Engine Oil For The Yaris Diesel

[Perfection]

Just did a search for recommend oil for the Yaris Diesel, but didn't show anything.

I know this has been discussed before. Anyone could recommend one that I could buy from Halford. I want fully synthetic. How many litres do I need?

Thanks in advance.

Perfect.

[BlueMax]

A good quality 5w-40 synthetic is ideal, have a look at the likes of Castrol, Fuchs and Mobil.

Mobil 1 ESP info at

http://www.mobil.co.uk/UK-English/LCW/Prod...Mobil_1_ESP.asp

mattlewis100 at eBay offered to supply 5w-30 Mobil 1 ESP 2 x 4 litres including delivery £53.50. Delivery 3 days.

[Perfection]

A good quality 5w-40 synthetic is ideal, have a look at the likes of Castrol, Fuchs and Mobil.

Mobil 1 ESP info at

http://www.mobil.co.uk/UK-English/LCW/Prod...Mobil_1_ESP.asp

mattlewis100 at eBay offered to supply 5w-30 Mobil 1 ESP 2 x 4 litres including delivery £53.50. Delivery 3 days.

Thanks, I have bought some Mobil 1 0W-40 also from eBay for 2 x 5 litres including delivery for £60.50.

Regards,

Perfect.

[BlueMax]

Do you by any chance have lubricant specifications by Toyota for the D-4D engine?

Thanks

[Perfection]

Do you by any chance have lubricant specifications by Toyota for the D-4D engine?

Thanks

This is quoted in the Manual:

"API CF-4 or CF

(You may also use API CE or CD.)"

I have checked the recommended grade in Halfords oil guide (in store), they recommend 0W-40, 0W-30, 5W-40 for Yaris Diesel.

The cost of Mobil 1 0W-40 is £45. So I have scooped a bargain from eBay. The guy is still selling on there.

[Parts-King]

Just wondering why so many people buy fully synthetic for a small diesel? , seems over the top, semi synthetic would do the job fine and at less than half the price! or am I just a tight wad, ;)

Kingo

[BlueMax]

Just wondering why so many people buy fully synthetic for a small diesel? , seems over the top, semi synthetic would do the job fine and at less than half the price! or am I just a tight wad, ;)

Kingo

I also have thought along the same lines. But have been persuaded otherwise all sorts of claims by oil makers.

Some like Amsoil, claim to double oil change intervals. But somehow I did not take their advice

Does Toyota specify any particular type or brand of oil for use in their service centres?

[Parts-King]

Just wondering why so many people buy fully synthetic for a small diesel? , seems over the top, semi synthetic would do the job fine and at less than half the price! or am I just a tight wad, ;)

Kingo

I also have thought along the same lines. But have been persuaded otherwise all sorts of claims by oil makers.

Some like Amsoil, claim to double oil change intervals. But somehow I did not take their advice

Does Toyota specify any particular type or brand of oil for use in their service centres?

There is no specified brand, but we use Castrol 5/30 semi synthetic (I think most centres use 5/30 or very similar). Toyota used to use Esso from the factory, but I'm not sure if this still applies. The oil companies are like computer software suppliers, you have to have the very latest spec, and in the case of oil, the latest must have is fully synthetic, 0 grade oil. Unless you use you vehicle in very hard conditions, semi synthetic oil is perfectly capable of giving you good lubricating qualities and fuel consumption from one service to the next. Kingo

[oilman]

As long as the oil meet or exceeds the specs for the car brand does not matter but good to try and stick to a well know reputable one. Semi synthetic as you say is fine, but synthetic is better in every way and does last longer so for those who just want to do the best for their car then synthetic is the way to go.

Cheers

Guy.

[Perfection]

Just wondering why so many people buy fully synthetic for a small diesel? , seems over the top, semi synthetic would do the job fine and at less than half the price! or am I just a tight wad, ;)

Kingo

You're right to say that, however, I do around 20k miles a year and would like to keep the car for another 4-5 yrs. So I think I will spend a bit more on oil jsu t to make sure the engine will provide a good life.

Perfect.

[BlueMax]

Its all very intelligent and rational talking about "as long as the oil meet or exceeds the specs for the car" and so on but engine oil manufacturers are always have been telling you so much about their latest cocktail and amazing things it can do for your engine. So I fork out the extra cos I want to do the best for my car. No harm done to the engine and more importantly, I am happy. So are the oil manufacturers as they laugh all the way to the bank.

Now that those cold winter period will be upon us in a few months, may be it is time to condiser giving the car some additional care and protection and add some oil additives. Has anyone tried STP ?

[Red Yaris 54]

....

STP should not be necessary with modern oils.........................I used STP years ago with Duckhams 20/50 in my Austin A40...............It certainly used to quieten the engine ;)

I would be reluctant to try it in a modern engine.

Has anyone used it recently?

[BlueMax]

Best thing about STP were those large and bold stickers that came with it. It certainly increased the status of any car. And the driver. :)

Its a shame that stickers have gone out of fashion :(

[oilman]

Modern oils do not need any more addatives as they contain a well balanced and tested addative pack.

DO NOT waste your money, better to spend the extra on a decent oil.

Cheers

Guy

[oilman]

Just wondering why so many people buy fully synthetic for a small diesel? , seems over the top, semi synthetic would do the job fine and at less than half the price! or am I just a tight wad, ;)

Kingo

Make your own minds up, your money, car and choice!

The basic benefits are as follows:

Extended oil drain periods

Better wear protection and therefore extended engine life

Most synthetics give better MPG

They flow better when cold and are more thermally stable when hot

Esters are surface-active meaning a thin layer of oil on the surfaces at all times

If you want to know the reasons why then please read on but, warning - Long Post!

Stable Basestocks

Synthetic oils are designed from pure, uniform synthetic basestocks, they contain no contaminants or unstable molecules which are prone to thermal and oxidative break down.

Because of their uniform molecular structure, synthetic lubricants operate with less internal and external friction than petroleum oils which have a non-uniform molecular structure.

The result is better heat control, and less heat means less stress to the lubricant.

Higher Percentage of Basestock

Synthetic oils contain a higher percentage of lubricant basestock than petroleum oils do.

This is because multi-viscosity oils need a great deal of pour point depressant and viscosity improvers to operate as a multigrade.

The basestocks actually do most of the lubricating. More basestocks mean a longer oil life.

Additives Used Up More Slowly

Petroleum basestocks are much more prone to oxidation than synthetic oils. Oxidation inhibitors are needed in greater quantities in petroleum oils as they are used up more quickly.

Synthetic oils do oxidize, but at a much slower rate therefore, oxidation inhibiting additives are used up more slowly.

Synthetic oils provide for better ring seal than petroleum oils do. This minimizes blow-by and reduces contamination by combustion by-products. As a result, corrosion inhibiting additives have less work to do and will last much longer in a synthetic oil.

Excellent Heat Tolerance

Synthetics are simply more tolerant to extreme heat than petroleum oils are. When heat builds up within an engine, petroleum oils quickly begin to burn off. They are more volatile. The lighter molecules within petroleum oils turn to gas and what's left are the large molecules that are harder to pump.

Synthetics have far more resistance as they are more thermally stable to begin with and can take higher temperatures for longer periods without losing viscosity.

Heat Reduction

One of the major factors affecting engine life is component wear and/or failure, which is often the result of high temperature operation. The uniformly smooth molecular structure of synthetic oils gives them a much lower coefficient friction (they slip more easily over one another causing less friction) than petroleum oils.

Less friction means less heat and heat is a major contributor to engine component wear and failure, synthetic oils significantly reduce these two detrimental effects.

Since each molecule in a synthetic oil is of uniform size, each is equally likely to touch a component surface at any given time, thus moving a certain amount of heat into the oil stream and away from the component. This makes synthetic oils far superior heat transfer agents than conventional petroleum oils.

Greater Film Strength

Petroleum motor oils have very low film strength in comparison to synthetics. The film strength of a lubricant refers to it's ability to maintain a film of lubricant between two objects when extreme pressure and heat are applied.

Synthetic oils will typically have a film strength of 5 to 10 times higher than petroleum oils of comparable viscosity.

Even though heavier weight oils typically have higher film strength than lighter weight oils, an sae 30 or 40 synthetic will typically have a higher film strength than an sae 50 or sae 60 petroleum oil.

A lighter grade synthetic can still maintain proper lubricity and reduce the chance of metal to metal contact. This means that you can use oils that provide far better fuel efficiency and cold weather protection without sacrificing engine protection under high temperature, high load conditions. Obviously, this is a big plus, because you can greatly reduce both cold temperature start-up wear and high temperature/high load engine wear using a low viscosity oil.

Engine Deposit Reduction

Petroleum oils tend to leave sludge, varnish and deposits behind after thermal and oxidative break down. They're better than they used to be, but it still occurs.

Deposit build-up leads to a significant reduction in engine performance and engine life as well as increasing the chance of costly repairs.

Synthetic oils have far superior thermal and oxidative stability and they leave engines virtually varnish, deposit and sludge-free.

Better Cold Temperature Fluidity

Synthetic oils do not contain the paraffins or other waxes which dramatically thicken petroleum oils during cold weather. As a result, they tend to flow much better during cold temperature starts and begin lubricating an engine almost immediately. This leads to significant engine wear reduction, and, therefore, longer engine life.

Improved Fuel Economy

Because of their uniform molecular structure, synthetic oils are tremendous friction reducers. Less friction leads to increased fuel economy and improved engine performance.

This means that more energy released from the combustion process can be transferred directly to the wheels due to the lower friction. Acceleration is more responsive and more powerful, using less fuel in the process.

In a petroleum oil, lighter molecules tend to boil off easily, leaving behind much heavier molecules which are difficult to pump. The engine loses more energy pumping these heavy molecules than if it were pumping lighter ones.

Since synthetic oils have more uniform molecules, fewer of these molecules tend to boil off and when they do, the molecules which are left are of the same size and pumpability is not affected.

Synthetics are better and in many ways, they are basically better by design as they are created by chemists in laboratories for a specific purpose.

Cheers

Guy

http://www.opieoils.co.uk

[Parts-King]

Phew............hope you copy & pasted that lot Guy, you would have been up all night otherwise, Good post though, well done. Kingo

[oilman]

Its an article I have so didnt have to write it this time, handy piece of info though!

Cheers

Guy.

[Parts-King]

IMHO, I would still use semi synthetic for an every day car, I hear all being said, but being in this job over 30 years makes you a little synical. My top quality 5/30 semi synthetic is £17 for five litres and sells like hot cakes. Each and everyone to their own, but I know how much I would prefer to spend on my family car that is regulary serviced. Hope that does'nt get the bullets flying, it's just my own opinion!

Cheers

Kingo

[BlueMax]

Is the relatively high price of the synthetic oil justified?

From the oilman's post, two major points worth considering from the financial point of view are:

1. Extended oil drain periods

2. Improved Fuel Economy.

These two factors alone can easily recoup the additional cost plus some.

However, are these nothing moe than oil manufacturers' claims or have they been scientifically tested and proved by reputable and truly independent bodies?

Engines are put through thousands of hours of testing during development.

Why is it that automotive manufacturers do not recommend synthetic oil? At least as an option. In these days of warranties for as long as 5 years, use of anything that protect better is surely in their best interest.

Could it be that they are not are convinced?!

[oilman]

If you look at the cost of synthetics, over the cost of mineral oils over the lifetime of the car and using the oil changes that should be used for both mineral and synthetic, the synthetic will work out cheaper, on top of that synthetics do a better job and that is a fact.

Car manufacturers give a viscosity and a spec to be used in the car, this is generally the minimum spec to be used. Think of it this way... the car will come with tyres on the wheels, the tyres will have passed all the tests to be used on the car for road use but you as the consumer/owner when the tyres get changed may opt for a better tyre... Its your choice you see.

The likes of BMW, VAG group and Mercedes all now require expensive high grade synthetics for variable service schedules on modern models.

Cheers

Guy.

[BlueMax]

If you look at the cost of synthetics, over the cost of mineral oils over the lifetime of the car and using the oil changes that should be used for both mineral and synthetic, the synthetic will work out cheaper, on top of that synthetics do a better job and that is a fact.

Don't know if I misunderstood but can't figure this out.

Are you basing it on longer oil change intervals and better fuel consumption claimed for synthetics?

Any views on claims by Amsoil about extended oil change intervals?

Thanks

[oilman]

Yes I am, a semi synthetic should be changed by 5,000 miles in reality and say a 10w-40 semi works out at around £17 for 5ltr.

Take a good quality synthetic 5w-40 that works out at around £27 for 5ltr and can be changed ever 10-12,000 miles.

And they do a better job while they are there.

Cheers

Guy.

Ps Ok, so maybe not cheaper by miles, but cheaper if not the same cost none the less.

[Parts-King]

Yes I am, a semi synthetic should be changed by 5,000 miles in reality and say a 10w-40 semi works out at around £17 for 5ltr.

Take a good quality synthetic 5w-40 that works out at around £27 for 5ltr and can be changed ever 10-12,000 miles.

And they do a better job while they are there.

Cheers

Guy.

Ps Ok, so maybe not cheaper by miles, but cheaper if not the same cost none the less.

Oilman

I just can't come to terms with "semi synthetic should be changed every 5000 miles" no way!

If that was the case all manufacturers would have a 5000 mile oil change service, wouldnt they?

Toyota (and others) have a 10K service interval, and they would specify fully synthetic if semi was not up to the job, I bow to your greater knowledge of the oil industry, but cant agree with this logic.

Kingo

[Perfection]

Yes I am, a semi synthetic should be changed by 5,000 miles in reality and say a 10w-40 semi works out at around £17 for 5ltr.

Take a good quality synthetic 5w-40 that works out at around £27 for 5ltr and can be changed ever 10-12,000 miles.

And they do a better job while they are there.

Cheers

Guy.

Ps Ok, so maybe not cheaper by miles, but cheaper if not the same cost none the less.

Oilman

I just can't come to terms with "semi synthetic should be changed every 5000 miles" no way!

If that was the case all manufacturers would have a 5000 mile oil change service, wouldnt they?

Toyota (and others) have a 10K service interval, and they would specify fully synthetic if semi was not up to the job, I bow to your greater knowledge of the oil industry, but cant agree with this logic.

Kingo

Sorry to start this thread with synthetic oil now changes to war on semi-synthetic. My dealer uses synthetic for my Yaris and RAV, they charge about £30. Hope this help to settle the argument.

Have just changed the oil with Mobil 1 and will get it change again on the next 7-8 months.

Have a nice day!

[oilman]

Many manufacturers are specifying synthetic as standard now due to the additional protection throughout the service period.

It is your car and investment at the end of the day, apart from property, cars are peoples second most expensive investment.

Cheaper oils are in the long run a false economy, In the first mile the higher volatility, inferior anti-wear performance and poor temperature resistance of a cheap grade of oil will start to show. Obviously, there will be no immediate effects. The whole point of top quality oil is long-term performance retention, which is particularly valuable to people who actually own the car they drive.

The ‘performance’ enthusiast will want to retain the new-spec BHP figures, and the cost-conscious will want to see good fuel economy with 100,000 on the clock.

Cheap oil, (particularly 10W/40 or thinner) evaporates quickly, and the vapour is drawn into the combustion chambers via the crankcase ventilation system. This means calcium and zinc oxide deposits (from oil additives) which will cause pre-ignition, so the knock sensor retards the ignition, giving less power and poor fuel economy. The deposits also contaminate the exhaust catalyst, leading to high emissions and MOT failure. How much does an average catalyst box cost these days?!

The other point is the cost.

How much is your monthly fuel bill?

In most cases more than your ANNUAL oil bill!!

The fuel does nothing to protect your car! Your OIL is your first line of defence.

Cheap oil is false economy, you do not have to be a rocket scientist to see that. ;)

Cheers