Safety systems: Intelligent Speed Assistance, LDA, etc

[AndrueC]

I only dislike the speed warning and limiter concept because they are inaccurate. If they were accurate it'd be very unusual for them to trigger for me and if they did I'd be genuinely pleased.

In my experience as someone who is always mindful of the speed limit these systems are needed. I'm forever having people drive up behind me when I am driving at the limit. It sometimes seems like no-one else gives a damn about speed limits.

So quite frankly much as I dislike the current implementation I'm of the view that we (as drivers) have brought it upon ourselves. With a few exceptions we are not abiding by the speed limits and if we won't then technology needs to do it for us.

[Cyker]

IMHO the proper thing to do would be to retrain or for extreme cases remove drivers who habitually ignore things like the speed limit, red lights, give ways, etc., but also review speed limits generally as they keep pushing them lower for no good reason - We're at the point where there are 3 lane dual carriageways which have a 20mph speed limit and that is just ridiculous.

But as usual the powers that be are too lazy and can't be bothered to do that, so push the responsibility onto the car manufacturers instead, and I fear it will just exacerbate the downward spiral in driving standards.

 

[AndrueC]

@Cyker I don't think retraining would help because I doubt we can catch most drivers and the impact would just never be enough.

But I do agree about some of the new limits. I often have to travel through Oxfordshire and that means lots of 20mph zones through villages and even small towns. It's tortuous and even I struggle on some long runs. I also agree that it's doing more harm than good whilst I'd say that most people obey 30mph very, very few people are obeying 20 and as you say that weakens what little respect people already have for speed limits.

So I'd suggest: Force manufacturers and councils to work together to make their systems more reliable and start forced retraining or bigger penalties for speeders. At the heart of this might be a general lack of thought over what holding a driving license should mean. We've become a bit too blasé about it.

For all that we shouldn't lose sight of the fact that we are one of the safer nations to drive in.

[Niky]

On 7/12/2024 at 8:08 AM, AndrueC said:

I only dislike the speed warning and limiter concept because they are inaccurate. If they were accurate it'd be very unusual for them to trigger for me and if they did I'd be genuinely pleased

Spot on!!! I would also never be bothered of any speed limiter if the speed was accurate. My Corolla is 5mph off motorway speed - 75mph on the dash are exactly 70mph on GPS. Mine is 22reg, so got no issues with any speed warnings, but I would like to upgrade in the near future. Surely they can do a bit closer to the real speed - my Nissan vans are only 2mph off. My old Civic was 3mph. Toyota's 5mph is a bit too much

[Paul john]

1 hour ago, Niky said:

Spot on!!! I would also never be bothered of any speed limiter if the speed was accurate. My Corolla is 5mph off motorway speed - 75mph on the dash are exactly 70mph on GPS. Mine is 22reg, so got no issues with any speed warnings, but I would like to upgrade in the near future. Surely they can do a bit closer to the real speed - my Nissan vans are only 2mph off. My old Civic was 3mph. Toyota's 5mph is a bit too much

Depends which tyres you have. Mine is only 2

[sportse]

My 23 icon on 16" tyres is 4mph off at 70mph. Luckily I can set a 5mph allowance for the optional road sign warning to cover it, but I still get the warnings when it thinks the limit is lower than it actually is.

It's not as bad as my 14 Auris excel was, that was 7mph off at 70mph with the standard 17" tyres! I complained to Toyota but they said there was nothing that could be done.

[Cyker]

Mine's only 2 off - Have you lot checked your tyre pressures lately?  

 

[FROSTYBALLS]

11 hours ago, sportse said:

It's not as bad as my 14 Auris excel was, that was 7mph off at 70mph with the standard 17" tyres! I complained to Toyota but they said there was nothing that could be done.

Within legal limits.

In the UK, the indicated speed must never be less than the actual speed, i.e. it should not be possible to inadvertently speed because of an incorrect speedometer reading.
The indicated speed must not be more than 110 percent of the true speed, and for all actual speeds between 25 mph and 70 mph (or the vehicles' maximum speed if it is lower than this), the indicated speed must not exceed 110% of the actual speed, plus 6.25 mph.

E.g.  if the vehicle is actually traveling at 50 mph, the speedometer must not show more than 61.25 mph or less than 50 mph.

[sportse]

9 hours ago, Cyker said:

Mine's only 2 off - Have you lot checked your tyre pressures lately?  

 

Maybe the Corolla has such a wide variety of official tyre sizes, they can’t make it more accurate?

I’ve heard of dealers fitting 15 inch winter tyres up to the 18 inch tyres on the gr. 

I’ve had other cars that were only 1mph out at all speeds. For my Corolla, it seems to be a consistent 5/6% out with different speeds. 

[Jh27]

On 4/17/2024 at 8:33 PM, Cyker said:

The people you need to write to are your MPs, not Toyota  (And previously, MEPs, before we left the EU and threw away our ability to directly influence european legislation...)

Exactly this. Most of the problems with road sign assist are not the fault of the technology, but the fault of the signs they are reading (or not because the signs don't exist or are obscured) - the speed limit signs should be trademarked to prevent use of roundels on the back of vans, but even then it would be wide open to spoofing.

What we need is a national database, which the authorities are required to keep up-to-date, and all vehicles can freely access - so that the speed limiter can be as up-to-date as (say) Google Maps, if not more so. 

Smart motorways need to communicate directly with the car. Or at least don't use signs which strobe, when viewed by a camera. However we don't even have a consistent way of doing smart motorways - each one seems to work differently, and there are some glaringly stupid omissions - e.g. why don't they show something continuously? If there's no restrictions, show that.

[Paul john]

1 minute ago, Jh27 said:

Exactly this. Most of the problems with road sign assist are not the fault of the technology, but the fault of the signs they are reading (or not because the signs don't exist or are obscured) - the speed limit signs should be trademarked to prevent use of roundels on the back of vans, but even then it would be wide open to spoofing.

What we need is a national database, which the authorities are required to keep up-to-date, and all vehicles can freely access - so that the speed limiter can be as up-to-date as (say) Google Maps, if not more so. 

Smart motorways need to communicate directly with the car. Or at least don't use signs which strobe, when viewed by a camera. However we don't even have a consistent way of doing smart motorways - each one seems to work differently, and there are some glaringly stupid omissions - e.g. why don't they show something continuously? If there's no restrictions, show that.

So fundamentally change  the sineage in the Uk to make the system  work?
sorry what fairy land do you live in ?
perhaps a better approach would be to integrate with (multiple) systems that rate roads speed limit on gps location. 

[Cyker]

Indeed - The system needs to be as capable if not more so than the driver; It needs to be able to work In The Real World. If it isn't and can't, then it's not fit for purpose and should not be allowed on a vehicle.

If it needs special consideration to work properly, then why is it fair the driver doesn't get any and just gets penalized?

 

[sportse]

I believe the technology to communicate temporary speed limits and restrictions on motorways exists as I’ve seen a device that offers this, but at £100+ a year for a subscription and hundreds for the device. 
 

the problem is the current car camera system just doesn’t work reliably. I was on a road that was very clearly signposted as dropping from 70 dual carriageway to 50 and then later to 40. The car didn’t pick it up and thought a single road through a town was 70 not 40. If you’d have set cruise control to follow the speed limit it would be doing 30mph over. 

[fred88]

I have a gps device that picks up the speed limit for the road I'm on but it's common for it to pick up a neighbouring road. So I'm driving along a 60 or 70 mph road with the thing beeping away saying its 30 or something.

[badlywornroy]

Well ! I have had my 2022 Corolla 2 days and still pretty near the bottom of  the learning curve. However, yesterday while out I ' discovered ' the road sign icon on the dashboard. Mine had no visual warning ? the sign would appear and if over the speed limit would appear red until such time as I was on or under the limit when it would resort to normal. I haven't changed any settings, wouldn't know where/how  at this time. I'm a pretty ' sedate ' driver  so could the acoustic warning only ' kick in ' if you were significantly over the limit ?

[Moleman]

14 minutes ago, badlywornroy said:

Well ! I have had my 2022 Corolla 2 days and still pretty near the bottom of  the learning curve. However, yesterday while out I ' discovered ' the road sign icon on the dashboard. Mine had no visual warning ? the sign would appear and if over the speed limit would appear red until such time as I was on or under the limit when it would resort to normal. I haven't changed any settings, wouldn't know where/how  at this time. I'm a pretty ' sedate ' driver  so could the acoustic warning only ' kick in ' if you were significantly over the limit ?

22 model will have the means/choice to switch off the acoustic warning permanently. It has probably been switched off by a previous owner.

[kevker]

Hi all, just received my new corolla, my company having moved from Hyundai. Whilst i'm please with it, the intelligent speed assist is an issue. I don't mind the sign flashing, but is there anyway to turn off the annoying binging. Some of the roads i travel on have parallel side roads with lower speed limits, and the camera always picks these up, so it's constantly going up and down with the associated binging with it. Have tried a goodle search but nothing.

 

Also, my HUD is slightly at an angle on the windscreen, not an issue, but annoying nontheless. is this normal, or does the projection module need to be adjusted by the dealer.

 

Thanks in advance.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Similar topics merged

[Jayel]

I'm personally glad that mine, being a 2020 model, doesn't have the latest software. I sometimes use the A299 Thanet Way down in Kent which is a dual two lane with a 70 mph limit. Adjacent to it near Herne Bay is a local road with a 30mph limit. There is a 30 repeater sign on the offside of that road next to the A299 boundary. My camera picks that up and my speed indicator turns red. That must be even worse with the new fangled system.

[Paul john]

1 hour ago, Jayel said:

I'm personally glad that mine, being a 2020 model, doesn't have the latest software. I sometimes use the A299 Thanet Way down in Kent which is a dual two lane with a 70 mph limit. Adjacent to it near Herne Bay is a local road with a 30mph limit. There is a 30 repeater sign on the offside of that road next to the A299 boundary. My camera picks that up and my speed indicator turns red. That must be even worse with the new fangled system.

Yup mine too on my way to Margate at that point

[JasonM]

Not sure if you can switch off the speed limit audible warning permanently using Carista via bluetooth OSB2.  I know there are a lot of settings you cannot access via the normal settings menu in the car you can on Carista.  Maybe someone with a 2024 car and Carista might be able to confirm.  

think if it’s an EU safety regulation thing it’s probably hard coded into the ECU and cannot be changed.  Very frustrating. I took delivery of my car this year but it is a 73 reg so does not do this.

[sportse]

At least the Corolla beeps only when you first exceed what it thinks the speed limit is. Provided you don’t drop below the wrong limit it won’t beep again. 
 

unfortunately a ford loan car I had recently would bing at you repeatedly all the time you were over what it thought the limit was. 
 

disabling was a little bit better than Toyota but not that different. Press the settings button on the dash, then into the warning setting before you finally get to the actual disable button. 
 

it actually tells you on screen that it will come back on the next time you start the car, Toyota is too secret about what functions do on the dashboard settings menus. 
 

however… at least the Toyota system actually stays off when you turn it off until the restart. The ford I was driving would still bong away at you sometimes even though you had turned the speed warning off. Sometimes it worked, others not. 
 

[Alan3]

On 9/22/2024 at 2:42 PM, kevker said:

Hi all, just received my new corolla, my company having moved from Hyundai. Whilst i'm please with it, the intelligent speed assist is an issue. I don't mind the sign flashing, but is there anyway to turn off the annoying binging. Some of the roads i travel on have parallel side roads with lower speed limits, and the camera always picks these up, so it's constantly going up and down with the associated binging with it. Have tried a goodle search but nothing.

You have to turn it off every time you start the car.

If you put "Settings" in the central area of the dash display then you can turn off RSA (Road Sign Assist) in "just" 6 button presses. If you want to turn off the beeps but keep RSA active then you have to go a couple of levels down the menus, 11 button presses, one of which is a hold for 2 seconds, and which may have to be done with the car in Park.

Fortunately if you turn off the "Speed limit change alert" it stays off.

[Billgo]

I find that my Corolla Cross is not able to display the correct speed limits very often, either a blank or it misses the sign, this is a big failing in the software and it seems that Toyota are not prepared to rectify this.

My last 3 cars were Nissan Qashqai and never had such a problem, sorry I choose a Toyota this time.

[sportse]

16 minutes ago, Billgo said:

I find that my Corolla Cross is not able to display the correct speed limits very often, either a blank or it misses the sign, this is a big failing in the software and it seems that Toyota are not prepared to rectify this.

My last 3 cars were Nissan Qashqai and never had such a problem, sorry I choose a Toyota this time.

It’s not just Toyota, all manufacturers have to have the speed limit warnings now and the tech doesn’t work. 
 

the speed limit shown on the sat nav I have through Apple CarPlay is more often accurate than the camera based system in the dash. 
 

manufacturers could make a better system but it would be expensive and have to combine a country wide database with live updates supplemented by the camera. 
 

the brand new ford I was driving was about the same as Toyota for reading the correct speed limits and getting them wrong. 
 

a simple camera system doesn’t have the processing power to disregard side roads/etc when a driver would know to do this automatically.