Differences Between Rev2 And Rev3 Mr2?

[MattMR2Turbo]

Can anyone highlight the main differences between the Rev2 and Rev3 MR2 turbo please? I'm going to be buying one soon and may have around £5000 to spend. It seems that I would be lucky to get a rev3 for that money and would like to know what I'd be missing out on!

Thanks

Matt

[Bibbs]

NA wise .. not much .. on a turbo - loads of differances ..

[MattMR2Turbo]

Yes, it's the turbo that I'm interested in.

I know that power was raised by about 20bhp. Does anyone know how this wass acheived? i.e. is the rev2 engine as good and still have the same potential?

Did the suspension also change?

Thanks

Matt

[Bibbs]

The power was with a higher flow laggier turbo, new internals, bigger injectors, MAP sensor instead of the AFM ..

It's a whole new engine ..

The suspension was not changed .. but go for a rev3 if you can .. the styling changes and the ability to get a higher BHP out the box with a few mods is always a bonus.

[ZeroBlade]

I agree, get a rev3 if possible.

[Dame]

Yep go for Rev 3 - you can obtain higher horsepower for less money.....:)

[pizza boy]

No matter what revision you get make sure it aint got silly mods. For example a rev1/2 running a atmo'BOV with boost controller Run!

And make sure its got timing belt changed(cost up to 500 quid) and clutch(400+). These things are pretty cheap on other cars but on the mr2 turbo...oh dear. Just research by phoning toyota specialists etc.

Source one as standard as possible cos theres loads of abused mr2s out there

[Bibbs]

Good idea Pizza boy .. but I'd say that mine is fairly modded, is in good condition .. and would be a bargain if I ever tried to sell it. It'd confuse the hell out of an AA inspection as there isn't much left stock.

I'd say get one that had obviously been looked after (see the bills), basic mods are good as you don't have to buy them later.

Depends what you want to do with the car ..

[MattMR2Turbo]

Ok thanks.

Chances are I'll be able to get a good Rev2 or a cheap Rev3 so probably the Rev2 is looking more promising.

How easy/how much money would need to be spent to achieve 300bhp? I'm planning HKS filter, exhaust and intercooler... what else would be needed?

Matt

[Bibbs]

DON'T CHOOSE THE HKS FILTER (see the thread about filters I posted the other night).

I have a rev2 .. with a exhaust/filter/intercooler and a boost tweak you should see 270 bhp ..

a bit more is needed for the magic 300 ..

[Bibbs]

and you are right to try and get the best condition car your money can buy - at the end of the day the differences between rev2 and rev3 are small when compared to a snotter and a minter ..

[Jimlad]

get a rev 1 killer !!!!!

[KiwiMR2]

Hmmm...I tried a search as Im sure we have covered this before with quite a few good facts, I can't find it!!??

Anyway this is some of the KEY differences:

- MAP sensor instead of AFM

- Bosch D-Jetronic (Gen III) vs. L-Jetronic (relatively primitive) engine management

- CT20b turbo replaces CT26

- Boost raised from 10psi to 13psi

- Fuel cut raised from 12 psi to 18 psi

- Different ECU

- 4 wire O2 sensor

- Shim under bucket valve shims

- slightly more aggressive cams

- Revised internals (pistons, con-rods etc.)

- Revised cylinder head cooling passages/water jackets

- Revised intake manifold (8 'independent long ports' reduced to 4)

- intake manifold inlet air temperature sensor added. i.e. after turbo and intercooler.

- Revised gearbox with close ratio gearing

- lower compression ratio

- stainless steel head gasket

- factory 540cc injectors replace 430cc injectors

- revised fuel rail with bigger bore and relocated pressure regulator

- TVIS eliminated

- EGR eliminated

- LSD in 80% of them

- throttle body increased from 55mm to 60mm

- inlet valve lift increased from 8.2 to 8.7

- intake manifold inlet air temperature sensor added

- Less restrictive exhaust elbow

- Aluminum oil pan

- more rigid alloy sump and additional oil baffles

- Factory Catch can

- Better Oil Cooler and relocated oil filter (bottom)

- 4 Channel ABS coupled with Traction Control available

- No. 1 compression ring described as 'stainless steel' instead of just 'steel'. Oil ring is described as 'stainless steel' instead of 'a combination of steel and stainless steel'.

Cheers

KiwiMR2

[MattMR2Turbo]

Oh not a lot then

I will see what is available after I've sold most most of my sound system and Nova Parts. I will definitely have over £5000 so the Rev3 could well be in reach.

I'm not in a rush to get the first car I see so I can always wait until I can find a good one.

The Rev3 engine sounds so much better as a base to start from though.

LSD would be nice too.

[Jimlad]

erm.... dunno mate... not much difference in bhp.

Whatever you could do to a rev3, you could do to a rev 1.

Also.. rev1 lighter due to no airbag, side impact bars etc..etc....

[KiwiMR2]

erm.... dunno mate... not much difference in bhp.

Whatever you could do to a rev3, you could do to a rev 1.

Also.. rev1 lighter due to no airbag, side impact bars etc..etc....

A couple items left off the Gen III pros list aside from the usual bigger injectors, better turbo, etc.:

Plug & Play Power FC availability. Easiest and most versatile engine management system out there -- and the only one with a Commander display unit.

Not being stuck with an AFM -- priceless! (actually, add however many hundreds of dollars $$ plus labor to the price of a Gen II just to get rid of the stupid AFM)

Better Intake Manifold: No more overfeeding cylinders 2 & 3 = fewer blown motors.

Improved cooling passages in the cylinder head: No more localized boiling in the head = fewer blown motors.

Intake manifold temp. sensor (If you have the Power FC, you can monitor intake temps on the fly).

Factory (upgraded) headgasket: The factory headgasket is the same layered metal design that all the Gen II guys need to spend hundredsa + labor to upgrade -- with the important difference being that it has a factory perfect seal. No blown HG problems like the Gen II.

Factory LSD on nearly all Gen IIIs. Whoops, there goes another few hundred + labor on the Gen II.

The list goes on and on...

To be honest many of the gen 3's that come over, in totally stock form dyno at 260+ bhp at the fly wheel, even though they are supposed to only be 240. Actully from memory at least one guy on the imoc uk board with WI and exhaust, is producing 320+bhp at the fly and 300+ftlbs of torque.

They are certainly easier to tune up to over 300bhp at the fly that a gen 2 engine.

Cheers

KiwiMR2

[John R]

What exacly is AFM?

And now that you've highlighted all the differences between rev1+2-3 turbo's.... could you be so kind as to list any differences between the non-turbo's.... please?

[KiwiMR2]

What exacly is AFM?

Air Flow Meter..........if you do a bit of a google search there's plenty of info on each system :)

And now that you've highlighted all the differences between rev1+2-3 turbo's.... could you be so kind as to list any differences between the non-turbo's.... please? 

Hmmm...That's a bit harder!! I only had my NA for about a year and been a Turbo man from for the last 5 or so years. All I really know is there power ratings:

2nd gen JDM 3SGE ~ 160hp

3rd gen JDM 3SGE ~ 175hp

4th gen JDM 3SGE ~ 200hp, 21.0kg-m of torque. (beams.....MR2 has the red head, Altezza the black head) There was only ever 1000 MR2 beams motors made.

And that the MAJOR difference is with the Beams version....not much difference between the earlier two but IF your gonna go NA and money wan't an issue the Beams is the way to go.

Cheers

KiwiMR2

[Bibbs]

afm is basically a flap in the intake that opens wider when more air flows through.

The Beams is VVTi (that is in all the new cars) .. it's rated as being one of the best engines made by the people in the know .. almost as good as Honda's Vtechs ..

[KiwiMR2]

almost as good as Honda's Vtechs

Agree'd......the S2000 engine is probably the only one I'd say is better.

Cheers

KiwiMR2

[MattMR2Turbo]

Here's my predicament:

I can either get myself a good low mileage Rev2 that has the T-bar and leather seats, or I can get a Rev3 with low mileage but it has sunroof and cloth seats.

What decision would you make?!

[Bibbs]

I can either get myself a good low mileage Rev2 that has the T-bar and leather seats, or I can get a Rev3 with low mileage but it has sunroof and cloth seats.

The T-bar is nice .. but the rev3 styling is nicer ..

Are you going to go for a bodykit (and therefore the rev3 styling is less important)?

If it were a Turbo .. I'd go rev3 .. NA - I'd go for the T-bar ..

You can always get the leather seats (£300 from Rogue Systems) in the Rev3 ..

And there are no Sunroof turbo's - unless aftermarket .. the sunroof was a UK only thing, and there are no UK Turbo's ..

[MattMR2Turbo]

Sorry, my mistake about the sunroof.

I'm fairly convinced that the rev3 engine is considerably better.

I would want to keep the car standard regards to bodykits, and if the leather is that cheap I think I will look at a Rev3.

Found a red '94 rev3 turbo with 67k on the clock, just been serviced etc, good condition, for £4449.

Gonna ring up about that shortly.

Oh another thing, how can you tell without driving it wether it has an LSD or not?

[Bibbs]

If it's stock looks you are after - go the rev3 ..

Also Jap cars didn't have full leather ..

You can tell the LSD of a car by the chassis/model number .. details on IMOC - I don't have them to hand ..

[Bibbs]

from http://www.btinternet.com/~netsurf/mr2t/mr...mited_slip_diff

Limited Slip Differential (LSD)

For models produced intended for the US, from the model revision in late 1992 onwards a limited slip differential was standard for all Turbos - previously in the 90-92 model years it was an option. It is not known if a LSD was also standard for Japanese Turbos from '92 onwards, although its appears to also be the case.

To verify if your car has a LSD, check the vehicle identification plate on the inside of front bonnet. There are a number of codes given there, including the transmission type, whose code starts with the sequence "A/TM"

For example,     A/TM:-    735/E153

If the last digit before the /E153 is a '3' or a '5' then the car has a LSD - therefore in the example above it does.

The second part of the code is the transmission type- E153 is a heavy duty manual transmission for the Turbo.