Reversing a Yaris Hybrid

[DBP]

My wife has recently bought a 22 plate Yaris Design.  Neither of us have driven an automatic before in our 30+ years of driving.  She has picked up general driving very easily, the only issue is bay park reversing which she has to do in a tightly spaced car park at work.  She lines the car up, selects R, and gently takes her foot off the brake…. sometimes it will glide back as far as she wants but frustratingly it sometimes stops short of where she needs to end up.  This is very intermittent.  She has to pull forward again and repeat the manoeuvre in the hope it won’t come to a halt this time.  She dare’nt put her foot on the accelerator for fear it flies back into the barrier behind her.

 

We are beginning to wonder if there’s a fault with the car…. any theories/advice would be most gratefully received!

[Mojo1010]

Just use a little gas. 

[hind]

Take a look if the car does not stop on something like an edge of the water drain or a curb or anything else. When unobstructed the car should reverse slowly without any pressure on the accelerator.

The only time I need to press accelerator when reversing is when I have to cross the low curb when I'm parking on the street. Just do it gently and the car should overcome the obstacle.

[TonyHSD]

15 hours ago, DBP said:

My wife has recently bought a 22 plate Yaris Design.  Neither of us have driven an automatic before in our 30+ years of driving.  She has picked up general driving very easily, the only issue is bay park reversing which she has to do in a tightly spaced car park at work.  She lines the car up, selects R, and gently takes her foot off the brake…. sometimes it will glide back as far as she wants but frustratingly it sometimes stops short of where she needs to end up.  This is very intermittent.  She has to pull forward again and repeat the manoeuvre in the hope it won’t come to a halt this time.  She dare’nt put her foot on the accelerator for fear it flies back into the barrier behind her.

 

We are beginning to wonder if there’s a fault with the car…. any theories/advice would be most gratefully received!

If you are worrying to press accelerator further and the car eventually to jump up and crash into something while reversing you can select eco mode and even drive in eco mode. This will make accelerator pedal less responsive to input and prevent any sudden accelerations. Best to try in forward motion first and see if you both like it. You can even drive in eco all the time if you like it. I personal drive in normal mode and have no problems with accelerator pedal feel. 

Another trick that you can do is to use right foot on accelerator and left foot on the brake pedal.
This technique is very helpful when doing steep hill starts either if you are moving forward  or reverse and if your car hasn’t got hill start assist or if it has not been activated.
It gives you similar to manual transmission clutch control feeling, pressing accelerator with right foot while holding the car with the left foot on the brake. This way also can be used for fast launch at traffic lights, but in these cases you need to push acceleration further down so engine can start and together with electric motor are trying to propel the car , release brake and push to the floor and your car will fly ahead. No one ever need to do these but you can. 
Again practice in safe place first and see how do you feel. 👍

[flash22]

yes the hybrid has its own driving style, the slightest touch of throttle is all you need to set the car rolling 9/10 times the car will reverse only on the electric motor, It all a bit alien at first, my brain still goes for the hand brake and my hand goes for the key in the ignition switch getting out of the car

the throttle will only do, what tell it to, in a empty carpark stop the car then drive away with the smallest amount of throttle input, and repeat in reverse just to get a feel for the car

as it's your first hybrid and auto - the right foot does all the work, the left foot does nothing

[Cyker]

Yeah I get that too if I reverse into one of the parking bays at one of our sites - It's slightly inclined block paving and the electric motor has just enough torque to go up it with no pedal input, but then the front wheels will hit the lip and it's just slightly too much for it, so I have to give the accelerator a little goose to help it overcome, then it'll slowly continue rolling back.

It all happens very slowly, so you'll have plenty of time to jump on the brakes, or you can learn to left foot brake.

It does take a lot of getting used to coming from a manual - I still find it a bit disconcerting as I'm still used to having total control over power delivery through my clutch foot, which is something you lose in an automatic, but the electric motor is very progressive and offers nearly as much control - Much better low-speed control than conventional automatics.

[bathtub tom]

Get used to it! I stalled mine twice this morning (petrol, manual) getting over the garage step. Does it easily when cold at tickover, but needs a liitle 'persuasion' when warm.

[Cyker]

Don't be afraid to use more accelerator input, use more power and modulate it with the clutch and you'll never stall!

 

[DBP]

Thanks for all the input everyone, it’s very helpful and we’ll definitely try out some of your ideas.  We know it does essentially boil down to practising, starting with a quiet car park.  (I’m thinking that 5pm on Saturday might be a good time 😄). Thanks again.

[Derek.w]

29 minutes ago, DBP said:

Thanks for all the input everyone, it’s very helpful and we’ll definitely try out some of your ideas.  We know it does essentially boil down to practising, starting with a quiet car park.  (I’m thinking that 5pm on Saturday might be a good time 😄). Thanks again.

It probably down to diffrent inclines from one parking bay to the other.

[Cyker]

It's always good to take a new car and play with it a bit; You'll learn how it reacts to stuff by playing with it, testing its limits, much better than if you only drive it for a purpose on the same commute.

It's something I always do when I've had a new car - Take it on a hoon on some of my fun roads so I can see how it handles things like elevation changes, fast and slow corners, turning circle, how well it does a U-turn or 3-point turn, how it handles at low and sub-idle speed and on poor road surfaces and speed humps etc.

 

[MikeSh]

1 hour ago, DBP said:

We know it does essentially boil down to practising, starting with a quiet car park.

Take a piece of not very thick wood like a length of 2"x1" and put it a few feet behind (and in front too) to practice getting over.

[SDR]

8 hours ago, flash22 said:

yes the hybrid has its own driving style, the slightest touch of throttle is all you need to set the car rolling 9/10 times the car will reverse only on the electric motor, 

AFAIK the Toyota "e-CVT" transmission doesn’t have a mechanical reverse gear so it always reverses on one of the electric motors.    If the ICE is running I assume that it's just charging the traction Battery. 

[MikeSh]

2 hours ago, SDR said:

AFAIK the Toyota "e-CVT" transmission doesn’t have a mechanical reverse gear so it always reverses on one of the electric motors.    If the ICE is running I assume that it's just charging the traction battery. 

Yes but no. It's not that simple. 

I think that if it the car needs more torque than MG2 can provide then it can start the engine and use MG1 to 'backpedal' against that to get more. MG1 isn't all that powerful but the gearing gives it a big advantage.

[ColinB]

On my RAV4 when manoeuvring I tend to turn the brake hold function off, with it on the car tends to suddenly move suddenly as it releases and it's easier to just creep without it on. 

[SDR]

7 hours ago, MikeSh said:

Yes but no. It's not that simple. 

I think that if it the car needs more torque than MG2 can provide then it can start the engine and use MG1 to 'backpedal' against that to get more. MG1 isn't all that powerful but the gearing gives it a big advantage.

Interesting.   Apart from knowing that they don't have a mechanical reverse gear, I didn't know the detail.   I am wondering if there is a limit, gradient-wise, that these cars can handle when reversing?   Relevant to me because of a couple of places that I occasionally go (but haven't yet in my new Corolla!).

[hind]

36 minutes ago, SDR said:

 I am wondering if there is a limit, gradient-wise, that these cars can handle when reversing? 

it applies to all cars, you know 😛 but electrical engine can perform much better IMO, with all that torque available from start.

[SDR]

1 hour ago, hind said:

it applies to all cars, you know 😛 but electrical engine can perform much better IMO, with all that torque available from start.

I know - and I hope so - respectively 😗

Just became a little concerned when I learned that there is no mechanical reverse gear.   That said, not thinking of anywhere that a manual or dual-clutch auto couldn't handle without issues.

[flash22]

Reverse works by reversing the phases of MG2, the engine will kick as a generator if it needs more power

[MikeSh]

3 minutes ago, SDR said:

Just became a little concerned when I learned that there is no mechanical reverse gear.

On that basis there is no mechanical forward gear either.

It doesn't have any 'gears' that can be engaged and disengaged like normal transmissions. But it is definitely mechanical in that the engine, motors and wheels are all permanently connected through a chain of gears.

The different 'ratios' and directions are achieved by juggling with the direction and speeds of the motors and the speed of the engine.

[Mjolinor]

http://eahart.com/prius/psd/

[SDR]

2 hours ago, MikeSh said:

On that basis there is no mechanical forward gear either.

It doesn't have any 'gears' that can be engaged and disengaged like normal transmissions. But it is definitely mechanical in that the engine, motors and wheels are all permanently connected through a chain of gears.

The different 'ratios' and directions are achieved by juggling with the direction and speeds of the motors and the speed of the engine.

True and, having an engineering background, I understand power split transmissions and epicyclic gears.

I suppose that I might have been clearer if I had said that I became a little concerned when I learned that the ICE cannot 'drive' the car backwards in the same way that it does forwards.

Probably unnecessarily so since I think that MG2 has higher peak torque than the ICE, and electric motors have peak torque at 0 rpm.

[MikeSh]

1 hour ago, SDR said:

Probably unnecessarily so since I think that MG2 has higher peak torque than the ICE, and electric motors have peak torque at 0 rpm.

Also, as far as I can tell from things said on the forum, MG2 in the MK4 is substantially (2x?) more powerful than in the MK3. I've not heard of anyone having trouble reversing a MK3 up a hill, so I don't think you will have a problem.

[SDR]

27 minutes ago, MikeSh said:

Also, as far as I can tell from things said on the forum, MG2 in the MK4 is substantially (2x?) more powerful than in the MK3. I've not heard of anyone having trouble reversing a MK3 up a hill, so I don't think you will have a problem.

And that, as a new owner, is, I suppose, really what this thread started me thinking about (although I have a Corolla rather than a Yaris).

With apologies to anyone who this exchange has bored half to death and for straying off topic!

[dash]

I reverse up a steep driveway every day and always safely stop within 70mm of a gate. I find reverse very controllable (using accelerator only) and can easily move 5mm at a time if need be.
I’ve had to disable PKSB (parking support brake system) as it kept slamming on the brakes when I got close to the fence running along the side of my drive.
On level ground, using the brake pedal to control movement against the normal creep of the car generally works fine unless you are up against a kerb or a slope, but as I’ve found on my driveway, in those situations gently squeezing the accelerator provides for very gentle, controllable movement. The car doesn’t surge uncontrollably.