Gen4 Newbie

[nefarious]

OK, first up, Hi all.

New to the world of Toyota's (and jap cars in general, actually), but I've just agreed to buy an 87 Gen4 Celica off my dad's mate, as a runaround for my girlf. Car looks really good - 78k, one (old and careful) owner from new, always garaged, bodywork A1, money spent when it needed to be etc etc. And the price was very definately right...

So, onto my questions - if anyone can help me out with the following, I will be eternally in your debt -

1) Workshop manuals - Can't seem to find a Haynes for this model. Also looked at the stcik on the top of the page and most of the important pages seem to be missing from the relevant manual. Are there workshop CD's or PDF manuals doing the rounds? Do I need a secret handshake or something to find out about them?

2) Cambelt is going to need doing sometime soon-ish. Is it hard? (I'm fairly handy with a set of spanners, and have done a few HG jobs before. Changed several timing chains on various cars, but never a belt).

3) Parts interchangability - are there any quick and easy breakers yard upgrades to be done? I'm guessing that same-era GT4 brake discs and calipers fit, but does the same apply for later generations? What about Supra bits?

4) Engine stuff - I believe that if its the 147bhp GT model, then that means its a 3S-GE engine, right? What are the differences between this and the later 170 bhp 3S-GE engine? Are there any worthwhile swaps to be done? Also, is the exhuast manifold spacing the same as the 3S-GTE turbo version? (idly wondering about a low-pressure turbo).

5) Anything else a new owner should know?

Cheers all

N

[daktari]

OK, first up, Hi all.

New to the world of Toyota's (and jap cars in general, actually), but I've just agreed to buy an 87 Gen4 Celica off my dad's mate, as a runaround for my girlf. Car looks really good - 78k, one (old and careful) owner from new, always garaged, bodywork A1, money spent when it needed to be etc etc. And the price was very definately right...

So, onto my questions - if anyone can help me out with the following, I will be eternally in your debt -

1) Workshop manuals - Can't seem to find a Haynes for this model. Also looked at the stcik on the top of the page and most of the important pages seem to be missing from the relevant manual. Are there workshop CD's or PDF manuals doing the rounds? Do I need a secret handshake or something to find out about them?

Not sure if Haynes did one. But have a look on Ebay. Chilton did a manual for the Gen 4.

2) Cambelt is going to need doing sometime soon-ish. Is it hard? (I'm fairly handy with a set of spanners, and have done a few HG jobs before. Changed several timing chains on various cars, but never a belt).

Bit tight on space but not too difficult. It`ll help if you have a manual. The only real difficulty might be the crank pulley. renowned for being stubborn b*****ds.

3) Parts interchangability - are there any quick and easy breakers yard upgrades to be done? I'm guessing that same-era GT4 brake discs and calipers fit, but does the same apply for later generations? What about Supra bits?

Youll need to be careful with parts. Most are easily available, but there are differences between the various generations

4) Engine stuff - I believe that if its the 147bhp GT model, then that means its a 3S-GE engine, right? What are the differences between this and the later 170 bhp 3S-GE engine? Are there any worthwhile swaps to be done? Also, is the exhuast manifold spacing the same as the 3S-GTE turbo version? (idly wondering about a low-pressure turbo).

Yes it is a 3S-GE. AFAIK the only difference between yours and the later models is mapping and minor stuff. I`m sure a 3S-GE guru will be along later. Forget the turbo option. The head on the 3S-GTE is a totally different beastie.

5) Anything else a new owner should know?

Join as many celica forums as you can. There`s a few of `em. Ask lots of questions. Don`t be put off by people taking the wee. It`s the best way to find things out..

Cheers all

N

Welcome aboard and enjoy the ride.

[mikeb]

1) Chilton or Haynes paperback (from the hanyes website)

2) What dak said. I hope you have small hands, and expect skinned skinned knuckles. You will probably need an impact gun for the crank pulley bolt.

3) Not sure, many parts are interchangable between gen 5 and 6, not sure about 4 though.

4) The cylinder head is different between the 3 revisions of the 3s-ge (rev 1 = 147hp, rev 2 = 158hp, rev 3 = 173hp). That's the main reason for the power difference. Also, the rev 2 and 3 have a tubular exhaust manifold, which is probably worth about 5-10hp to you. Not sure if it is interchangable onto the rev 1 head though. The bottom ends are more or less the same except possibly slightly different pistons due to the different compression ratios and valve pocketing.

[Calisto]

welcome to TOC................... I love the Gen 4 Celi and is the reason I bought my Celica.

did I metion that this is the best car club in the WORLD???????????????? B)

[Jones~32]

Welcome to the Club

Get some pics up of your Celica asap :D

[nefarious]

Cheers for the replies guys - I'm picking the car up next Friday, so I'll get some pics up ASAP after that.

Had a look at the Haynes site and it lists for the gen4 Celica, but its an american title (as is the Chilton) - I know the American cars had less power, but are they mechanically identical? (The usefulness of the big Haynes book of jokes is marginal enough when it talking about the car thats actually in front of you ;) )

On the subject of part swapping, am I right in thinking that the gen4 GT4 had bigger vented discs and calipers up front, and thicker anti-roll bars? If there are superior parts from later generations, then let us know....

Any further word on the swapability of later heads? (I suspect the rev3 won't fit, and I'm not sure I can be ubikd changing a head for a 10 bhp gain) The rev3 is what they call the BEAMS, right?

As you can probably tell - I'm a bit of a messer. Can't leave cars alone, and derive an unhealthy joy from poking around breakers yards!!

Cheers again...

N

[Jones~32]

The Beams was a version of the Rev3, had VVT-I and was more powerful than the standard Rev3 3S-GE, IIRC they had around 200bhp instead of 175bhp ;)

[mikeb]

The beams is rev 4 (not sure if that's an official designation or not). I wouldn't bother swapping just the head anyway. It's just as easy to pull the whole engine, and it's probably cheaper to buy a complete rev 3 engine than it would be to buy a c/head by itself. You will also need all the manifolds and intake system, engine loom, and ecu, and maybe some other stuff. Then you've got to worry about the clutch and gearbox being able to handle it.