12v battery maintenance, issues, etc.

[CruxisCore]

42 minutes ago, MikeSh said:

If that is sustained it would completely deplete a fully charged 45Ah battery in 9 days. It would probably be unable to start the car in a couple of days less. 

Someone found that the parasitic drain considerably drops at like 36h or something of the car not being used. I guess it kinda keeps it awake for daily driving, but if it seems thats not hte case it likely drops certain things out. So at like 99% certainty its easy to say that the drain from last use to 2h of sitting in the car with a multimeter isnt the same drain you would witness over a few days of it sitting.

That said, 9 days to deplete it (that said, all new Yaris come with 35 Ah) doesnt sound too far off from real experiences. But people have managed several weeks with no problems too, so an actual full Battery isnt being drained in several weeks. Problem is that most people dont have actually full batteries before that several week downtime before a vacation or whatnot.

On another note: I think it's completely futile to go like "my 2005 whatever could do 4 months and still start fine". Yeah, so did mine, but also my 2005 whatever had a fraction of the features I very much like to have. It's the exact same as if one was to complain like "my old Nokia from 1990s could do 2 weeks between charging and this new thing only does one day if lucky". Surely that is true, but kinda ignores the part how that 90s Nokia did nothing but calls and SMS while modern smartphones have more processing power than what they flew to moon with. I guess for now every tech comes with it's downsides. With EVs it's limited range and limited chance to quickly refill. With hybrids it's probably this, with ICE-only cars its the consumption.

[Dala]

Other parasitic drain values 37 minutes after engine off and car locked 150mA.  In 93 minutes the value is higher 160 to 180 mA.  Parasitic drain has increased. That car really does what it wants.The previous chart is from the same day.

[TopGeek]

2 hours ago, Dala said:

Other parasitic drain values 37 minutes after engine off and car locked 150mA.  In 93 minutes the value is higher 160 to 180 mA.  Parasitic drain has increased. That car really does what it wants.

 

That suggests the car electronics are continuing to run processes while apparently 'asleep'. Open to speculation!

[CruxisCore]

4 minutes ago, TopGeek said:

That suggests the car electronics are continuing to run processes while apparently 'asleep'. Open to speculation!

Most certainly. The car is not only sniffing about for some keyless entry stuff, but its also constantly connected to the cloud, which is what allows you to check that you remembered to lock your doors or start the AC remotely etc. I suspect it sometimes might also upload your trips and whatnot after the ride if it didnt manage to do it while driving

[CPN]

6 hours ago, Dala said:

IConsumption after 2 hours 210 mA.

At that rate, my 35Ah Battery would be flat in slightly less than 14 days... (35,280mA) 😮

(if it was just sat idle of course)

[MikeSh]

1 hour ago, CPN said:

At that rate, my 35Ah battery would be flat in slightly less than 14 days... (35,280mA) 😮

(if it was just sat idle of course)

<7 days.  210mA×24h×7=35,280mAh=35.28Ah.

[Derek.w]

Dala

My clamp on ammeter wont give a accurate reading that low it be just such a small movment on the scale maybe time for a digital clamp meter auto ranging off-course.

Did you go to the car with the key in your pocket so waking up the car?

More to the point is 210 milliamps dranage high for a modern car in sleep mode?.

 

[CruxisCore]

That is actually a good point too, it's also a problem dealers have in showrooms if they keep the keys in the car as the car is definitely more awake with the key around.

[CPN]

1 hour ago, MikeSh said:

<7 days.  210mA×24h×7=35,280mAh=35.28Ah.

You're right! My maths isn't what it used to be!🤣

[Dala]

7 minutes ago, Derek.w said:

.....My clamp on ammeter wont give a accurate reading that low it be just such a small movment on the scale maybe time for a digital clamp meter auto ranging off-course....

Inexpensive clamp multimeters do not have a scale for measuring current with low values. I chose Clamp Meter HP-7200APP. DC Current up to 60A has a resolution of 0.01A. It has a bluetooth connection. I didn't want to be locked in the car for the measurement.  😄 

7 minutes ago, Derek.w said:

...Did you go to the car with the key in your pocket so waking up the car?...

Not when measuring. This would affect the measurement result. Only when opening the car and measuring current at start. bluetooth works at about 20-30 meters.

7 minutes ago, Derek.w said:

...More to the point is 210 milliamps dranage high for a modern car in sleep mode?..

I haven't had time for long-term measurements yet. In the future, I would like to do a test that shows the values after several hours and days of the car being parked. I hope they are smaller. If 150 to 210 mA is too much or too little in modern cars? I really do not know. But the measured values correspond in percentage to the voltage drop I have measured in the past.

[anchorman]

10 hours ago, Tommy X said:

 

Roy, not sure what you mean by "crack on" but you seem to have a problem with the fact that I use the jump start terminal to charge the 12v battery which I find convenient, I don't need to get my dealer to connect a lead to the battery I a capable of doing it myself, I took the advice of my dealer which for me is a possible solution to not getting a no start, there are multiple repeat posts on this subject which haven't bothered me, we are all entitled to an opinion 

I much prefer to use the under bonnet connection too.  

[Derek.w]

Dala Thanks for the photo I noted the bend on the wire will also effect your reading but you can ovecome that by putting a non conducting box under your meter.

[jthspace]

If it's an infrequent issue then a lithium "booster" will quickly attach to the under bonnet connection and also has the advantage of being able to be stored in the boot for use anywhere. Whereas a connection to the Battery under the rear seat has the advantage of being able to be connected to a mains charger at home, slightly more awkward to connect a booster pack quickly.

Both options have advantages so maybe a "belt and braces" solution would be to get a lithium booster pack and keep it in the boot and have a lead connected and tucked under the rear seat as well.

BTW - and I did it on my Eunos (MK5) where the Battery is tucked away in the boot, if you are taking a spanner to the + terminal, wrap it in insulation tape to keep it away from bodywork. A spanner will quickly weld itself to (in my case) the hinge of the boot lid on the Eunos. Hammered it off but it destroyed the Gel Battery. 😳

[TopGeek]

1 hour ago, anchorman said:

I much prefer to use the under bonnet connection too.  

Same here, partly because it's too much hassle to fit the extension lead to the Battery and partly because I don't like the idea of having a loose lead dangling under the back seat.

[Roy124]

21 hours ago, Tommy X said:

 

Roy, not sure what you mean by "crack on" but you seem to have a problem with the fact that I use the jump start terminal to charge the 12v battery which I find convenient, I don't need to get my dealer to connect a lead to the battery I a capable of doing it myself, I took the advice of my dealer which for me is a possible solution to not getting a no start, there are multiple repeat posts on this subject which haven't bothered me, we are all entitled to an opinion 

No criticism intended Tommy. 'Crack on' is a fairly common slang for carry on.

I am not implying that you could not wire up a lead to the Battery.   My suggestion of getting the dealer to do it was that access to the Battery on the YC is not easy.  In my case I have a gravel drive and kneeling, even with a mat, can be painful.

[Roy124]

9 hours ago, TopGeek said:

 I don't like the idea of having a loose lead dangling under the back seat.

If I was younger, and planning to keep the car for some years, I would drill the plastic and mount a 12v socket connected to the Battery.  Live feed if needed and plug in the charger as required.

 

[jthspace]

11 minutes ago, Roy124 said:

If I was younger, and planning to keep the car for some years, I would drill the plastic and mount a 12v socket connected to the battery.  Live feed if needed and plug in the charger as required.

 

That's an idea...... ✅

[Roy124]

11 hours ago, jthspace said:

If it's an infrequent issue then a lithium "booster" will quickly attach to the under bonnet connection and also has the advantage of being able to be stored in the boot for use anywhere.

I store mine under the bonnet.  There is a large ledge in the Yaris Cross ahead of the radiator.  It sits there quite happily.

On other cars I have used space under the bonnet for all manner of things.  Perhaps the most bizarre was an Hibachi BBQ and bag of charcoal in the wing of a SAAB 99.

[RickyC]

19 minutes ago, Roy124 said:

I store mine under the bonnet.  There is a large ledge in the Yaris Cross ahead of the radiator.  It sits there quite happily

Under the bonnet?   I think it's too hot there and it's exposed to water.

[Roy124]

@RickyC, I checked.   That shelf is ahead of the radiator and bone dry as is the rest of the engine bay.

Gone are the days, it seems, of an open engine bay where you can see the ground qugite easily.   Don't drop anything inntge Yaris, you will probably never see it again. 

PS, the BBQ never caught fire and towels we used to stow in the SAAB stayed dry too.

[CruxisCore]

I got the electric boot so I'll rather not stash mine there. I dont use the glove box for much so it'll be a fine place as any for it I suppose. At least easier to get than out of a dead boot.

[jthspace]

34 minutes ago, CruxisCore said:

I got the electric boot so I'll rather not stash mine there. I dont use the glove box for much so it'll be a fine place as any for it I suppose. At least easier to get than out of a dead boot.

Never thought of that!

[Cyker]

Personally, I think if it's just for the occasional 'jump' then you're better off using the under-bonnet post.

If it's a regular problem or also used for constant trickle charging, then I'd start thinking about a dedicated connector...

 

[chazbri]

Ive read the ideas and advice given but all I want is for my Cross to work without any Battery charging extras. My travel needs may be decreasing as I get older and perhaps Toyota Hybrids are not the correct choice of car for me. Ive had Hybids for the last 6 years or so and the issues discussed here are making me think more about changing types. Any advice?

[Max_Headroom]

20 minutes ago, chazbri said:

Ive read the ideas and advice given but all I want is for my Cross to work without any battery charging extras.

Exactly and this is why in my opinion its dishonest when sales staff do not to warn potential hybrid customers that low usage may cause this issue.