R4P GR Sport: About to press the Order button but...

[Nick72]

Bitone pearl white and black with pan roof. I'm not sure of the colour, my first issue. 🤦🤷

Fitted before delivery with Michelin Cross Climate 2 SUV tyres (waiting for confirmation).

Company car to replace the existing R4P Dynamic Premium 2021 Dacuma Grey or whatever it was called. Not due for replacement till August but being asked to get an order in Q1 to avoid delays in swap over.

Feels like it should be a minor upgrade with the new infotainment, driver display, better reversing cam plus pan view, heated steering wheel, slightly stiffer suspension (I prefer but not everyone will). But a downgrade in terms of audio (no JBL, not that this was actually great) and loss of vented seats that we used each summer. Black seats get very hot.

Now I've got the wobbles and wondering whether to leave it a couple more months to end March to see what else is out there and whether Toyota make any more changes to the R4P? Doesn't feel like as big an upgrade as I've had in the past, each time I swap cars every 3 years. Wobbling with the order button looming!😥🤷

I know I've said before the R4P meets my needs well. Great economy, 500 mile range, sleeper level power, AWD, loads of room, easy to drive if not very slightly sloppy on cornering (suspension on the GR might fix this), Android Auto on big screen, HUD is great (I couldn't go back now), and reliable once they fixed the software bug draining the 12V. But I'm just not 100%. Not that I've found a better option yet. A Polestar 3 or EX30 might have worked if the range was more than 50% greater now that I have a new regular 390 mile round trip (glad I didn't plum for an EV or it could have meant 2 charging stops per trip!.. which would have stressed me out.).

Wobbles! 🤦

Any thoughts on what Toyota might do with the R4P? I'm intrigued by talk of a new RAV next year.

White and black? The right colour? I've seen the pearl white paint up close and it looks great. Tempted by the red. 

Any alternatives anywhere close to the R4P?

Thanks all. Tough decision. 

🙏

 

[forkingabout]

Even if a brand new RAV4 came next year - I would never want to get a first year of production vehicle due to all the unforeseen issues / problems that could appear.

 

[Nick72]

19 minutes ago, forkingabout said:

Even if a brand new RAV4 came next year - I would never want to get a first year of production vehicle due to all the unforeseen issues / problems that could appear.

 

That's a good point. Let others wring out the bugs and issues! Been burnt by this before. I should know better.

[Mike2222]

9 hours ago, Nick72 said:

Any alternatives anywhere close to the R4P?

Unless your budget can stretch to a new BMW X5 50e (previous generation/pre-facelift 45e version looks good on paper but not as well powered in pure ev mode, tho still better than many other designs), and your sanity can take the uber-migraines of potential maintainace headaches (and invoices), then not really. 

If willing to consider an estate PHEV with RWD only, then the new merc C and E class PHEVs claim up to ~70 miles. 

Bottom line, nothing in aware of ticks as many boxes on a single package at this price point. 

[Flatcoat]

If a significantly updated RAV was imminent it would already be in the motoring press ‘new cars’ for 2024 articles. 

[Mike2222]

I forgot the obvious answer of the equivalent lexus variant. I forget the lexus naming hierarchy, but the engine code is 450+

[philip42h]

16 minutes ago, Flatcoat said:

If a significantly updated RAV was imminent it would already be in the motoring press ‘new cars’ for 2024 articles. 

... and there's absolutely no sign of any such thing on any of the official Toyota sites either. So, if there is to be a RAV4.6, it won't be before 2025 at the earliest ...

[ernieb]

Press the go button for the order and colour go with your first instinct. We wanted the red when we bought  the PHEV but did a test drive in the grey. Got very tempted with the grey but glad we went for the red/black roof.

Sit back and wait for the new car to arrive. I think there’s not much likely to change until your next three years are up.

[Nick72]

1 hour ago, Flatcoat said:

If a significantly updated RAV was imminent it would already be in the motoring press ‘new cars’ for 2024 articles. 

Lots of internet chatter about a 2025 release. Whether that's late 2024 or more likely, late 2025 I dunno. But as was pointed out, lots of initial issues with a new model which I probably don't have time for.

I like the look of the current model so that's going to be hard to beat?

[Nick72]

1 hour ago, Mike2222 said:

I forgot the obvious answer of the equivalent lexus variant. I forget the lexus naming hierarchy, but the engine code is 450+

Looking at the Lexus now. Love the interiors. External styling, not so much.

[Flatcoat]

13 minutes ago, Nick72 said:

Lots of internet chatter about a 2025 release. Whether that's late 2024 or more likely, late 2025 I dunno. But as was pointed out, lots of initial issues with a new model which I probably don't have time for

Not with a Toyota….. if you don’t need the latest tech the best buys are often run out versions of old models. Usually loaded with options and/or good finance deals.

[Nick72]

17 minutes ago, Flatcoat said:

Not with a Toyota….. if you don’t need the latest tech the best buys are often run out versions of old models. Usually loaded with options and/or good finance deals.

You're probably right.

[Nick72]

8 hours ago, Mike2222 said:

Unless your budget can stretch to a new BMW X5 50e (previous generation/pre-facelift 45e version looks good on paper but not as well powered in pure ev mode, tho still better than many other designs), and your sanity can take the uber-migraines of potential maintainace headaches (and invoices), then not really. 

If willing to consider an estate PHEV with RWD only, then the new merc C and E class PHEVs claim up to ~70 miles. 

Bottom line, nothing in aware of ticks as many boxes on a single package at this price point. 

Just looked at the BMW. Interestingly the BMWs offered by our company car folks come in significantly less in cost as company car upgrade cost per month than most other cars. I think this may be the buying power of the Paribas group that backs the scheme. So although 80k gets the basic M Sport model it works out I'd be paying for a 70k car and factoring the low BiK tax brings it down to under 50k (lease equivalence). Fortunate to be within reach. 

Looks like a gorgeous car and at 490hp it's pretty outrageous. Good electric range but I'm not sure I could stomach the 25mpg when the engine is running when the RAV does twice that. 

Just looking down the options list though it's the usual BMW approach. What's standard on the R4P are optional extras so that original cost above now needs another 10k.

Still, a great looking car. I need to convince myself I'm making the best choice with the R4P GR.

[Cyker]

It depends what you're after; The BMW will be a much nicer car to be in and drive, and a lot more powerful. However the Toyota won't randomly shit itself and require large amounts of money to repair, and will be more economical. Also Toyota don't charge a subscription fee to use the heated seats  

 

[Rav Rob]

Oh God, I hate the button push. The feeling of your stuck with it, my company forced 4 year cycles at one point and I hated it, the drivers seat really loses comfort as time goes on.

So I started opting for 2 year terms when they were allowed, it cost me higher contributions but starting the shopping cycle after 18 months was exciting.

There will always be something better down the line, I have driven myself mad trying to get the latest cars and getting test drives for new to market cars, nightmare.

For the first time ever, I had a 2nd car the same as the previous one because I think I concluded the better the devil you know. When I bought my first RAV, again, it was one of the first on sale here and it had more quality niggles, by my 2nd one they had got the hang of making it and unlike my 1st has zero rattles.  
I guess what I am saying is being an early adopter sometimes isn't great, a good car made on a well sorted mid life production run will probably disappoint less.
Press it.

[Nick72]

3 hours ago, Cyker said:

It depends what you're after; The BMW will be a much nicer car to be in and drive, and a lot more powerful. However the Toyota won't randomly **** itself and require large amounts of money to repair, and will be more economical. Also Toyota don't charge a subscription fee to use the heated seats  

 

I think they scrapped the subscription fee idea after the backlash 😂. A step too far.

I dont pay for repairs, insurance, or maintenance including wear and tear. The company covers it all.

But the 25mpg for my personal holiday home trips and UK vacations is a little crazy. 

 

 

[Nick72]

56 minutes ago, Rav Rob said:

Oh God, I hate the button push. The feeling of your stuck with it, my company forced 4 year cycles at one point and I hated it, the drivers seat really loses comfort as time goes on.

So I started opting for 2 year terms when they were allowed, it cost me higher contributions but starting the shopping cycle after 18 months was exciting.

There will always be something better down the line, I have driven myself mad trying to get the latest cars and getting test drives for new to market cars, nightmare.

For the first time ever, I had a 2nd car the same as the previous one because I think I concluded the better the devil you know. When I bought my first RAV, again, it was one of the first on sale here and it had more quality niggles, by my 2nd one they had got the hang of making it and unlike my 1st has zero rattles.  
I guess what I am saying is being an early adopter sometimes isn't great, a good car made on a well sorted mid life production run will probably disappoint less.
Press it.

Very true. 

This is it really. I'm pushing the button on a car I'm stuck with (or it's stuck with me 🤣) for 3 years starting August. At the same time I see a lot of spaceships, luxury interiors, high end sound systems, and more emerging. It's a fear of missing out more than than a regret of picking something wrong (which it won't be with the R4P given the familiarity). 

Must admit I was looking at the bigger Toyota AWDs recently but they don't quite hit that perfect compromise of power and economy and monthly cost the R4P delivers.

I think I'm just going to just press go as soon as I've got a price for the CC2 tyres!

Don't get me wrong. The car looks great, I love the exterior styling of the GR Sport bi-tone, the solid reliability, potentially better handling and road holding (after stock tyre swap), but the interior is still a bit drab, pan roof is a misnomer as the sunroof hardly opens up, infotainment system even after the update is no better than the AMG Merc 5 or 6 years ago, sound is going to be worse than the average on the car I've got given removal of JBL, still hardly any of the US market tech goodies like digital rear view mirror, kick sensor, and high wattage power outlet, but... I think I'm looking for the perfect woman but have to make do with my wife. 🤣 ...I cook, clean, do all the DIY, gardening, and work 50 to 60hrs a week but don't get me started. 😂🤷

[Rav Rob]

The romance of those new shiny ones... I must admit, I have in the past test driven something as an outsider, maybe the media didn't like it much and though wow! this is the one. (and yes I am still talking about cars!). The sad thing about company cars last few years is that sometimes the more interesting cars have had to be passed by because of stupid things like boot size or even duller... CO2 emissions and tax... urgh!

For example I almost ordered a gorgeous Alfa Romeo Stelvio in the good old days when they all got away with lying about their emissions so it was tax viable, then the new tests came in and it wasn't viable any more.

I know what you mean about the interior, its sturdy but not special, I have had both my RAV with the Beige leather, some hate it but I think it massively lifts the interior.

horses for courses, I hate all kinds of sunroof as the engineer in me says steel is better than a slab of glass in a tall vehicle that has more chance of rolling, I listen to talk stations so the sound system is of no consequence, but the phone system is rubbish and the voice control dumb and hit and miss.

But yes, where are the toys? I do know with many brands the 'locally' built (USA or South America) is more built to a price rather a quality compared to the Japanese versions, I don't know if this is the case with Toyota but what they gain in toys, they may lose in rattles, paint finish, sound proofing...

[Nick72]

9 hours ago, Rav Rob said:

The romance of those new shiny ones... I must admit, I have in the past test driven something as an outsider, maybe the media didn't like it much and though wow! this is the one. (and yes I am still talking about cars!). The sad thing about company cars last few years is that sometimes the more interesting cars have had to be passed by because of stupid things like boot size or even duller... CO2 emissions and tax... urgh!

For example I almost ordered a gorgeous Alfa Romeo Stelvio in the good old days when they all got away with lying about their emissions so it was tax viable, then the new tests came in and it wasn't viable any more.

I know what you mean about the interior, its sturdy but not special, I have had both my RAV with the Beige leather, some hate it but I think it massively lifts the interior.

horses for courses, I hate all kinds of sunroof as the engineer in me says steel is better than a slab of glass in a tall vehicle that has more chance of rolling, I listen to talk stations so the sound system is of no consequence, but the phone system is rubbish and the voice control dumb and hit and miss.

But yes, where are the toys? I do know with many brands the 'locally' built (USA or South America) is more built to a price rather a quality compared to the Japanese versions, I don't know if this is the case with Toyota but what they gain in toys, they may lose in rattles, paint finish, sound proofing...

Yep you're right.

There's not much of a sunroof to make much of a difference I guess in a rollover situation. Although you're head is now near the scrapey surface once the glass has shattered. But it's high on my list as a want. I like to drive through the mountains and forests of the north lakes with windows down and sunroof open. When it's not freezing or p down. Which is probably 5 days a year 🤣

[Flatcoat]

If you are still in a quandary about the RAV and do not need the AWD capability there are plenty of PHEV alternatives readily available, or imminent. 

[Nick72]

Small spanner in the works.

Company car folks have said I can't add a tyre swap to my order. They said I'll need to swap them after delivery and pay the dealer directly. 

Problem is that will give me 4 tyres to store somewhere, which probably means under a tarpaulin for 3 years.

I've asked which tyres do they want back with the vehicle. The stock tyres which will be effectively unused, or, the CC2 SUV tyres with 3 years of wear (probably 22,000 to 25,000 miles). They've not responded yet. Either way I'll have a set of good tyres to sell somehow!

Pretty determined to get the CC2 SUV tyres on given reports here and elsewhere of significantly better grip in all conditions but especially in the wet, ice, snow. 

Anyone got any experience of tyre storage and selling tyres?

How did you do it @ernieb?

[Flatcoat]

Store tyres in my attic and sell them on fleabay. 

[Nick72]

12 minutes ago, Flatcoat said:

Store tyres in my attic and sell them on fleabay. 

Both our attics (house and garage) are full. On my job list to finish off boarding and dump junk stuff. One for summer. Hatch however is not big enough to get the tyres through. 

[ernieb]

@Nick72, I bought tyre covers and stored in the loft at one point. Then decoded it was too much of a pain so  bought a tyre rack and stored them in the garage. Mine was floor mounted but there were options to have them hung from the wall. I made sure I rotated the tyres every few months.

I did part with some part worn winter tyres but was glad to give them away if the new owner collected, which is what happened.

[Nick72]

52 minutes ago, ernieb said:

@Nick72, I bought tyre covers and stored in the loft at one point. Then decoded it was too much of a pain so  bought a tyre rack and stored them in the garage. Mine was floor mounted but there were options to have them hung from the wall. I made sure I rotated the tyres every few months.

I did part with some part worn winter tyres but was glad to give them away if the new owner collected, which is what happened.

Thanks Ernie. I'm guessing keeping them outside under a cover is not a great idea?

Ideally id just sell them right away if I can give back the car after 3 years with the CC2s. Still waiting to hear back.