New RAV4 PHEV charging issues

[Jerbs]

Afternoon all

I've had my 74 plate RAV4 PHEV Design for about 7 weeks now, and I'm having a few problems with charging and readings to my smart meter, see below:

1. My RAV is scheduled to charge between midnight and 5am. I plug the cable into the Toyota Home Charger at about 10pm then into the RAV and the charger doesn't lock into place, it only locks when charging starts at 12am. Correct me if I'm wrong but surely it should lock into place when the connecter is inserted, despite the schedule kicking in later?

2. Since my Toyota Home Charger was installed, I can no longer see my energy usage for my tariff despite my smart meter settings sending readings every 30 minutes. I'm with EDF and have a tariff that provides cheaper electricity between 12am and 5am, but I'm worried I'm going to be charged at the higher tariff if the smart meter isn't providing readings. EDF have been 'looking into it' for about 3 weeks now.

3. Does the smart meter in-home-display work with EV tariffs? Since my charger has been installed I no longer can see my electricity usage on the IHD (probably linked to the issue above). I raised this with EDF and was told that all EV tariffs don't provide data on the IHD.

Many thanks

[nlee]

I can’t answer 2&3 but for 1, that is how it works. The car has to detect power for the interlock to engage. If you want it to lock in, you have to leave the charger on and set the charging schedule in the car. 

[Jerbs]

1 minute ago, nlee said:

I can’t answer 2&3 but for 1, that is how it works. The car has to detect power for the interlock to engage. If you want it to lock in, you have to leave the charger on and set the charging schedule in the car. 

Thanks. So basically anyone can steal the cable before it starts charging? I do have the charging schedule setup within the car, but it doesn't lock into place when I lock the doors.

[GBgraham]

23 minutes ago, Jerbs said:

Thanks. So basically anyone can steal the cable before it starts charging? I do have the charging schedule setup within the car, but it doesn't lock into place when I lock the doors.

No, it should lock in so the lead can't be stolen or removed and used to charge a rouge vehicle. Mine locks in 2 or 3 seconds after I plug in (with or without power) and can't be removed unless I unlock the car.

[philip42h]

3. No, the IHD understands only a single tariff (for each fuel) so can't cope with EV tariffs with two or more 'intelligent' rates. The IHD is a silly gimmick anyway ...

2. I'm not quite sure what you mean but once you are on a 'complex' EV tariff your IHD won't be able to cope with the 'cost' side since it doesn't understand the variable rates. It should still measure usage in kWh reliably. Since your smart meter sends half-hourly readings, EDF should work out the charging correctly. If the smart meter is no longer sending half-hourly readings EDF have a problem to fix ...

[nlee]

34 minutes ago, GBgraham said:

No, it should lock in so the lead can't be stolen or removed and used to charge a rouge vehicle. Mine locks in 2 or 3 seconds after I plug in (with or without power) and can't be removed unless I unlock the car.

Yours must work differently then. Mine does not lock if the charge point is off. I presume same is the case for Jerbs in the OP as it locks when the schedule starts. 

[nlee]

1 hour ago, Jerbs said:

Thanks. So basically anyone can steal the cable before it starts charging? I do have the charging schedule setup within the car, but it doesn't lock into place when I lock the doors.

Do you also have a schedule set on the charge point? Most schedules on charge points are just like a timer switch on the power output so when it’s not on-schedule, there is no current to the plug. 

[GBgraham]

31 minutes ago, nlee said:

Yours must work differently then. Mine does not lock if the charge point is off. I presume same is the case for Jerbs in the OP as it locks when the schedule starts. 

It is quite possible your are correct, because I use the car's timer my power supply is always live. So sorry I apologise for miss information,

[Jerbs]

34 minutes ago, nlee said:

Do you also have a schedule set on the charge point? Most schedules on charge points are just like a timer switch on the power output so when it’s not on-schedule, there is no current to the plug. 

Not at the moment no. I’ve downloaded the ABB charger sync app and tried lots of different settings within, such as the free vending setting and a schedule, but still no luck. There is power to the charger and the 3 bottom green LED’s are lit when the car is connected to the charge point and it is not within the cars charge schedule.

[nlee]

4 minutes ago, Jerbs said:

Not at the moment no. I’ve downloaded the ABB charger sync app and tried lots of different settings within, such as the free vending setting and a schedule, but still no luck. There is power to the charger and the 3 bottom green LED’s are lit when the car is connected to the charge point and it is not within the cars charge schedule.

Not sure I can help then. You have a different charger and a newer version of the car. Not sure if you mean green led’s on the charge point or on the car socket (mine only has one led on the socket), but if there is power from the charge point (irrelevant whether there is power to the charge point) then mine will lock in place after a few seconds. 

[Jerbs]

1 minute ago, nlee said:

Not sure I can help then. You have a different charger and a newer version of the car. Not sure if you mean green led’s on the charge point or on the car socket (mine only has one led on the socket), but if there is power from the charge point (irrelevant whether there is power to the charge point) then mine will lock in place after a few seconds. 

Yes I mean the LED’s on the charge point. There is one LED on the car that illuminates solid green when charging.

[philip42h]

I guess that you mean these LEDs:

[Jerbs]

1 minute ago, philip42h said:

I guess that you mean these LEDs:

Yes, and the Charging LED illuminates when the car is plugged in within the charge schedule

[philip42h]

I don't yet have either an EV or a charger, but it would appear that the charger recognises the car (LED C), but that the car doesn't lock the cable until it is receiving charge (LED B). So, maybe that's the problem ... but I've no idea what the solution might be! 😉 

[Jerbs]

1 minute ago, philip42h said:

I don't yet have either an EV or a charger, but it would appear that the charger recognises the car (LED C), but that the car doesn't lock the cable until it is receiving charge (LED B). So, maybe that's the problem ... but I've no idea what the solution might be! 😉 

Yeah that seems to be the issue. If I remember correctly the granny charger would lock into the car socket even out of schedule.

[Nick72]

4 hours ago, GBgraham said:

No, it should lock in so the lead can't be stolen or removed and used to charge a rouge vehicle. Mine locks in 2 or 3 seconds after I plug in (with or without power) and can't be removed unless I unlock the car.

That's how mine works I think. 

[Nick72]

3 hours ago, nlee said:

Yours must work differently then. Mine does not lock if the charge point is off. I presume same is the case for Jerbs in the OP as it locks when the schedule starts. 

Now I need to check this. Because I get a clunk sound and relay flip over when I plug in even though it's scheduled for a later charge. I'm on a Project EV 7.4kW home charger from 5 years back. 

[JimRoyle]

Question #3 - The IHD is a waste of space, I would get one of the apps that allows you to connect into the datastream from your smart meter. There's quite a few out there. One that I know and have used is called Hugo but there's quite a few of them out there.

[nlee]

The way I understand it works is the top two small pins on the Type 2 plug/socket are called PP (proximity pilot) and CP (control pilot). I believe it is the PP that tells the car (and charge point) that it's connected, and therefore triggers the lock. This is based on a 12v circuit and is primarily to stop the 240v supply from the charge point and risk of shock if it's not properly connected. 

I presume in my case (with the schedule set on the charge point) that when the charge point is out of schedule, it also doesn't supply the 12v, hence it doesn't lock. If my charge point is on I presume the 12v is always on because regardless of whether I set a schedule in the car or not, it locks. I haven't use the granny charger for a while, but I seem to remember that was the same, i.e. if it was plugged into a 3 pin socket, regardless of car schedule it locked in place.

I can only assume the issue for you is that even though the charge point is ready to provide the power (i.e. no schedule set on the charge point), it is still not got a live 12v on the PP. Maybe your charge point is trying to do something clever and is waiting for a signal on either the PP or CP from the car, once the car schedule kicks in, before it supplies the 12v on the PP?

I'm not an expert on this so don't go sticking fingers in the plug based on my comments! It's only supposition trying to make logical sense of it.  

[P_J]

My granny charger is powered 24/7. 
When I connect it, it locks itself in, regardless of schedule. Unlocks when I unlock car. 
So agree with above, if no power at the plug, it won't lock in. 
Can you set charger to charge 'all the time' and just create a schedule in-car, to only take power at 12:00am midnight? 
I would think that should at least lock the cable in the car. 

As for the IHD - yes, they can't update quick enough to reapply different rates at midnight and again 5/7am, but the billing is done from the meter so should be right. 
I use the Bright app, from Glowmarkt, which seems to work very well. It dragged in all historical usage when I first set it up, so was able to look back and see what I should have been paying. You can enter you own tariff details to apply from the date you switched over. 

[Jerbs]

1 hour ago, P_J said:

My granny charger is powered 24/7. 
When I connect it, it locks itself in, regardless of schedule. Unlocks when I unlock car. 
So agree with above, if no power at the plug, it won't lock in. 
Can you set charger to charge 'all the time' and just create a schedule in-car, to only take power at 12:00am midnight? 
I would think that should at least lock the cable in the car. 

As for the IHD - yes, they can't update quick enough to reapply different rates at midnight and again 5/7am, but the billing is done from the meter so should be right. 
I use the Bright app, from Glowmarkt, which seems to work very well. It dragged in all historical usage when I first set it up, so was able to look back and see what I should have been paying. You can enter you own tariff details to apply from the date you switched over. 

Thanks, I’ll have another play around with the ABB app and the vehicle schedule. I’m just going to unplug the IHD and I’ll try the Bright app you mentioned, or the Hugo app someone mentioned earlier.

[JimRoyle]

1 minute ago, Jerbs said:

Thanks, I’ll have another play around with the ABB app and the vehicle schedule. I’m just going to unplug the IHD and I’ll try the Bright app you mentioned, or the Hugo app someone mentioned earlier.

I use the charger as a dumb charge point. I set the schedule on the vehicle so that when ever it is plugged into the charge point it charges from 00.30 to 04.30. Or as soon as it's full. That 4 hours is enough to fill the PHEV Battery on the EV tariff.

I have used both Hugo and Bright. They're very similar apps.

[Jerbs]

1 minute ago, JimRoyle said:

I use the charger as a dumb charge point. I set the schedule on the vehicle so that when ever it is plugged into the charge point it charges from 00.30 to 04.30. Or as soon as it's full. That 4 hours is enough to fill the PHEV battery on the EV tariff.

I have used both Hugo and Bright. They're very similar apps.

Cheers. Does your cable lock into the charging socket on the car out of your set hours? 

[JimRoyle]

37 minutes ago, Jerbs said:

Cheers. Does your cable lock into the charging socket on the car out of your set hours? 

Yes.

[Nick72]

1 hour ago, Jerbs said:

Cheers. Does your cable lock into the charging socket on the car out of your set hours? 

Mine does. Project EV. Checked before. It's clearly providing the it's connected voltage whether it is scheduled or not. This sounds like the right way of doing it.