A reasonable prediction of the weather will minimise the engine running.  

[Roy124]

2 hours ago, anchorman said:

You can switch the later ones on remotely from anywhere in the world if it needs a little boost.  A reasonable prediction of the weather will minimise the engine running.  

You need to be a bit canny there.  Set the conditioning too low, or even off, and the engine won't run.

Too low could be 21 degrees even on cooler days as the closed car can soon become warm enough to cut out the heater.

Running at local dawn will catch the coolest period.  Hit one of our tropical episodes- typically while you shiver in Maderia- and you could dip out.

[hind]

10 hours ago, Cyker said:

I would have liked that as an option - I think they should just produce one body type instead of two (i.e. the current pano-roof/no-pano-roof) and if you don't want the pano roof stick a solar panel where the pano roof would have gone! 

Toyota already did this for Prius on JDM 

So it's definitely doable and not by a crazy DIYer with an angle grinder 😄 

[trashman1965]

I'm sure I remember it as an option on UK cars some years back. Was pretty pricey from what I recall.

[Auris Geezer]

As a low milage user, less than 50 miles a week, and having fitted a flylead to the battery+ and a local earth for my CTEK 5.0 smart charger, how often does "the collective" think I should put it on charge for please?  It's the original Battery.

Cheers, Trev.

[Chas G]

I note that Battery issues seem to have reduced now that the weather is warmer. Be interesting to see how 12 volt brick gets on when it's 25 deg C and ac gets turned on.

[Dezzer21]

Got in mine this morning after 14 days standing turned on and started no problem.👍

[Roy124]

5 hours ago, Auris Geezer said:

As a low milage user, less than 50 miles a week, and having fitted a flylead to the battery+ and a local earth for my CTEK 5.0 smart charger, how often does "the collective" think I should put it on charge for please?  It's the original battery.

Cheers, Trev.

Trevor,

The first point is how much time do you spend in Ready mode to drive 50 miles?  If it is 2 legs, each 40 minutes you should not have a problem.  If it is 10x5 miles the start sequence means you need a bit more charging time. 

If you give one overnight charge per week that will avoid most problems.   Longer once a week, better still.

[Dala]

8 hours ago, Auris Geezer said:

As a low milage user, less than 50 miles a week, and having fitted a flylead to the battery+ and a local earth for my CTEK 5.0 smart charger, how often does "the collective" think I should put it on charge for please?  It's the original battery.

Cheers, Trev.

With the CTEK smart charger, it is not a problem to always leave it connected to the car Battery and disconnect it before driving.

[Derek.w]

8 hours ago, Auris Geezer said:

As a low milage user, less than 50 miles a week, and having fitted a flylead to the battery+ and a local earth for my CTEK 5.0 smart charger, how often does "the collective" think I should put it on charge for please?  It's the original battery.

Cheers, Trev.

CTEK charger for low users twice or three times a week, I am finding that in the another option is solar charging if the car is outside but for how many months before I return to mains charging only time will tell for my location we just have to wait and see.

I attatch picture of my last 15 days short trips & solar charging>

Yes its still an ongoing project.

[Roy124]

@Derek.w that sawtooth graph shows a steady drop in immediate start voltage (a downward slope) taking each low point.  I have noticed a similar negative gradient with regular short trips.

The time in Ready mode meets the recommendation but has less benefit than a straight hour in Ready mode or an hours driving.

My conclusion is regular charging is the best solution if your driving is made up of short trips, say 15-20 minutes. 

[Derek.w]

12 hours ago, Roy124 said:

@Derek.w that sawtooth graph shows a steady drop in immediate start voltage (a downward slope) taking each low point.  I have noticed a similar negative gradient with regular short trips.

The time in Ready mode meets the recommendation but has less benefit than a straight hour in Ready mode or an hours driving.

My conclusion is regular charging is the best solution if your driving is made up of short trips, say 15-20 minutes. 

The down drop to around the 12 volt mark is because of the small capacity Battery Mutlu 35Ah  & a lot of short trips for my tipical day.

 

 

[Graham47]

54 minutes ago, Derek.w said:

because of the small capacity battery Mutlu 35Ah 

I thought you fitted a higher capacity (Yuasa ?) Battery some time ago following dead Battery problems ?

 

am using EFB calcium type battery Not sure if yours will be the same my replacment is 

Yuasa HSB202 Part no YBX5202  45AH cca 440 amps the old one was just 35AH.

https://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/topic/217673-12v-battery-maintenance-issues-etc/page/60/#comment-1731946

 

[Derek.w]

Yes Graham47 I fitted a Yuasa Battery but I have removed it to cary out a reconditioning 

desulphation on it when I have time after setting up my solar charger I will refit it.

As you can see the Battery in not dead just not good at holding a charge under a small car hibination mode.

Maybe you like to see a daily brakedown of a number of small trips.

Note no voltage drop to 12 volts on the first stop start set.

 

[Graham47]

10 hours ago, Derek.w said:

As you can see the battery in not dead just not good at holding a charge under a small car hibination mode.

Quite honestly, I don’t see anything.

Posting various graphs is fine but sometimes some explanation of what you’re trying to demonstrate is needed 🤔

No idea what those spikes are and why the fact that the Battery level seems to return to its previous (12.4v) level is seen as some sort of fault ?
Surely if you suspect this (new) Yuasa Battery is now faulty then the thing to do is get it tested and get a warranty return ?

[Derek.w]

12 hours ago, Graham47 said:

Quite honestly, I don’t see anything.

Posting various graphs is fine but sometimes some explanation of what you’re trying to demonstrate is needed 🤔

No idea what those spikes are and why the fact that the battery level seems to return to its previous (12.4v) level is seen as some sort of fault ?
Surely if you suspect this (new) Yuasa battery is now faulty then the thing to do is get it tested and get a warranty return ?

OK Grayham47 Look at the first start stop cycle no voltage drop down to 12 volts.

Then look at the second start stop cycle voltage drops to 12 volts because it has not recoverd in the short time period.

Thats what I am pointing out. The third cycle has less voltage drop so a improvment in recovery from the second set.

[Graham47]

@Derek.w thank you for coming back to explain. 👍

[Cowgirl]

I would like some advice, I used to drive my car for 45 minutes morning and evening, due to a change of circumstances it’s now 10 minutes morning and evening. During the day I use a solar charger sunny or not.

Last weekend I drove it for approximately 2 x 25 minutes then put it in ready mode for an hour. Today it’s been solar charging all day (bright sunshine). Tonight my voltmeter in the cigarette lighter showed 14.5 when I turned it on but then dropped to 12.8 intermittently going up to 14.3. Is this because my Battery is fully charged or it’s knackered. Previously no Battery issues on original Battery at just over 2 years old.

[Roy124]

Perfectly normal. Fully charged as you surmised. 

[Derek.w]

3 hours ago, Cowgirl said:

I would like some advice, I used to drive my car for 45 minutes morning and evening, due to a change of circumstances it’s now 10 minutes morning and evening. During the day I use a solar charger sunny or not.

Last weekend I drove it for approximately 2 x 25 minutes then put it in ready mode for an hour. Today it’s been solar charging all day (bright sunshine). Tonight my voltmeter in the cigarette lighter showed 14.5 when I turned it on but then dropped to 12.8 intermittently going up to 14.3. Is this because my battery is fully charged or it’s knackered. Previously no battery issues on original battery at just over 2 years old.

Hi a reading of 12.8 just means Battery is fully charged so DC charger or altinator electronics has switched itself off when voltage again drops to 12.4 or 12.5 charging circuit will turn. 

[Cyker]

Yeah, a lot of newer Toyotas, even the ones with alternators, stop charging the Battery when it's full to save energy/reduce engine load - When that happens it drops to the normal Battery output of 12.whatever volts.

Then when it drops a bit it'll start charging it back up again - It's what's called cyclic-charging, rather than the more traditional float-charging, which just holds it at the 14.whatever charge voltage the whole time.

 

[Chas G]

100 pages in this thread.

Anyone would think there was a problem with Yaris Hybrid 12 volt batteries. 🤔

[hind]

How much of it are posts written by the people who actually have a problem? 😉

[RickyC]

58 minutes ago, Cyker said:

Yeah, a lot of newer Toyotas, even the ones with alternators, stop charging the battery when it's full to save energy/reduce engine load - When that happens it drops to the normal battery output of 12.whatever volts.

Then when it drops a bit it'll start charging it back up again - It's what's called cyclic-charging, rather than the more traditional float-charging, which just holds it at the 14.whatever charge voltage the whole time.

 

The only thing that is not clear to me is why the charging voltage drops of about a Volt moving gear from a drive position ( D, B, R ) to a stationary one ( N or P ) to regain a V when returning in a drive position.