Questions About A Few Parts

[MIP]

I was looking at the fensport website at parts for my st202:

Fensport Parts link

I was originally just looking at shocks and springs, but the engine mods look v. interesting. I don't know a great deal of detail about what would be worth while, and what would be a waste of time for performance.

q1: What kind of advantage would the Iridium spark plugs have over the platinum ones?

q2: I can see a blitz panel filter in there, I've read people recommending the trd one. Is this not a complete list of fensports products?

q3: Is there much of an advantage with the 'High flow trd sports oil filter'? I remember reading somthing about a valve in the toyota oil filter so would it be unwise using somthing else?

q4: What does a 'TRD Low Temperature Sports Thermostat, opening temperature is reduced to 71 degrees C. - 3SGE' do?

q5: What does the 'Power Boost Valve: Adjustable Fuel Pressure Regulator with remote mounting kit ' do? I take it you can controll the pressure the fuel is under being pushed out the injectors? Do you get some kind of in-car control, how does this work out in terms of power?

q6: Has anyone used the 'Superchips ICON Reprogrammes your engines Ignition Advance Curve giving approximately 8 BHP increase at 4,500rpm. Improved Power/Torque and throttle response From 3,000rpm, Easily fitted into wiring loom just ahead of ecu.'? This sounds very tempting, would you need any other parts for the engine to cope with the power increase? How does this actually work to get the increased power?

All these mods look very interesting, but I can't really afford to cripple my motorway cruising fuel economy. Which of these mods would have the biggest impact, and is it possible to install some of these (like the 'superchip') in such a way that you could wire in a switch to enable/disable them, so you can select sport/fuel economy?

[sotal]

TRD Sports Oil Filter should have the valve in as well (with it still being toyota?) but I'm sure someone with one will let you know for sure.

Sports Thermostat will open earlier so it will start to cool down earlier. Not sure but there must be a downside else they would just set the OEM ones at 71 degrees?

Anyway - I'm back from holiday so I'll try and get that video done this week

[MIP]

TRD Sports Oil Filter should have the valve in as well (with it still being toyota?) but I'm sure someone with one will let you know for sure.

Sports Thermostat will open earlier so it will start to cool down earlier. Not sure but there must be a downside else they would just set the OEM ones at 71 degrees?

Anyway - I'm back from holiday so I'll try and get that video done this week

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Where is is this thermostat though, is this to do with circulating engine coolant earlier? Nice one with the vid, still havn't done another myself, I've not had any better ideas about securing the cam yet.

[sotal]

yeah the thermostat remains closed to get the engine up to temp quicker, then when it reaches a set temperature it opens and lets the coolant circulate, that sports thermostat will just open earlier so it won't get as hot without coolant.

It shouldn't take long to get to temp anyway, so I guess the only point is if you are going to be working it hard from early on??? But that would knacker it anyway?? I'm sure someone who knows more will be a long soon

[SyCelicaGT]

q1: What kind of advantage would the Iridium spark plugs have over the platinum ones?

If you have platinum ones then these are the correct ones to use in the celica anyway so I should not think you would see much improvment by using the Iridium ones.

q2: I can see a blitz panel filter in there, I've read people recommending the trd one. Is this not a complete list of fensports products?

You can get an induction kit aswell if you want the engine to sound more meaty! However I have heard that the hot air in the engine compartment of the ST202 means that the inducation kit is not as effective as the pannel filter, but I am very happy with my K&N inducation kit.

q3: Is there much of an advantage with the 'High flow trd sports oil filter'? I remember reading somthing about a valve in the toyota oil filter so would it be unwise using somthing else?

You will probably notice some sort of gain with this mod but I should imagine that it will be so small that you will hardly notice it and probaly will not be as effective as giving the car a ruddy good service.

q4: What does a 'TRD Low Temperature Sports Thermostat, opening temperature is reduced to 71 degrees C. - 3SGE' do?

think this question has already been answered. I am not too sure about the gains from this mod as I think it tricks the engine into thinking it is cooler than it really is so that can't be good in my oppinion.

q5: What does the 'Power Boost Valve: Adjustable Fuel Pressure Regulator with remote mounting kit ' do? I take it you can controll the pressure the fuel is under being pushed out the injectors? Do you get some kind of in-car control, how does this work out in terms of power?

I think this is something you should do as a last modification to complement the core modifications but I am sure someone who knows more about this will be along to comment further.

q6: Has anyone used the 'Superchips ICON Reprogrammes your engines Ignition Advance Curve giving approximately 8 BHP increase at 4,500rpm. Improved Power/Torque and throttle response From 3,000rpm, Easily fitted into wiring loom just ahead of ecu.'? This sounds very tempting, would you need any other parts for the engine to cope with the power increase? How does this actually work to get the increased power?

Again this is strictly a final modification after you have done all the basics as you will notice hardly any gains from it unless your engine has been changed significatly from stock as the ecu on the ST202 automatically learns and adjusts the engine to create the optimum bang in the engine anyway.

All these mods look very interesting, but I can't really afford to cripple my motorway cruising fuel economy. Which of these mods would have the biggest impact, and is it possible to install some of these (like the 'superchip') in such a way that you could wire in a switch to enable/disable them, so you can select sport/fuel economy?

If you are thinking about things like fuel economy then I would not bother doing anything as your foot will be inclined to be put to the floor more when you mod your car so you will spend more money on fuel due to that anyway. But I have noticed that things like a de-cat pipe have improved my feul ecomomy rather than the expected result of hindering it. (it is only my heavy right foot which has hindered my fuel ecomomy).

If you have not done anything then I would recommend you do the following:

Air intake - panel filter or induction kit

Exaust - Back box & De-cat

Springs - Ebach or spax seem to the be choice (note~: your shockS will wear out very quickly after this mod so you will need to upgrade)

Shocks - KYB or other

Strut brace - front & rear

My fav mods are definatly the suspension modifications as you will notice a huge change in the performance as the st202 engine is difficult to get more power for a little amount of money.

Anyway... that is my 2 pence, I am sure someone will be along to rip it apart.

Good luck with the mods fella!

[GT4 BOOSTER]

my last visit to the dealers , he showed me 2 oil filters ,1 stumpy thing and the other was twice as long , agreed mine is a st205 , but these oil filters will most likely fit the st202 , the longer one being able to filter more and last longer.

[SyCelicaGT]

my last visit to the dealers , he showed me 2 oil filters ,1 stumpy thing and the other was twice as long , agreed mine is a st205 , but these oil filters will most likely fit the st202 , the longer one being able to filter more and last longer.

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Yeah but probably will not be able to get any gains from ether items and I would go with the one which was kinder to my engine everytime, so I presume your saying the TRD one is the stubby one and will not filter as much of the crap out of the oil as the toyota one?

[MIP]

Cheers SyCelicaGT, I'm not too heavy footed on the road. I'd definatly do my shocks and springs (and strut brace?) first before anything with the engine. This is partly for looks, and for handling as well.

The reason I'm considering mods is for a bit of fun, n that I fancy doing a few track days, so thats why I like the idea of performance mods that I can turn on and off. I guess I'll come back to the engine a bit later, but I'm still curious about what these various parts will do, how they do what they do, and whether I can live the dream, and have it switchable between sport/fuel economy. But like you say, the panel filter and exhaust would be first.

I've gotta do a fair few months of saving, I'm aiming for 17" wheels and the suspention before xmas and looking at more performance just before summer 2k6.

[mikeb]

I was looking at the fensport website at parts for my st202:

Fensport Parts link

I was originally just looking at shocks and springs, but the engine mods look v. interesting. I don't know a great deal of detail about what would be worth while, and what would be a waste of time for performance.

q1: What kind of advantage would the iridium spark plugs have over the platinum ones? None, possibly last a bit longer. But iridiums should last 60k miles anyway.

q2: I can see a blitz panel filter in there, I've read people recommending the trd one. Is this not a complete list of fensports products? Not sure. I'd go for the TRD one if I was going to use an aftermarket filter.

q3: Is there much of an advantage with the 'High flow trd sports oil filter'? I remember reading somthing about a valve in the toyota oil filter so would it be unwise using somthing else? In theory minimises the pressure drop across the filter. Possibly larger surface area, or coubikr filter. It won't gain you any power though.

q4: What does a 'TRD Low Temperature Sports Thermostat, opening temperature is reduced to 71 degrees C. - 3SGE' do?  It opens at 71 degrees (I think std is 78?). If you are driving the engine really hard (racing) opening the thermostat a bit sooner gives the cooling system a better chance of keeping the temperature down. The stock cooling system is quite good though, especially if you use Toyota 4life coolant.

q5: What does the 'Power Boost Valve: Adjustable Fuel Pressure Regulator with remote mounting kit ' do? I take it you can controll the pressure the fuel is under being pushed out the injectors? Do you get some kind of in-car control, how does this work out in terms of power? Whatever you do, don't bother with one of these. It adjusts the fuel pressure, which affects the quantity of fuel that the engine is expecting. You only need to change the fueling if you have modified the engines volumetric efficiency (breathing). And air filters don't count because they're before the MAP sensor. If you do get to the stage where you need to change the fueling, the first thing you should do it install a wideband O2 sensor, followed by a piggyback ecu (unichip, e-manage).

q6: Has anyone used the 'Superchips ICON  Reprogrammes your engines Ignition Advance Curve giving approximately 8 BHP increase at 4,500rpm. Improved Power/Torque and throttle response From 3,000rpm, Easily fitted into wiring loom just ahead of ecu.'? This sounds very tempting, would you need any other parts for the engine to cope with the power increase? How does this actually work to get the increased power? I don't know for sure, but I suspect it advances ignition around peak volumetric efficiency. It may need higher octane fuel to get away with this. Otherwise, why didn't Toyota use that ignition curve from the factory?

All these mods look very interesting, but I can't really afford to cripple my motorway cruising fuel economy. Which of these mods would have the biggest impact, and is it possible to install some of these (like the 'superchip') in such a way that you could wire in a switch to enable/disable them, so you can select sport/fuel economy?

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It is quite difficult to improve the 3s-ge engine, as with most modern cars, the manufacturers design/development is quite good and difficult to improve upon.

My preferred order of mods would be:

1. De-cat

2. Exhaust

3. Wideband O2

4. E-manage

5. Possibly nitrous

6. Stronger gearbox/clutch

7. Supercharger!

[SyCelicaGT]

Yeah, the whole track day thing is where I am going with mine.

I have it as a hobbies and as my daily car but sometimes you can't have your cake and eat it. e.g. lower the car to improve handling and you will suffer ride comfort. To combat this you can install things like adjustable suspension such as the KYB (AGX) gas shockers which allows you to make the suspension hard or soft at the turn of a knob. (www.buypartsby.co.uk cheapest in the land for KYB suspension!) Unfortunately my wallet did not stretch to this and I settled for the KYB excel-g's and they are great!

The suspension and chassis upgrades are the best I would recommend the strut braces to anyone as it has made under steer a distant memory!

The engine upgrades are virtually unnoticeable. You do notice a little more torque at about 3000 revs (torque is what the Celica lacks) from adding the decat pipe so I would defiantly recommend you do this mod. If you do then I would also purchase an upgraded air filter or induction kit because they both allow better air flow in to the engine, thus creating more bangs and in turn more power. And streamlining the air flow in the Celica engine is about all you can do without spending silly money and whacking a turbo on the engine but you may as well buy a GT4!

However even engine mods do not equal the feeling of being able to go into a turn you knew you could only take at about 30mph before the suspension upgrade, then after upgrading you can do at almost twice the speed.

The Celica is one of the best handling cars I have ever driven when the suspension is fully tweaked (bar a 4x4 Impreza Sti with prodrive kit which is insane!) I go into corners at the maximum speed I feel comfortable with on a public road (quite quick) and it just eats up the turn and asks for more, so I will have to take it down a track now the suspension has been done to put it to the limits, as I still have not reached them yet!

I hope you get everything you want from your Celica, it can be one of the best handling cars around if you do it properly but you will always crave for more speed with the st202 and you may as well buy a GT4 if you want more engine power!

Engine mods not really worth the money (except de-cat) but suspension mods worth every penny.

[TheNissanMan]

I thought Superchips just plugged straight on the back of the ECU with standard replacement settings, not the best solution as it would not take into account the mod's you have carried out on your car although a lot cheaper than a programmable piggyback system....

Something like the Unichip/Motec systems can be mapped to your cars setup to make sure you get the best power from your config and can then be remapped at a later date if need be...

[MIP]

Thanks again Mike n Sy, saves me guessing and eventually wasting cash + its just interesting n gives me a clear order in which to do things.

I was having a look at the website you put up Sy, and it has KYB AGX Shocks, (for which they list a part for the celica), and 'KYB Gas Shocks', which don't list anything for the celica, though they have them for various other toyota's. Which ones are the in-car adjustable ones?

The idea of being able to easily adjust how hard the shocks are I find v. appealing, does it change the ride height at the same time? I think ideally, I don't want too much of a drop, 20-30mm? There are alot of speed bumps on my road :ffs: .

[SyCelicaGT]

Thanks again Mike n Sy, saves me guessing and eventually wasting cash + its just interesting n gives me a clear order in which to do things. 

I was having a look at the website you put up Sy, and it has KYB AGX Shocks, (for which they list a part for the celica), and 'KYB Gas Shocks', which don't list anything for the celica, though they have them for various other toyota's. Which ones are the in-car adjustable ones?

The idea of being able to easily adjust how hard the shocks are I find v. appealing, does it change the ride height at the same time? I think ideally, I don't want too much of a drop, 20-30mm? There are alot of speed bumps on my road  :ffs: .

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Hi MIP,

Right... to lower the car you will need lowering springs so these are totally separate to the shocks. I would research the type of springs very carefully, mine are AVO springs and give me a very respectable 40mm drop (this is basically a standard drop for lowering springs) However mine are a little hard on ride quality but go round corners like it is on rails! I have heard that SPAX or EBACH (think that is how you spell it) are the best combined with KYB shocks.

To insure the stock shock absorbers do not wear out in about 5 minutes (and they will) after fitting lowering springs you need to uprate the shocks too. I brought KYB excel-g shocks which I understand are about 30% firmer than stock and so can take quite a pounding. I looked at KYB agx shock absorbers and Koni yellow shocks for mine as initially I was going to go all bling and get some fully adjustable suspension for track and road use and you can adjust them via a little knob on each shocker (v.cool!) but I then took into consideration that I needed some other parts fitted too and so my budget dwindled, but I learned that the Koni shocks require a bit of bodging and welding to get them in to the rear of the car. However the KYB's just fit straight on so I would defiantly recommend you go down the KYB agx shockers rather than the Koni route just to save on mechanic labour costs.

Alternatively if you have a fat wallet and what to go all out you can get adjustable coilovers which mean you can adjust both ride height and spring rate and they are much more responsive. However I hear these are ruddy expensive and the ride quality goes to sh*t especially on British roads. A little OTT on a ST202 if you ask me!

If you really want to get adjustables go down the KYB agx route with SPAX or Ebach lowering springs. KYB agx are about £350 from buypartby and lowering springs are between £100 - £200 then labour to fit the lot will be about £100 a wheel although you maybe able to get the labour costs down. I recommend you find someone good in Newbury to do it. I live in Reading and get P.P.S Body Tech to do my car and Peter who owns the place is a legend and is very reliable!

To find the AGX shocks on the buypartsby web site do to "AGX shocks" on the drop down list and you will find them there. They also sell the KYB excel-g's too (these are also a very good cost effective shocker to cope with lowering springs). The site is a little confusing so I just rang them up. I guaranty you that you will not find them cheaper anywhere else. Go here for more info: http://www.kyb.com/

[MIP]

Cheers Sy, you been a great help. Looking at KYB agx shocks from the site you recommend, and Eibach springs (30mm drop, perfect) from fensport, it comes to £522 inc VAT, plus delivery, plus labour. I've used the same garage for years, as has my familly (right near my folks house), so I'll get a quote from them nearer the time.

Is this all I would need for the time being or would there be added strain on other parts? There's obviously joints n bushes n all sorts that I don't really know alot about. You mentioned a strut brace (of which I can see a £180 trd one on fensport) but is it somthing I could initially leave out?

Hopefully shouldn't take me too long to save as I'm startin good new job this month, not sure whether I'd do this or 17" wheels first, I'll worry about that once I've got a bit of cash together.

[paseoGT4]

q1: What kind of advantage would the Iridium spark plugs have over the platinum ones?

- probably no real gains - less likely for the tip to burn out - more useful if youre running some sort of boost - turbo / nos / supercharger

q3: Is there much of an advantage with the 'High flow trd sports oil filter'? I remember reading somthing about a valve in the toyota oil filter so would it be unwise using somthing else?

- not really - use descent oil and change regularly

q4: What does a 'TRD Low Temperature Sports Thermostat, opening temperature is reduced to 71 degrees C. - 3SGE' do?

- again useful if your running boost to keep the engine cool - but better to fit a higher flow radiator

[cookci]

if you fitted an earlier opening thermostat the ecu could always think the engine is cold and overfuel

no point fitting a better radiator either as the cooling is more than adequte

[SyCelicaGT]

HI MIP,

You should not need any more parts other than the shockers and the springs for now. The bushes will probably wear out eventually but then you can replace with polyurothane ones which are alot more durable.

As for whether to get alloys or lower the car, I personally would always start by getting alloys first as I like to dramatic change in looks & individualism they give my car. But it will not matter which way round you do it. If you want a GREAT place to look at alloys go to http://www.micheldever.co.uk/ they are based off the M3 and have a epic alloy wheel show room and if you go there on any day other than Saterday they will be able to offer varous alloys up to your car so you can see what they look like before you buy.

The strut brace is installed as a finishing touch to the suspension, it is not an essentual item as all it does is firms up the car when it goes round a bend, but if you have a UK car then you are already half way there becasue they have a black one on the front as standard anyway. I got both mine from someone on eBay who was stripping an old import of all it's aftermarket parts and got a front and rear one for £125 bargin! So I recommend you keep you eye open for second hand ones as they are a little costly when new for the benifit in handling they provide.

[SyCelicaGT]

MIP,

See here for strut braces which are a little more cost effective than the fensport ones (they rip you off!) http://www.funkystyling.co.uk/parts/item_d...php?prodID=1868

if you have the UK spec celica then all you really need is the rear one as the UK ones have a small strut brace at the front anyway so all you would need is the rear one in the link above to make understeer disapear!

[MIP]

Cheers for all those links Sy, espeacially for the alloy wheels (the range available in Newbury Halfords is a bit cack). I think it will be alloy wheels first, means I can see out the old tyres on the track, as well as get a lap time to do a before/after for when I get the suspention. I do have the UK celica, so thats a bonus.

[SyCelicaGT]

Yeah I think you have made the right choice. Pimp out your car first then worry about the suspension later.

Post some pictures once you get them fitted.

[Leeky]

q1: What kind of advantage would the Iridium spark plugs have over the platinum ones?

None, unless your sparks are worn out. On N/A celicas there will be no real difference.

q2: I can see a blitz panel filter in there, I've read people recommending the trd one. Is this not a complete list of fensports products?

Blitz Panel filter is almost identical to the TRD one. Personally this would be what i would go for in your situation. Induction kit is going to be very slightly if at all better but the cost involved and the heat from the engine bay means its just not worth it.

q3: Is there much of an advantage with the 'High flow trd sports oil filter'? I remember reading somthing about a valve in the toyota oil filter so would it be unwise using somthing else?

Forget this, not worth it - filter is a filter.

q4: What does a 'TRD Low Temperature Sports Thermostat, opening temperature is reduced to 71 degrees C. - 3SGE' do?

Again forget this, not worth it - nothing wrong with your standard one and would need to be quite heavily modded to benefit from this.

q5: What does the 'Power Boost Valve: Adjustable Fuel Pressure Regulator with remote mounting kit ' do? I take it you can controll the pressure the fuel is under being pushed out the injectors? Do you get some kind of in-car control, how does this work out in terms of power?

This keeps pressure up, would be a good mod and probably one of the first things fensport would recommend.

q6: Has anyone used the 'Superchips ICON Reprogrammes your engines Ignition Advance Curve giving approximately 8 BHP increase at 4,500rpm. Improved Power/Torque and throttle response From 3,000rpm, Easily fitted into wiring loom just ahead of ecu.'? This sounds very tempting, would you need any other parts for the engine to cope with the power increase? How does this actually work to get the increased power?

Lord_Ed has one of these in his st202, pretty good power gain for the money!

Unfortunately the st202 is a little poor as far as modding goes. Would need to spend a lot of money to make one seriously go up in the BHP stakes.

If your after more power then your gonna have to bite the bullet and upgrade to an st205 ;)

[MIP]

Thanks Leeky, bit of extra information! I'll pm Lord_Ed as well n ask him about the 'superchip'. Its not that expensive, so that as well as the panel filter n the decat would do me nicely! (and all the other stuff in the order I've said). When it gets to the point where I crave a big jump in power then it'll have to be a new car, but it'll be nice to get just a little extra out of my GT for the next couple o years.

So planning ahead, cronologically, the order its going:

Service...

17" alloys and panel filter.

Eibach springs & KYB agx shocks.

De-cat.

Rear strut brace if I'm finding understeer a problem.

Exhaust.

Possibly superchip, if lord_ed sells me the idea :)

Power boost valve, conflicting advice about this now, really don't know...probably not.......years later...

GT4?

...

If I'm really minted by this point... brands and deutchow lotus elise conversion (dry weight 900kg, 2.7 audi v6 twin turbo, 420bhp lotus elise) then...

er...dead or cryogenically frozen...

tbc

[LORD_ED]

q1: What kind of advantage would the iridium spark plugs have over the platinum ones?

None, unless your sparks are worn out. On N/A celicas there will be no real difference.

q2: I can see a blitz panel filter in there, I've read people recommending the trd one. Is this not a complete list of fensports products?

Blitz Panel filter is almost identical to the TRD one. Personally this would be what i would go for in your situation. Induction kit is going to be very slightly if at all better but the cost involved and the heat from the engine bay means its just not worth it.

q3: Is there much of an advantage with the 'High flow trd sports oil filter'? I remember reading somthing about a valve in the toyota oil filter so would it be unwise using somthing else?

Forget this, not worth it - filter is a filter.

q4: What does a 'TRD Low Temperature Sports Thermostat, opening temperature is reduced to 71 degrees C. - 3SGE' do?

Again forget this, not worth it - nothing wrong with your standard one and would need to be quite heavily modded to benefit from this.

q5: What does the 'Power Boost Valve: Adjustable Fuel Pressure Regulator with remote mounting kit ' do? I take it you can controll the pressure the fuel is under being pushed out the injectors? Do you get some kind of in-car control, how does this work out in terms of power?

This keeps pressure up, would be a good mod and probably one of the first things fensport would recommend.

q6: Has anyone used the 'Superchips ICON  Reprogrammes your engines Ignition Advance Curve giving approximately 8 BHP increase at 4,500rpm. Improved Power/Torque and throttle response From 3,000rpm, Easily fitted into wiring loom just ahead of ecu.'? This sounds very tempting, would you need any other parts for the engine to cope with the power increase? How does this actually work to get the increased power?

Lord_Ed has one of these in his st202, pretty good power gain for the money!

Unfortunately the st202 is a little poor as far as modding goes. Would need to spend a lot of money to make one seriously go up in the BHP stakes.

If your after more power then your gonna have to bite the bullet and upgrade to an st205  ;)

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you wanna slate half my mods anymore dude, dosnt matter i still accelerate quicker than you :P

[mikeb]

q5: What does the 'Power Boost Valve: Adjustable Fuel Pressure Regulator with remote mounting kit ' do? I take it you can controll the pressure the fuel is under being pushed out the injectors? Do you get some kind of in-car control, how does this work out in terms of power?

This keeps pressure up, would be a good mod and probably one of the first things fensport would recommend.

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What makes you think that? I can't understand why delivering extra fuel would be any advantage at all. If anything, I would say lowering the fuel pressure would increase power on a standardish engine. But I wouldn't advise anyone to try it without a wideband O2 sensor...

And I would always recommend altering the fueling by electronic means (SAFC etc), rather than mechanical.

[GT4 BOOSTER]

i was told fuel pressure is regulated by the ecu anyways , and these things are only good for turbo motors - ???????????

the st202 could do with shorter gear ratios imho