Hybrid car insurance refusals, LV=, etc ........

[Miseryguts]

I have just been reading another car forum (not toyota) and the post I read was from a young guy who had modified his car.

He has had an accident and is now worried because he did not inform his insurance company of his modifications and they are coming to inspect his car.

When you insure your car and say "no modifications car is factory spec" it means your car is how it left the factory.

If you change your alloys for steel wheels with winter tyres you have modified your car.

It is best to tell them of ANYTHING you change because they will find ANY way to say in the event of a accident "sorry sir you are not insured".

I had my windows tinted and mud flaps fitted,I told my insurer and they sent me new Insurance documents with the items on it (no extra cost).

Now for the good bit,I rang around for renewal quotes and 2 companies would not cover me because my tinted windows were "not factory fitted".

So if I had not declared them I would not have been insured,in the event of an accident,and my car inspected.

The bottom line is that if you do ANYTHING which takes your car outside factory spec TELL THEM !!

It might cost you a bit on your premium but will save a fortune in the event of an accident.

Sorry if I am preaching to the converted but this is an easy trap to fall into.

[FROSTYBALLS]

The following topic contains an instance where a member wished to use a different size wheel and tyre combination (15 instead of 17 inch wheels) or winter use, and they were refused as the change was outside of the car's standard spec (post 27): http://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums/topic/145281-toyota-motor-insurance/page-3

[bigblock]

This may be interesting. If you buy a used car that came with parts fitted at the factory but is of a different spec as per the Toyota brochure, do you need to tell your insurer? For example, a standard Auris Icon does not come with Satnav or rear parking sensors according to the brochure, but I have seen many Auris Icons with factory fitted extras like these things. Do you still need to let your insurer know that your car is not as it is advertised in the Toyota brochure, but that the extras fitted was done at the factory and not by yourself?

[Miseryguts]

I would not have thought so (its still worth checking) because they were factory fitted.

I only bought this subject up because we all add bits and bobs and change things on a car without a second thought to insurance implications.

When I got refused insurance because of my tinted windows I challenged them and they said if they were factory fitted and came as standard,no problem.

I had my ones fitted by a window tinter and they would not insure the car,even though the tints are 100% legal and I have written confirmation of this.

You work it out.

Many companies have a list of modifications which carry no extra cost,now I will ALWAYS tell them,it would be stupid not to,you don't want to give the insurance companies the smallest opportunity to screw you over.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Quite often things like optional rear parking sensors are fitted at the dealer.

I suppose that if an insurance company weren't informed of changes to the standard specification, and a need for repair came about, all they would be obliged to do would be to repair the car to the specification the car was insured as (ie without the undeclared modification(s)).

For example, in the case of rear end damage which needed a replacement bumper and rear parking sensors, all they may be obliged to replace is the rear bumper.

This would obviously vary from insurer to insurer. Given the instance I highlighted at post 2, this scenario could be possible.

At the end of the day the insurer decides who they provide cover for. Whether they exclude certain groups, drivers residing in certain areas, driving experience, modifications, etc, it is their decision. One of the reasons why some people get really high quotes when shopping around for renewals, is that the insurer may not want their business.

We sometimes had difficulty getting class 1 business use for each of us on both cars because we are not married - so we went to an insurer who had no issue providing this cover.

The same with Crown Indemnity - which if you worked for a Government Department (not local authority) and used your personal car for class 1 business use, the Departments required insurers to indemnify the Crown from any involvement in any subsequent insurance claim. Some insurers refused to provide Crown Indemnity, so staff went elsewhere.

[Heidfirst]

even things like mudflaps, wind deflectors, tow bars etc. etc. should be declared. Otherwise should your car be written off (& assuming that your ins. co decided to pay out even though you hadn't declared everything) you would only get a standard car as a replacement & not your optional extras. Also, anything that makes your car more desirable or noticeable they view as a higher risk & hence carries a higher premium.

[Miseryguts]

The guy I mentioned earlier was wetting himself as he had lowered the suspension,fitted a turbo ,different size wheels and God know what else.

He was not a happy camper.

[ToyotaAuris]

Sorry to say but I think your going over the top. For example if you had the SR wheels on a TR Auris they wouldent care because unless someone has ALOT of knowledge about a certain car they wouldent relise. Even if they did big deal... I mean come on they wouldent scrutionise you over these small petty things, you can say it was purchased sepertly, like what frostyballs said about the parking sensors. To be honest I wouldent of told my insurance company if I had fitted mudguards and tinted windows. Firstly you can remove them within a matter of seconds and secondly they wouldent even care. Unless your equipting a new engine, large body kit, sporty rims, big exhaust or something which is easy to spot i wouldent do it. Your wasting your time and its going on the cars record because now like you said you was rejected by 2 insurance companies, them 2 companies will likely to be the cheap companies and you will now be paying more. Thats not all but when you come to selling the car, when the next owner puts in your vehicle reg to insure, they will have to pay more....

[ToyotaAuris]

This may be interesting. If you buy a used car that came with parts fitted at the factory but is of a different spec as per the Toyota brochure, do you need to tell your insurer? For example, a standard Auris Icon does not come with Satnav or rear parking sensors according to the brochure, but I have seen many Auris Icons with factory fitted extras like these things. Do you still need to let your insurer know that your car is not as it is advertised in the Toyota brochure, but that the extras fitted was done at the factory and not by yourself?

mate dont worry about it. unless you change really noticeable exterior items like body kit or 18 inch rims you have nothing to worry about!!!

[Miseryguts]

You are rather missing the point,the mud flaps and the tinted windows cost money.

Insurance companies will cover you for certain amounts (2-3 hundred pounds) to cover declared modifications.

So if my car was stolen (as my last car was) the cost of my mudflaps and tints would be repaid separately not lumped in with the claim.

If they are not itemised they don't pay out.

Declaring these two items cost nothing because they are on the list of non cost items.

If you are happy making modifications to your car without declaring them thats fine by me.

When dealing with insurance companies past experience has taught me to keep everything above board.

[Grumpy Cabbie]

Agree with Miseryguts.

It doesn't matter if you think the modifications are irrelevant or not, it's what the insurers think. If they ask "Has the car been modified in ANY way from standard", then tell them if it has. For all the insurers who won't cover you, there are just as many who will.

And don't try to pull the wool by saying the previous owner did it and you weren't aware. They'll ask them if it's a big claim.

If you want to modify your car (and lots do), then just find a specialist insurer. If you haven't slotted a V8 into a Yaris or chavved it up, you shouldn't have an issue finding someone.

Don't tell them and they find out, then you're up that creek with no paddle. They can and do sue you for any damages they may have to pay out to the other person if the accident was your fault, or void your policy if it wasn't. It's not worth messing about with. People have lost their house over it!

[Awebb180]

Does it differ from the original manufactures specification? if so they technically need to be declared

Alex

[cobh18]

Meant to post yesterday but there was a glitch, now fixed it seems (thanks admin!) so this is a little out of sync. Fuss about winter tyres from individual insurers has been going on for some time. We're with LV, and when we told them a few years ago, they were fine. Not concerned either way. This was before the ABI produced some guidance and a list of insurers who are either au fait with winter tyres, and those who want to know/impose conditions. Shouldn't be a premium on that aspect! https://www.abi.org.uk/Insurance-and-savings/Products/Motor-insurance/Winter-tyres

It might be of interest. Toyota insurance seem to be on the ball:)

[StevieH888]

I have a question. I used to own a Alfa Romeo 159, I lowered it with Eibach springs, new custom stainless exhaust, and K and N air filter. It wasn't that obvious to the untrained eye, Ie the exhaust wasn't overly big or loud. The 159 with the highest torsional rigidity in its class was still greatly improved with the springs , I remember a Scooby chasing me at considerable speed over a round about to his not my demise (he spun, alfa 159 didn't), i digress. I part ex' the car with toyota dealer for my Auris, this was with the 159 being 4 years old , avg miles. No questions asked about mods. They sold it on and I saw it for sale online by a small independent dealer , no mention of the mods. So if you buy a car innocently thinking its standard, what then?

[Miseryguts]

Good point,one that I cannot answer.

Although the "ignorance is no defence" rule could be used if they wanted to be pedantic.

My neighbour bought an old 4x4 with a huge stainless steel bull bar on the front.

I asked her if she had mentioned this to her insurers,she said no.

Now many companies will not cover cars fitted with bull bars,if she had hit a child and the insurance company was not informed of the bull bars she would have been in a world of dod doo's

If you buy a car and have leather seats or parking sensors fitted as an option,tell your insurers because even though they are "factory fitted"they are not original spec for that model of car.

If you change the rating of your tyres TELL THEM.

I would rather pay a few extra quid and keep on the right side of the insurance company.

In the event of an accident they either your best friend or in the event of non declaration,your worst enemy.

[smudge-1991]

I spoke to my insurance (lv) and asked about tyres and winter tyres and they said it's fine if they are the same sizes as the normal tyres ... I asked about a few of my optional extras I.e the parking sensors and cruise control and so forth and they weren't fussed as it was fitted to car from New and not a modification afterwards

[Uncle Buck]

I think people are getting a bit carried away here. If your car came from the factory with virtually any spec - it's factory fitted and approved by the manufacturer. Therefore it is not modified - it is merely fitted with factory options.

The 'modified' tag is there for cars with aftermarket items like wheels, exhausts, engine upgrades, body kits, etc. Ask Adrian Flux as they deal with these scenarios all the time. I've had several modified cars and always declared these aftermarket changes to the relevant insurance company.

[smudge-1991]

Couldn't agree more uncle buck perfect explanation .... The only reason I asked was when renewing they said anything different from manufacturing spec and I sad besides some options extras ... Just some alloy gator rim protectors and they were like ok that's fine and even tried to see if they could drop the price because of proper rim protectors

[Miseryguts]

Thats right.

You can have anything you like so long as it is the spec for that model car.

My Icon does NOT have parking sensors on its factory spec.

If I have them fitted as a factory fitted "option" then I must inform the insurance company.

I will not give insurance companies the slightest opportunity to not honour my policy in the event of an accident.

One of my late friends was an insurance investigator and after hearing some of his stories made me extra keen to abide by the rules (however stupid).

[smudge-1991]

My insurance told me that optional extras aren't put in as that's what was done at manufacturer not what you have done just what you requested so if they check the parts catalogue your vin number will show any optional extras in the parts as standard kit otherwise it won't show at all ... As I wanted to get the better Auris stereo but couldn't find it using my vin but could on my friends cos he has one then that counts as a mod and has to be declared

[Miseryguts]

Factory fitted options have to be declared because the car has been modified from FACTORY SPEC.

Any mods to the car that are different to the cars list of fittings have to be declared,even if the factory fit them,this is fact, from the hoses mouth so to speak.

[smudge-1991]

Maybe different insurance companies work differently then as my insures told me me different and I worked in a brokers when I was 16 taking details from customers about their cars and none of the insurers then gave a toss about optional extras just aftermarket stuff to run the price up...

Same as if you buy a decent car that's lets say 8 yrs old how are you supposed to know what was an optional extra and what wasn't one mods you can spot I.e wheels exhaust aftermarket filters etc but Sat nav, cruise control, electric seats, tinted Windows electric folding wing mirrors the average Joe sees a good well kitted car he isn't to know that the previous owner had all that stuff added as extras

[smudge-1991]

Maybe different insurance companies work differently then as my insures told me me different and I worked in a brokers when I was 16 taking details from customers about their cars and none of the insurers then gave a toss about optional extras just aftermarket stuff to run the price up...

Same as if you buy a decent car that's lets say 8 yrs old how are you supposed to know what was an optional extra and what wasn't one mods you can spot I.e wheels exhaust aftermarket filters etc but Sat nav, cruise control, electric seats, tinted Windows electric folding wing mirrors the average Joe sees a good well kitted car he isn't to know that the previous owner had all that stuff added as extras...

I'm not disagree ing with you but at the same time your insures might also be taking advantage of you

[Heidfirst]

I think people are getting a bit carried away here. If your car came from the factory with virtually any spec - it's factory fitted and approved by the manufacturer. Therefore it is not modified - it is merely fitted with factory options.

They still need to know that it has been optioned up though. Say your car is £20k with £2k of undeclared options - write it off & you will only be paid for/replaced with a standard car (assuming that they don't start squirrelling about it being non-standard & therefore insurance void).

e.g. my car came with a Toyota oem towbar fitted - that increases my premium.

[smudge-1991]

My Ford fiesta got written off and that had a few optional extras ie ... A/C bigger alloy wheels electric wing mirrors fog lights and trip computer and when they did that they just went off the book value of that spec car no funnies about the extras they didn't bat an eyelid .... I work with a lot of people who have loads of extras on their cars crash them and never get any grief for the options ticked so it think it depends what your insurer is like and if they are bumping up the price for optional extras I would move on to another who takes the car as it comes from apart from aftermarket modification