Life of Yaris brake discs?

[sproutdreamer]

I am disappointed to realise that the discs front and back on our new to us Yaris are badly grooved after only 33k miles. In comparison my 08 Avensis discs are still pristine after 105k miles. Is  it unusual to have so much wear so quickly? I am wondering if Toyota quality has taken a dive over the last ten years. The Yaris also apparently had new rear wheel bearings at only 27k miles.

[Mojo1010]

Had a 16 plate Yaris which was 7 years old with 51k miles when it got sold, didn't need anything apart from tyres and services. 

[jcps001]

17 minutes ago, sproutdreamer said:

I am disappointed to realise that the discs front and back on our new to us Yaris are badly grooved after only 33k miles. In comparison my 08 Avensis discs are still pristine after 105k miles. Is  it unusual to have so much wear so quickly? I am wondering if Toyota quality has taken a dive over the last ten years. The Yaris also apparently had new rear wheel bearings at only 27k miles.

How many miles have had those brake discs? The previous owner was a heavy foot driver? The brake discs are cheap aftermarket or genuine Toyota? Maybe it's not a fault... Maybe it was just how it was used before...

[TonyHSD]

We have discussed these and the 12v batteries the most . 
The thing is that neither is a problem as lower quality or sometimes to do with manufacturing, it is way of use or lack of it that cause problems. 
 

[MikeSh]

A lot of modern cars go through discs. Advice is often to change discs and pads at the same time. It's probably a compromise as to get more friction you need softer steel for the pads to bite. 

AIUI back wheel bearings are a known weakness for these cars. I expect it's will fail at some stage. Not great.

[Cyker]

I used to get through pads and discs every 1.5-2 years on my Mk1 Yaris D4Ds because I do so much urban driving (The stop-start really doesn't do them any favours!), and the discs are relatively small so less material to get through.

My hybrid is over 3 years old now and not even a peep about the brakes in the service report  

 

[sproutdreamer]

2 hours ago, jcps001 said:

How many miles have had those brake discs? The previous owner was a heavy foot driver? The brake discs are cheap aftermarket or genuine Toyota? Maybe it's not a fault... Maybe it was just how it was used before...

I doubt the previous owners were heavy footed doing only 6k miles a yesr. Also it is not the sort of car for someone who drives fast with big mileages. At 33k I would expect the discs to be original otherwise the original discs wore out unbelievably fast. Either way it does not reflect well on Toyota quality!

[Yaris_Cross]

14 minutes ago, sproutdreamer said:

doubt the previous owners were heavy footed doing only 6k miles a yesr.

Mileage is not the issue here its how the person drives that is, what about all those drivers that brake for every corner however slight the curve  i am sure we have all followed them at some point usually cursing at them for holding us up and driving in such a manner 😄

[Cyker]

Also, too low mileage can actually be worse, esp. in a wetter part of the country: The discs will be much more prone to rusting and without brake action to clear it regularly, it will eat into the disc and form a much thicker layer of rust on the surface which will be ground into the discs when the brakes are next used.

This has been an issue for some hybrid owners as the brakes essentially never get used and end up being flagged on the MOT for excessive corrosion.

[anchorman]

It always amazes me how some are quick to lash out and blame quality without any understanding the reason.  Some don’t want a reason, they just want a moan.  No need to consider if it’s a common thing or if something unusual caused it, the decision is made.  Now any other brand that uses plain grey cast iron discs are far superior quality.   

[Guest]

In the recent, 5 days ago, franchised stealer "Health Report" my original pads are at 6mm and minimal wear on the discs. 60k miles.

No doubt with more urban stop/start driving they would have required changing by now. I'm rural with very little town driving.

Also not being transfixed on the windscreen and with a degree of anticipation should help prolong their life too. Remember, each time the brakes are applied it also wastes energy. The harder they're applied the more is wasted.

[JCT-DK]

So to prolog their lives and keep them free from corrosion would it be adviseable to brake lightly over a longer distance or brake harder over a shorter distance?

[JCT-DK]

I mostly do the latter if I see some corrosion on the discs.  

[JCT-DK]

Especially the rear discs need more work and harder braking to be activated.

[Cyker]

It depends; With (some of?) the hybrids, the rear brakes actually activate before the fronts to balance out the regen braking (Which is obviously only on the front axle) - We've had a few cases where the rears needed changing before the fronts!

For particularly bad cases, e.g. low mileage and only urban driving, the quick and dirty fix is to put it into N and brake *in a safe place, e.g. empty road*, which forces the car to only use the friction brakes like any normal car; That will usually clear most of the surface rust.

For people that do more normal distances and motorway driving, just drive as normal - You will do enough braking for the system to sort itself out (Even just braking down a motorway off-ramp or services is usually enough, esp. some of these junctions where the stopping distance is questionably short   . Had that a few weeks back when I was going for a services exit because I needed the toilet; The off-ramp seemed long at first but then suddenly turns really sharply to the left which caught me out - Thank smeg the Mk4's so agile - You really didn't need that sort of butt-clenching moment when you're desperate for the toilet!  )

 

 

[MikeSh]

On 7/18/2024 at 8:16 PM, Cyker said:

esp. in a wetter part of the country

I wonder about that. Unless the rain is coming at 45° discs won't get wet when parked and won't generally get wet while moving, when they get dried off by use anyway. Humidity is an issue, but even down south that happens.

I suspect car washing may be more of a problem as that usually gives everything a good soaking and often the car is left standing afterwards. In warmer weather you can see a patina of rust forming in hours, or even minutes. Repeat and rinse weekly (literally) - like one of my neighbours.

I only wash the cars a few times a year but immediately after I always take them a hundred metres up the road and back with some gentle braking to dry the discs off.

[ColinB]

I had a Toyota Prius as a company car, it was the standard for those in my grade. There were several where they had to change the discs due to corrosion, cue much discussion between Toyota and the lease company on echo was going to pay. Since then I make a point of applying the brakes reasonably hard once a week or so to clear any corrosion that has built up - the Toyota app does moan though about my heavy braking.

[Cyker]

12 minutes ago, MikeSh said:

I wonder about that. Unless the rain is coming at 45° discs won't get wet when parked and won't generally get wet while moving, when they get dried off by use anyway. Humidity is an issue, but even down south that happens.

I suspect car washing may be more of a problem as that usually gives everything a good soaking and often the car is left standing afterwards. In warmer weather you can see a patina of rust forming in hours, or even minutes. Repeat and rinse weekly (literally) - like one of my neighbours.

I only wash the cars a few times a year but immediately after I always take them a hundred metres up the road and back with some gentle braking to dry the discs off.

I find the water doesn't have to hit the discs directly to start the rusting process - My brakes are far less exposed than most others because of the steel rims and plastic wheel trims, but after it rains there is still a noticeable patina of rust developing on the discs. It's slightly worse on the Mk4 because the discs never get polished to the same level as they did on my previous cars.

Also, when I said wetter, I didn't necessarily mean 'rainer' - For instance, where my brother lives it is just for some reason pervasively damp-feeling all year round, and even when it hasn't rained for a while, the discs on his car would develop a noticeable patina of surface rust because he hardly ever drove it (That's also what ultimate led to its demise as this also caused the front and rear sub-frames to rust through!   )

You're definitely right about the washing though - I would also take it on a quick run to try and dry the brakes off otherwise they'd be bright orange the next day!  

Nowadays I hardly ever wash the car so that's been less of an issue, just the duller patina of rust that develops if I don't drive it during the holidays...

[Trewithy]

Brake disc pads have become a lot harder since asbestos was taken out of them, as a result more pressure is required between the pad and disc to slow the car down.  You won't have noticed this because the extra pressure is applied by the brake servo. So now discs are wearing almost as fast as the pads and that is why discs are needing to be replaced a lot sooner than they used to be.

[TonyHSD]

Yes, brake progressively over the short distance it’s better than slowing down with regen only over longer distance. 
You don’t waste energy because when pushed brakes harder regen is at its max and then brakes apply as additional braking force. For those who think otherwise, just do an experiment- drive like granny and note your fuel consumption, then do the same drive but drive normally, use harder acceleration and sharper braking and you will achieve better mpg ,have brake discs clean from rust and traction Battery topped up. 
In my high miles Auris the only thing that has been changed three times are the brake discs and pads, two times because of low usage and corrosion. 
Last time was back in February of 2020 at 140k miles, now the car is at 280000 miles and I had only ever replaced the rear discs and pads last year but the fronts are still in excellent condition, more than half life remains. 
On all modern cars post year 2000 that has abs + bas, asc etc rear brake pads and disks wear faster than front ones and on all Toyota hybrids particularly rear brakes engage electronically within even driver can notice, so they will wear faster for sure but still on regularly serviced car brakes they should last anywhere between 50-100k miles or more where fronts 100k + miles even 200k. The weather element is the key factor. 
The solution is harder braking from time to time, service every two years from brand new car - dismantling , cleaning all components from rust and lubricating the slider pins. No other lube anywhere should be used, no pads, no hubs, no wheels, and ultra important to torque the hub nuts to spec which on most Toyota cars is 104Nm

[anchorman]

5 hours ago, MikeSh said:

I wonder about that. Unless the rain is coming at 45° discs won't get wet when parked and won't generally get wet while moving, when they get dried off by use anyway. Humidity is an issue, but even down south that happens.

I suspect car washing may be more of a problem as that usually gives everything a good soaking and often the car is left standing afterwards. In warmer weather you can see a patina of rust forming in hours, or even minutes. Repeat and rinse weekly (literally) - like one of my neighbours.

I only wash the cars a few times a year but immediately after I always take them a hundred metres up the road and back with some gentle braking to dry the discs off.

I only wash mine a few times a week 🤭

[Rhymes with Paris]

28 minutes ago, anchorman said:

I only wash mine a few times a week

Isn't it best to give the discs a vigorous jet washing to remove that surface rust?

[anchorman]

5 hours ago, Trewithy said:

Brake disc pads have become a lot harder since asbestos was taken out of them, as a result more pressure is required between the pad and disc to slow the car down.  You won't have noticed this because the extra pressure is applied by the brake servo. So now discs are wearing almost as fast as the pads and that is why discs are needing to be replaced a lot sooner than they used to be.

You have to be careful with that statement because the actual hardness has nothing to do with pad or disc wear.  You could say that a pad with a lot of abrasive content would wear a disc.  Modern pads are steel based and use abrasives like silica to raise friction and graphite to stabilise it - that’s where the black dust comes from.   It’s not impossible to get something mixed in that will score discs but it’s more likely to have come from the road.  

[anchorman]

40 minutes ago, Rhymes with Paris said:

Isn't it best to give the discs a vigorous jet washing to remove that surface rust?

Brake discs will go rusty overnight but it seldom causes a problem.  Unless it’s very bad, it will wear off with a few applications.  

[Toymo10]

I have had a problem with scoring of the front disc only on the offside. First noticed when the car(Yaris Excel) was one month old with less than 500 miles on the clock ( November 2023). Reported it to Toyota and both discs were replaced ( possibly pads too but cant be  sure ) under warrenty.   For most of this year even wear on both discs with no scoring, but in the last month it has come back again only on offside. Initially I thought a stone had got under pad, but managed to get feeler gauge between the two and nothing there.

My overall thought was that  there was a problem with disc material or a problem with pad although car always braked in a straight line so nothing obviously wrong.  The fact that it never happens on nearside implies a disc/pad/caliper issue perhaps.

Car is in for service in two weeks and I have reported it again. Will update then.