Confused fella buying Corolla ......

[Dewi 24]

Hello to one and all, first timer here. I didn't know forums still existed - it makes a refreshing change from the usual FB rubbish I must say 😁. 

I'm in the market for a late model 1.8 Corolla, Preferably around 12 months old, so I've been scouring the ads on Autotrader etc and noticed there's been an upgrade and that we're now on the 5th generation of Corolla which has the 138bhp engine plus a few other changes. So far the 5th Gen ones I've seen are a bit outside of my budget but I'm not against having the previous 4th Gen model as it's only going to be our daily driver - and I have a 1970's Classic Mini and MGB GT for the fun days. 

What I'm curious about is; looking at the specs of the 4th Gen Corollas I've noticed that some of the very last registered ones (2022 /72 plate) are listed as being 138bhp, so being a nerdy kinda chap and thinking it was an error I did some research by going through the adverts & dealer websites and came up with a list (which I won't bore you with) which shows that from approx mid Oct 2022 onward there was indeed a switch over of some kind and the Corollas started being listed as 138bhp. Up to around the end of Sept they were still being listed as 120bhp.

My question is - was a version of the later engine fitted to the "run out" 4th Gen models (I know some car makers do put odd bits and pieces on their run out models) or is it a mistake in the ads? If it is an error there's a heck of a lot of them and it's too coincidental that the change should come so suddenly to a lot of cars. Plus, I would imagine that if the dealers were advertising 120bhp cars as 138bhp they'd be leaving themslves open to litigation? There are quite a few of them around - even at Toyota main dealers - listed as 138bhp.  In fact I'm going to see a rather nice looking low miles one soon at my local main dealer, It was registered on the  8th Dec '22, a pre 5th Gen "Design" model.  Meanwhile if anyone can throw any light on my little mystery I'd be gratefull if you could educate me.  T.I.A

 

Confused old bloke, Lancashire 😊

[drykoke]

Unfortunately I am in the same boat as you are. I have extensively researched the dealer listings and they are wrong. 

I confirmed that they were the old engine because I keyed in the number plate registration details into the government database. The new model has CO2 of around 105. The old engine models are well above that CO2 in their official registration details.

[TonyHSD]

Hi, 

I believe it might be an listing error rather than there are any late 2022 Corolla fitted with gen5 hybrid system. When Toyota switch manufacturing they discontinued the ongoing model then start production of the next version. Perhaps there are members that works within the dealer network and they can confirm that. 
To recognise the gen 5 hybrid Corolla vs gen4 hybrids Corolla you can look the headlights and dashboard instruments. The later model 2023 gen 5 138bhp has projector headlights on all models except icon trim, and all trims comes with a digital dashboard clusters, larger infotainment screens. 
Also 2023 gen5 hybrids Corolla appear to have slightly higher ground clearance in comparison to previous models. 👍 

[Dewi 24]

Yes, I also noted that the CO2 levels were different between the 4th & 5th Gens and did wonder. What I found interesting though was that there was quitea definite time period when the 138bhp was starting to be listed so it makes me wonder why all the dealers should suddenly be doing the same thing at the same time - i.e the last quarter of 2022 and the first month or so of '23 where pretty much all of the Gen 4 cars were being listed as 138bhp. Here's a snippet of the list I made (not sure it'll load here but I'll give it a go) and you'll see what I mean. Also note the difference in CO2 between the Icon and the Design. As I say, if this is a mistake then surely the dealers are leaving themselves open to a lot of complaints and even litigation if people bought a car on the strength of it being advertised as more powerful than it actually is

Corolla date b.odt

[drykoke]

5th Gen Production only began mid December 

https://www.greencarcongress.com/2022/12/20221220-tme.html

DevonAygo (works at a Toyota dealership) reported to this forum that he received his 5th Gen car in mid February 2023. 

So, to be on the safe side, I have started limiting my search to March 2023 onwards because I want the 5th Gen hybrid.

I don't feel it's very likely that they would have put in a completely new powertrain into the production line of an old model.

[Don Mac]

3 hours ago, TonyHSD said:

Hi, 

I believe it might be an listing error rather than there are any late 2022 Corolla fitted with gen5 hybrid system. When Toyota switch manufacturing they discontinued the ongoing model then start production of the next version. Perhaps there are members that works within the dealer network and they can confirm that. 
To recognise the gen 5 hybrid Corolla vs gen4 hybrids Corolla you can look the headlights and dashboard instruments. The later model 2023 gen 5 138bhp has projector headlights on all models except icon trim, and all trims comes with a digital dashboard clusters, larger infotainment screens. 
Also 2023 gen5 hybrids Corolla appear to have slightly higher ground clearance in comparison to previous models. 👍 

I find the central infotainment screen to be the quickest way to tell - Gen 4 has a knob, Gen 5 just has 3 buttons underneath, no knob.

[Dewi 24]

1 hour ago, drykoke said:

5th Gen Production only began mid December 

https://www.greencarcongress.com/2022/12/20221220-tme.html

DevonAygo (works at a Toyota dealership) reported to this forum that he received his 5th Gen car in mid February 2023. 

So, to be on the safe side, I have started limiting my search to March 2023 onwards because I want the 5th Gen hybrid.

I don't feel it's very likely that they would have put in a completely new powertrain into the production line of an old model.

I've been and had a look at a 4th Gen car - listed as 140bhp but it's actually a 120 as confirmed this afternoon by the dealer. Not sure where the mistake lies but there are a lot of Gen 4s advertised as a 138. Anyway, the car is actually very nice so I've decided to buy it. I may have been tempted to open my wallet a bit wider by a 5th Gen if there had been any there but there weren't and It's a really good local dealership with a great reputation, which is a big plus for me. The  car's really nice with just about 5k miles on it. All the reviews for the Gen 4 are pretty good and it certainly didn't feel underpowered in any way, in fact I floored it on a straight bit of road and it took off just fine, it'll not set the world on fire but it's ok and better than the 120bhp would suggest I think.  I'd have been daft not to go for it really, it's lovely to drive, the missus loves the colour and I still have the 2 old cars to have fun with when the mood takes  😁  Thanks to everyone for your input 👍

[Dewi 24]

18 minutes ago, Don Mac said:

I find the central infotainment screen to be the quickest way to tell - Gen 4 has a knob, Gen 5 just has 3 buttons underneath, no knob.

Sounds about right 👍

[Parts-King]

3 hours ago, Dewi 24 said:

 As I say, if this is a mistake then surely the dealers are leaving themselves open to a lot of complaints and even litigation if people bought a car on the strength of it being advertised as more powerful than it actually is

Corolla date b.odt 16.18 kB · 6 downloads

Any advertisement is an "invitation to treat" in other words, it is up to the purchaser to make sure it meets their needs. Lets say a car is advertised at 25999, but the last number gets missed off the advert to make it 2599, the dealer does not have to sell it at that price. Now if you went to buy it and he agreed to sell it for 2599 and you both agreed then that is a contract. ALL adverts are generated from the Reg number these days, nobody sits there and inputs the spec, it is auto populated and mistakes happen, it is up to the purchaser to make sure it meets their needs, again, if you are told it's 138 BHP but turns out to be only 120, you would have a case. It's all about what is said and agreed  

[davidif]

6 hours ago, Parts-King said:

Any advertisement is an "invitation to treat" in other words, it is up to the purchaser to make sure it meets their needs. Lets say a car is advertised at 25999, but the last number gets missed off the advert to make it 2599, the dealer does not have to sell it at that price. Now if you went to buy it and he agreed to sell it for 2599 and you both agreed then that is a contract. ALL adverts are generated from the Reg number these days, nobody sits there and inputs the spec, it is auto populated and mistakes happen, it is up to the purchaser to make sure it meets their needs, again, if you are told it's 138 BHP but turns out to be only 120, you would have a case. It's all about what is said and agreed  

See Partridge v Ctittenden (1968)