What's the difference between P and (P)

[adidev]

My MY4 Motion has two parking buttons that seems they both do the same job: P above the gear shift and (P) on the right side of it. What is the difference?

[Paul john]

P is Park as in Automatic Gearbox “Park”

(P) is electronic Parking Brake as in “handbrake” 

independent systems hence 2 buttons

[adidev]

Just now, Paul john said:

P is Park as in Automatic Gearbox “Park”

(P) is electronic Parking Brake as in “handbrake” 

independent systems hence 2 buttons 

So, this car has a gearbox?!

I just asked Gemini, and it says that the P is a traditional parking brake applied mechanically. The (P) is using an electric motor to hold the car in place.

[Paul john]

4 minutes ago, adidev said:

So, this car has a gearbox?!

I just asked Gemini, and it says that the P is a traditional parking brake applied mechanically. The (P) is using an electric motor to hold the car in place.

Ecvt is not a traditional gearbox as such. Why don't you download your manual from toyota and sit down with a cup of coffee and get to know the nuances of your car.

“electronic parking brake” would be a generic term as it can be an electronic system moving physical brakes or a system that utilises the electric motors. Either way it acts like a traditional cars “handbrake”. 

Glad your dealer could confirm your question. 

[adidev]

1 minute ago, Paul john said:

Ecvt is not a traditional gearbox as such.

This is bZ4X forum, the BEV don't have a traditional gearbox nor eCVT. They only have a fix, single speed transmission. I read the manual and there is not much said about P except like "Fully stop the vehicle and set the parking brake, and then press the P position switch" or "Pull the switch to set the parking brake". I was waiting for the car for 3 months, I read the manual several times 😉, but it doesn't mean I understood everything or didn't miss something 😅

[philip42h]

33 minutes ago, adidev said:

I just asked Gemini

Gemini is an AI system that gathers its misinformation from nonsense it finds on the Interweb - it will be wrong more often than not ... 😉

[philip42h]

48 minutes ago, adidev said:

My MY4 Motion has two parking buttons that seems they both do the same job: P above the gear shift and (P) on the right side of it. What is the difference?

P is Park - as in not Drive, Neutral or Reverse. So, it's the 'gear' you leave the car in when you are not using it.

(P) is the handbrake (or electronic parking brake). If you set things up correctly, the handbrake comes on auto-magically when you put the car into Park and releases when you select Drive, Neutral or Reverse. So, it's an almost redundant switch and I will never use it!

(I must go and check that mine is set-up correctly!)

[philip42h]

Somewhere buried in the manual:

■ Turning the automatic mode on
While the vehicle is stopped, pull and hold the parking brake switch until a buzzer sounds and a message is shown on the multi-information display.

When the automatic mode is turned on, the parking brake operates as follows.

• When the shift position is shifted from P, the parking brake will be released, and the parking brake indicator light will turn off.
• When the shift position is shifted to P, the parking brake will be set, and the parking brake indicator light will turn on.

Operate the shift position with the vehicle stopped and the brake pedal depressed.

[Mister Mike]

I haven't tried it myself, but I read somewhere that pulling the park button in a moving EV for more than a couple of seconds will engage emergency braking.

[philip42h]

58 minutes ago, Mister Mike said:

I haven't tried it myself, but I read somewhere that pulling the park button in a moving EV for more than a couple of seconds will engage emergency braking.

Where by "park button", you mean "parking brake switch" - the Park button just puts the car into Park!

To my mind the only useful role for the "parking brake switch" is to apply the emergency brakes - and I hope never to have to use it. But 'someone' will have to find out whether it can be used to accomplish "handbrake turns" ... 😉 😄 

[Cyker]

The P is Park mode, and probably locks the drivetrain so it can't move like it does on most 'automatics' (Which is what EVs and also the Toyota hybrids get classified as despite the lack of any sort of automatic gearbox  ). The ((P)) is the Electronic Parking Brake, the (IMHO) inferior alternative to the traditional mechanical handbrake.

 

You can stop the car with the ((P)) but it's really slow to engage as you have to hold it down for a significant amount of time before it registers that you actually want to do that and haven't just accidentally pressed it by mistake - Definitely not much use in a sudden emergency, much faster to slam on the brakes the normal way!

It doesn't lock the rear wheels unless you're going slow enough bizarrely, I guess it doesn't fully engage to avoid locking the rear wheels and sending the car into a spin? Attempts to do a handbrake turn were... disappointing.

(None of this was attempted with my car so might not be 100% the same with the various different Toyota EPBs... )

 

[flash22]

P is Park, it engages a physical park pawl into the driveline to stop the wheels from turning

(P) is the parking brake - this uses small motors on the rear brake discs to hold the rear brakes on when applied

[Mister Mike]

1 hour ago, philip42h said:

Where by "park button", you mean "parking brake switch" - the Park button just puts the car into Park!

To my mind the only useful role for the "parking brake switch" is to apply the emergency brakes - and I hope never to have to use it. But 'someone' will have to find out whether it can be used to accomplish "handbrake turns" ... 😉 😄 

Words. The "park brake switch" on the BZ4X is a button that you pull rather than press.

[Mister Mike]

43 minutes ago, Cyker said:

You can stop the car with the ((P)) but it's really slow to engage as you have to hold it down for a significant amount of time before it registers that you actually want to do that and haven't just accidentally pressed it by mistake - Definitely not much use in a sudden emergency, much faster to slam on the brakes the normal way!

The context where I've seen this reported is anti-EV moaners complaining that you're stuffed if the brake pedal fails. If the brake pedal fails, I wouldn't mind a few seconds lag if pulling on a button actually brings the car to a halt.

[Cyker]

Not sure why, doesn't have anything to do with EVs - Virtually every modern car has an EPB!

I've never liked them as they are slow and rely on the ECU and 12v system to work, so if those go wrong (And at this point the software is much more likely to freak out than the mechanicals) you don't really have any options!   And trying to pull on it quickly in an emergency is virtually impossible (More likely you'll have a death grip on the steering wheel trying to control the car rather than fumbling for some tiny switch!  )

They are really only for holding the car still when parked and not for emergency use like a handbrake can be (Unlike EPB and footbrake, handbrakes still work if the car has lost all power and hydraulics!).

Still, better than nothing and in the situation where you've lost hydraulics on the motorway but have plenty of time to stop in the hard shoulder then they are adequate. (Trying to time the stop for one of the tiny (un)Smart Motorway laybys might be trickier tho' as once it's engaged to slows the car very quickly, but it's that initial delay that is tricky to account for!) 

 

[TonyHSD]

(P) - the electronic parking brake does indeed work as emergency brake on all 4 wheels on most modern cars that comes with electronically controlled brakes similar to Toyota hybrids. 
If for some reasons the brake pedal becomes unusable pulling up and hold the (P) button will engage emergency braking to a complete stop. 

P - only as already explained it’s just a transaxle lock mechanism that prevents front wheels from turning. On rear wheel drive will be rear wheels. If you select this at speeds below 5 mph the car will suddenly stop without any brake lights ON, not a a good experience. Can also lead to accidents or break up the locking  mechanism. If you select it at speeds over 5mph nothing will happen except a short beep.  

[adidev]

Thanks for all the explanations. I learned how to stop the car in case of brake failure 😉

The main reason why I asked is that whether I press P or pull ((P)), the car makes exactly the same noise, which lead to my thinking that they both are doing the same job.

[Cyker]

Yeah, so I don't know when they started doing this, but at some point Toyota added the ability to link P and ((P)), i.e. so when the car is put into Park, it automatically engages the EPB as well, making that whirring screechy sound, and made that the default (You can turn that off by holding UP on the EPB switch while in Park, or turn it on by holding down the EPB while in Park - This may be desirable if you are somewhere very cold and the rear pads tend to get stuck to the discs overnight).

This makes a lot of sense as all 4 wheels are now locked and the Parking pawl isn't the only thing holding the car still. I don't know why it took so long for them to add this simple-seeming feature, but it's here now!

 

Previously, putting it in P wouldn't do that so you'd have to put it in P and activate the EPB separately, and a lot of cars would be left only own the parking pawl (Not great if you parked on a hill!).

 

[philip42h]

2 hours ago, Cyker said:

You can turn that off by holding UP on the EPB switch while in Park, or turn it on by holding down the EPB while in Park

Except that Up is On and Down is Off - just as it is with a 'normal' handbrake lever ... 😉

[Cyker]

Yes! Thank you! I meant that but still somehow wrote it the wrong way round  

Let this be a test of whether the reader is paying attention...   

Also a good reminder to not blindly trust everything I write