Hybrid braking?

[sproutdreamer]

Do the brake lights activate when doing engine braking/recharging without touching the brakes?

[anchorman]

No but they do with the distance sensing cruise control.   

[Cyker]

They don't come on if you just lift off the accelerator - The lift-off regen braking isn't very strong, I'd say it's comparable to lifting off in 3rd gear or so in a manual car; It's not like the 1 pedal driving in some EVs, where suddenly lifting off the accelerator puts you through the windscreen  

 

[MikeSh]

48 minutes ago, anchorman said:

No but they do with the distance sensing cruise control.   

On my MK3 the ordinary cruise control does brake quite strongly downhill but I've never been able to tell if that puts the lights on.

[Serban]

Wait, people actually use the B mode? Why? It would make sense in an electric car as to one pedal only driving, but even then, hmm..

[jthspace]

4 minutes ago, Serban said:

Wait, people actually use the B mode? Why? It would make sense in an electric car as to one pedal only driving, but even then, hmm..

Twisty country roads where I live makes "B" useful, otherwise I am braking a lot. Using "B" means I can go into a corner at the correct speed and under power, avoiding unnecessary braking, especially on wet and leaf covered roads. One should never go into a corner "free-wheeling" or in the wrong gear.

[hind]

But you don't recharge the HV Battery on B, as long as you brake within the recuperation range it is like braking with your engine. 

B should be used for a long downhills like the ones in Alps or other mountains, kilometers of descending road where the possibility to use the brakes (after you can no longer charge the HV battery) puts a risk of overheating them. 

[Serban]

23 minutes ago, jthspace said:

Twisty country roads where I live makes "B" useful, otherwise I am braking a lot. Using "B" means I can go into a corner at the correct speed and under power, avoiding unnecessary braking, especially on wet and leaf covered roads. One should never go into a corner "free-wheeling" or in the wrong gear.

I've done those roads, I see what you mean, but it's not like gentle braking in D mode is inferior to driving in B mode. I would definitely prefer B mode if it came to a full stop, but it doesn't. Also my car doesn't seem to take advantage of the Battery as much in B mode, it's almost always full. I've done some testing B vs D mode and I've seen lower mpgs in B mode. Yaris 21` for reference.

[Serban]

6 minutes ago, hind said:

But you don't recharge the HV battery on B, as long as you brake within the recuperation range it is like braking with your engine. 

B should be used for a long downhills like the ones in Alps or other mountains, kilometers of descending road where the possibility to use the brakes (after you can no longer charge the HV battery) puts a risk of overheating them. 

I believed that scenario to be the only worthwhile, at least for my mk4 yaris. 

[Cyker]

On a side note, if the traction Battery gets full, the car can't regen-brake any more, but the car will automatically switch to using B-mode-esque engine braking.

[AndrueC]

40 minutes ago, jthspace said:

Twisty country roads where I live makes "B" useful, otherwise I am braking a lot. Using "B" means I can go into a corner at the correct speed and under power, avoiding unnecessary braking, especially on wet and leaf covered roads. One should never go into a corner "free-wheeling" or in the wrong gear.

I don't use 'B' and I almost never use my brakes going into corners. It's a matter of principal to me ever since my driving instructor (in the early 90s) told me that brakes were for stopping and correcting mistakes 😉

[anchorman]

Well I use my brakes to slow down or stop when necessary and I know a bit about brakes.  I also use B mode frequently where I live because it’s very hilly and it both brings the speed down and adds juice to the Battery for going back up the other way.  It’s there for a reason.  

[Cyker]

37 minutes ago, AndrueC said:

I don't use 'B' and I almost never use my brakes going into corners. It's a matter of principal to me ever since my driving instructor (in the early 90s) told me that brakes were for stopping and correcting mistakes 😉

Same - I consider it a failure on my part if I ever need to use the brakes on the motorway in anything other than an emergency! It's a bit trickier in London tho'...!   

 

[anchorman]

1 minute ago, Cyker said:

Same - I consider it a failure on my part if I ever need to use the brakes on the motorway in anything other than an emergency! It's a bit trickier in London tho'...!   

 

You’re just a maniac 😉😂

[anchorman]

47 minutes ago, Cyker said:

On a side note, if the traction battery gets full, the car can't regen-brake any more, but the car will automatically switch to using B-mode-esque engine braking.

Aye that’s true and with an Atkinson cycle engine it tends to make more noise than actually provide any retardation.  

[CPN]

3 hours ago, hind said:

But you don't recharge the HV battery on B

Not true as I have proved before....

2 hours ago, anchorman said:

Well I use my brakes to slow down or stop when necessary and I know a bit about brakes.  I also use B mode frequently where I live because it’s very hilly and it both brings the speed down and adds juice to the battery for going back up the other way.  It’s there for a reason.  

I'm glad someone agrees with me! 😉

[Cyker]

Strictly speaking it does charge the Battery, but in the newer ones the regen nowhere near as much as when manually braking, at least according to the power meter. I've never seen B-mode regen more than 1 bar on mine, but manually braking you can go up to the full 3 bars.

I don't know why they changed this in the new ones, as on the previous gen, it seems B-mode used maximum regen as well as engine braking?

[CPN]

Yes, it did seem like a retrograde step!

[CPN]

Here's a reminder from when I posted all those HA screenshots whilst using "B" mode down a slip road...

That translates as 11Kw reverse power from the ICE and 5.6Kw of resistive power feeding back into the Battery... (foot off the loud pedal and no manual braking)

 

[bathtub tom]

4 hours ago, jthspace said:

One should never go into a corner "free-wheeling" or in the wrong gear.

Why not? Stig Blomqvist made a career of it in 2-stroke Saabs with freewheeling front hubs, albeit on snow and ice. I've tried it (off road) and with a bit of 'trail braking', it works, giving both front wheels the ability to find their maximum grip without any retardation or acceleration. I suspect I could've used it to advantage, given enough time (if I didn't kill myself first).

[hogofwar]

On 1/3/2024 at 10:40 PM, CPN said:

Here's a reminder from when I posted all those HA screenshots whilst using "B" mode down a slip road...

That translates as 11Kw reverse power from the ICE and 5.6Kw of resistive power feeding back into the battery... (foot off the loud pedal and no manual braking)

 

What is this app?

[CPN]

3 hours ago, hogofwar said:

What is this app?

Hybrid Assistant and it's on the Google Play Store. Android only I'm afraid.

 

[Campblor]

On 1/3/2024 at 7:27 PM, Cyker said:

Same - I consider it a failure on my part if I ever need to use the brakes on the motorway in anything other than an emergency! It's a bit trickier in London tho'...!   

 

I end up using my brakes too often as people think my safe stopping distance gap is for them to pull into to slam on their brakes. 

[Cyker]

Yeah that is a danger, but you start to develop psychic powers after a while to spot smeg pots like that so you can prepare.  

It's very common on the southbound M11 to M25 junction, as it's a long downhill and I'm seen many people badly underestimate their braking distances, or not anticipate people ahead braking, and are forced to do emergency stops or dive into the hard shoulder.

I tend to leave a fairly big gap on that downhill, and as you say there's always some idiot who tries to dive into it at the last minute and narrowly miss punting the car in front. Meanwhile I'm braking at a medium pace to a stop behind them while watching this all unfold.

It's just so unnecessary - If they matched speeds with the gap, signalled, and gently pulled in, all that drama would be avoided, but so many always have to dive in at the last moment.  I reckon the hardshoulder on that down hill has saved a lot of accidents, by acting as an escape lane - It'll be hell when they turn that into a Smart Motorway...

[jthspace]

Yep, M11 southbound can be interesting.  I leave 3 second gap on motorways and 2 second gap on A roads but I've had one or two cars pull into the gap and then slam their brakes on as their overtaking speed wasn't the same as the gap speed.  

What was a surprisingly pleasant drive recently was the busy A14 north of Cambridge, speed cameras galore and everyone behaving, amazingly less bunches of slow moving traffic and speedy gaps as all the cars were trundling along together between 60 and 70 mph.