Run Flat Puncture

[Fujisan]

Try getting your wife to drive like Ralf instead of Lewis...........that way your tyres will never wear out

That's easier said than done, I'm sure she has a little bit of Lewis inside her...

Give her a day with Toyota F1 and she'll soon calm down :(

[duncerduncs]

I believe that is true. I've asked this before, but what's to stop us getting the 'donut' removed, and using ordinary tyres. I believe (could be wrong) that this is the problem, and is why special machines need to be used. I believe (and again I could be wrong) the tyres themselves are nothing special. Can you get our size tyre as 'std' run flats, with the stiff walls? Or would the RAV be too heavy to be supported by these tyres, when 'flat'. Failing that a tyre puncture repair kit, like the XTR, would suffice.

I think, I guess, the RAV would be to heavy to use super stiff side wall tyres, when flat.

Remove the doughnut and just standard tyres with a puncture repair kit.........it must be possible, I guess.

The BMW X5 comes with run-flats as standard, so it must be possible to make the side walls stiff enough for a large car.

I think the biggest problem would be TPMS, as this is set up for the doughnut, not normal tyres

[sywy]

I think the biggest problem would be TPMS, as this is set up for the doughnut, not normal tyres

Is that correct. I always thought it was in the valve?

[duncerduncs]

I think the biggest problem would be TPMS, as this is set up for the doughnut, not normal tyres

Is that correct. I always thought it was in the valve?

You're right, what I meant to say is that valve is set up for TPMS and the alloy is set up for the doghnut! So the alloy is the biggest problem, followed by the TPMS!

Sorry for any confusion :D

[bothwell_buyer]

here we go again.

wot a shower of mincers....

I ran my Rav mark 1 1994 wi 4 up (ie thats 4 passenegers) on the M74 > M73 junction at 80mph and I only knew I had a flat cos some Vauxhall driver being jealous flashed his headlights at me. Changed the tyre for the spare which hangs on the back and helps to balance the car and away we go.

My tyre provider in Glasgow (Autoimage and I get no commission) rustled me up a new tyre with change out of £60 and that was more than a couple of years ago. tyre price has come down, altho car manufacturers party when they introduce a car with 'special tyres'.

My faithers Punto has a wee emergency wheel and tyre as a spare - and an empty boot apart from that so I got a Punto wheel off my friendly tyre man and keep that in the boot.

My refurbd RAV 1994 will have a new 18" wheel and tyre bolted on the back and theres no way on earth I'd ever accept a car wi-oot a spare. call me old but I'm practical.

My older son bought a new Voxhall Corsa (silly car) and hit a pothole resulting in 2 flats and 2 bent wheels. Thankfully I had a wheel spare which fitted and we used his emergency wheel to get the vehicle home. A taxi driver stopped and said that the same happens on that part of the road.

Now maybe he could have got home on run flats but at what cost as the Council are disputing the pothole with Scottish water...... The 2 tyres were wrecked - ie shredded. the wheels had to be sent away to be un-bent...

mad Ian :yahoo: :yahoo:

[mobileagent]

Hi all got a puncture in the rav on tuesday (run flats ) took it to dealer who exchanged the wheel no problem,

i,ve only done about 2000k so my tyre was like new (new=6mm mine 5.6mm)

any way the manager was not brave enough to tell me a price and said i woud recieve a call in a few days

if there was to be any charges.

I got the call today? wait for it £71.00 ? Thats a suposedly susidized price.

Thats £71 to basicaly fix a puncture something any tyre place would charge a max £10 for.

Needless to say i told him what I thought and where he could shove his Bill, To which he replyed that he fully

understood why I was ****** off, and he would contact the powers that be and tell them of my grievances.

so now I am waiting for a call from toyota`s customer relations dept.

i,ll let you know the out come.......ean

Hi so far i've had two punctures on my t180 the first when i clipped a curb (totally my fault) and the side wall blew a hole in itself and the second when the tyre got pinched by the alloy dropping of a curb after being parked and split the side wall first bill was £255 inc vat for a tyre and a new wheel but took 4 weeks to get here from Belgium and the second i have refused to pay for but took 4 dealers 2 days to first get me an exchange wheel (recovery via rac to home ) and the 4 days to fit a new tyre this situation is beyond a joke when a puncture renders a near £0k car unusable.

Have spoke to Toyota customer care who said that they could not do anything other than send me a voucher for £50 i asked for a new wheel and tyre coded to my car to keep at home just to keep me mobile but to no avail but i am going to write to Toyota UK and see where i get. Will let you all know

David

[sywy]

Sorry to hear that mobileagent. Again, the price you paid for a complete wheel and tyre vary wildly, as I paid £235 just for a tyre!!

I think the dealers are making these figures up!! I did manage to get a £125 voucher back from Toyota customer care though.

BTW, welcome to TOC :)

[mobileagent]

Sorry to hear that mobileagent. Again, the price you paid for a complete wheel and tyre vary wildly, as I paid £235 just for a tyre!!

I think the dealers are making these figures up!! I did manage to get a £125 voucher back from Toyota customer care though.

BTW, welcome to TOC :)

Thank you for the welcome, i spoke to my local dealer the other day who informed me that one of their sales managers clipped a curb in an Auris t180 and the tyre blew a hole in the side wall the same as mine, i have asked about removing the four wheels and putting a new set with normal tyres but after 2 1/2 weeks Toyota finally got back to me with the answer to whether it would affect the warranty, they said that they did not think it would affect it but could not be sure, but then after all it took four days to put a new tyre on when your local kwik fit can do the same in 10mins it all seems a bit ridiculous.

Toyota quoted £270 for a new wheel and tyre plus vat then 1 hour labour for coding the wheel therfore around £400+. 4 new wheels and tyres start from around £650 but the tpws will be on all the time. i think its about time toyota came out and admitted they have not got a clue how to sort the mess out and got tyre machines at all dealers with subsidized prices for all T180 customers BUT I'M NOT GOING TO HOLD MY BREATH :ffs:

[bothwell_buyer]

Crumbs

I have been far happier since I moved from Toyota wheels on my '94 RAV to alloys - i got a lot of value out of the alloys and even though the alloy type is obsolete (was it MSW something??) I was delighted that they lasted a lot longer than the Toyota wheels. The tyres got cheaper as the market forces demand and the price came down from £200 in 1994 to around <£60 today.

Have bought 18" alloys now with a tyre size that I have a choice on manufacturers and yes i have a tyre and wheel bolted onto the back door. I've not yet suffered 2 punctures at the same time.

however, i remember being in australia having hired a motorhome back in 2002 for a 4 week holiday. Drove north from Brisbane when we had a burst. Nobody had a new tyre of the size in the area (loads of miles) and I ended up having to drive back to Brisbane slowly to get a replacement wheel and tyre from another motor home in the compound. Heading south towards Sydney the same happened again and i found it was the right hand front brake was locking on and melting the front wheel valve. Spoilt a good bit of the holiday.

What I learnt from this is run flats/ odd sized tyres are absolutely a nightmare until dealers all are able to replace it. 7 days a week. And I was visiting good Bridgestone depots....

Its a joke. If you have a good alloy wheel

1. it doesn't weigh too much

2. you don't want to waste it so you drive slowly so you don't get the benfit of your expensive car.

3. I don't think RAVs look right without carrying a wheel up back. If I didn't want a wheel on the back, I'd buy a silly car.

Ian the delighted '94 RAV maniac :yahoo: :yahoo:

[Fujisan]

It's a pity Toyota haven't made ordinary wheels and tyres (with a puncture repair kit) an option for the T180.

Doubt it will ever happen :(

[bjw]

I feel Kingo may not answer this question...Being A Toyota Parts man. Think he will not want to get involved in this. Far play to him he is only doing what the dealer can as Toyota have made this a rod for there own back

We're (well I'm) not asking him to give us his opinion on the whole situation, just what the official Toyota stance is, as it seems that each dealership is working from a different set of rules.

Yes you are spot on about Kingo I have noticed on some threads he keeps a low profile and that is to be expected as he is also an employee of a Toyota franchise the same can be said for some of the Toyota techs who post on the forums

[anchorman]

Yes chatman I have to agree. I'm not sure Toyota thought this one through fully. No doubt that these tyres will halp to improve the handling of these high powered vehicles but so would equivelent sized standard tyres.

I wonder if they saw a business opportunity in a market they would otherwise stand very little chance of sharing? I think that BMW owners would tolerate the associated high servicing cost a bit better than your average RAV owner.

I have to say that the incremental pricing seems reasonable until you get to the replacement cost where I think I could shop around for a better priced standard tyre.

[sywy]

That's one of the problems, you can not shop around, as only Toyota dealers have the equipment to remove these tyres.

[anchorman]

That's one of the problems, you can not shop around, as only Toyota dealers have the equipment to remove these tyres.

Yeh I mean shop around for a bog standard tyre if they were fitted ;)

[druand]

I started a thread on this subject Dec 2006 when considering renewal of one of my cars. Already own XTR 2.0 D4d and obvious choice was T180. Due to long distances and off road work at weekends I was concerned about run flat situation and the then exchange scheme, My concerns then were met with replies of "when did you last have a puncture" or just go to your nearest Dealer, This would not be practical on a Saturday night in north Scotland with 300 miles to travel home. I jumped ship and bought the new 2007 CRV. This model has taken some flak on threads about its looks but at least I can buy a new Michelin,Pirelli or Continental tyre for under £90 and also have a spacesaver spare.

I am watching this thread as current Rav due for change soon and I still like performance etc of T180 but tyre situation WILL HAVE to be resolved before i would consider.

Why will Totota not fit 180 engine to lower spec. models?

[Parts-King]

I do offer advice where I can, and handle dozens of parts enquiries from you all, for which I have no problem, thats why I pay to be on here. However there are situations where I read the threads but make no comment. This is for a number of reasons, one, I would never divulge anything that was confidential or copyright, and secondly, sometimes it is unwise to make a comment where it will only stir up unrest. I am all for a free discussion, but some people make very personal comments on Toyota's or our own companys integrity. In that situation, I either say nothing, or put people straight where I think they are out of order! Some situations. like the early part of the run flat programme, were not handled particularly well, but I feel that situation has now been largly overcome. There are now lots of dealers with the equipment to fit these tyres. They are not cheap, and the process of fitting and coding the tyres (TPMS) is difficult and takes time, that is why I think that prices vary so much. The tyres are now available for dealers to stock, and we are keeping a few on the shelf. we also have a complete wheel available on the shelf, should the rim also be damaged. Runflat is here to stay for the foreseable future as far as I am concerned, I'm sure that pricing will settle down eventually

Kingo

[eanjohn]

We're (well I'm) not asking him to give us his opinion on the whole situation, just what the official Toyota stance is, as it seems that each dealership is working from a different set of rules.

Yes you are spot on about Kingo I have noticed on some threads he keeps a low profile and that is to be expected as he is also an employee of a Toyota franchise the same can be said for some of the Toyota techs who post on the forums

YES I think you are right and in Kingo`s case I can understand the no comment stance, BUT in the case of Toyota pr

there can be no excuses.

The Toyota dealers have tied you into a monopoly and then set about charging whatever they see fit,

I mean how can they be quoting an hour’s labor to fix something a normal tyre fitter does in ten minuets ?

Even in the event of legal action (which I can see coming )Toyota must have laid down a set of guide lines

for their dealers and more importantly their PR team to quote from.

I am still waiting for them to contact me about paying the £71 for the puncture, So I should know sooner or

Later what their stance is on this matter.....ean

[sywy]

Kingo - thanks very much for posting in this thread.

Could you tell us how much your dealership charge for a puncture repair, and also how much to fit a new tyre? These questions are pretty straight forward, and not controversial in any way? Also, how long to fit? I was told that it could take up to 4 hours to fit a new tyre!! I left my car with my dealer at around 3:30PM and they wanted to keep it overnight. When I returned at around 8:30am the next day it was not readdy until about 10:30am, despite me waiting there!!

[anchorman]

I started a thread on this subject Dec 2006 when considering renewal of one of my cars. Already own XTR 2.0 D4d and obvious choice was T180. Due to long distances and off road work at weekends I was concerned about run flat situation and the then exchange scheme, My concerns then were met with replies of "when did you last have a puncture" or just go to your nearest Dealer, This would not be practical on a Saturday night in north Scotland with 300 miles to travel home. I jumped ship and bought the new 2007 CRV. This model has taken some flak on threads about its looks but at least I can buy a new Michelin,Pirelli or Continental tyre for under £90 and also have a spacesaver spare.

I am watching this thread as current Rav due for change soon and I still like performance etc of T180 but tyre situation WILL HAVE to be resolved before i would consider.

Why will Totota not fit 180 engine to lower spec. models?

There is still an argument that statistically you are unlikely to have a puncture, for instance have you had any with your Honda? Of course you could have many punctures - it is just chance. What you cannot avoid is wearing the tyres out and this is where you will suffer. If they offered the 180 engine lower in the range then it is very likely that they would upgrade the tyres to cope with the performance. What I see as completely unnecessary is these confounded run flat monstrosities. If the spare wheel spoils the look of the sporty T180 then offer a space saver in a raised boot floor or even the equally confounded tin of guck.

Instead they have gone down the route of these run flat things in conjunction with notoriously unreliable TPW system and in doing so captured a piece of the tyre market that they would have undoubtably lost. It wouldn't be so bad if it were an option at purchase but I feel like you and it would certainly steer me towards an XT5 albiet with a 140 engine. If I wanted axtra performance I would then chip it.

While I slip on my Kevlar vest I will tell you that I understand why you bought your Honda and if I'm dead honest I think it looks quite nice. I certainly have no doubt that it will be very well engineered.

Now where did I put my hard hat and goggles?

[anchorman]

I do offer advice where I can, and handle dozens of parts enquiries from you all, for which I have no problem, thats why I pay to be on here. However there are situations where I read the threads but make no comment. This is for a number of reasons, one, I would never divulge anything that was confidential or copyright, and secondly, sometimes it is unwise to make a comment where it will only stir up unrest. I am all for a free discussion, but some people make very personal comments on Toyota's or our own companys integrity. In that situation, I either say nothing, or put people straight where I think they are out of order! Some situations. like the early part of the run flat programme, were not handled particularly well, but I feel that situation has now been largly overcome. There are now lots of dealers with the equipment to fit these tyres. They are not cheap, and the process of fitting and coding the tyres (TPMS) is difficult and takes time, that is why I think that prices vary so much. The tyres are now available for dealers to stock, and we are keeping a few on the shelf. we also have a complete wheel available on the shelf, should the rim also be damaged. Runflat is here to stay for the foreseable future as far as I am concerned, I'm sure that pricing will settle down eventually

Kingo

Kingo

Any half decent member would never put you in such a compromising situation. I think your diplomacy is very appropriate and am happy that we have the input from a genuine Toyota parts man who is willing to give as much constructive input as you do.

I hope that doesn't sound patronising - it is quite sincere.

As you know if I have an opinion I'll voice it - warts and all but at the end of the day if I was that discontent with Toyota (and the RAV) I would get rid of it. In reality i like most others are quite proud of it and spend more time poring over snapshots than waging war. The nice thing is that we are able to debate things openly and sometimes that means suggesting to Toyota that we would have prefered things differently.

Hopefully they will use constructive critisism to help make future decisions to the benefit of all of us.

Regards

[dave.m]

While I slip on my Kevlar vest I will tell you that I understand why you bought your Honda and if I'm dead honest I think it looks quite nice. I certainly have no doubt that it will be very well engineered.

Now where did I put my hard hat and goggles?

:o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o

ANCHORMAN HOW COULD YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Parts-King]

Kingo - thanks very much for posting in this thread.

Could you tell us how much your dealership charge for a puncture repair, and also how much to fit a new tyre? These questions are pretty straight forward, and not controversial in any way? Also, how long to fit? I was told that it could take up to 4 hours to fit a new tyre!! I left my car with my dealer at around 3:30PM and they wanted to keep it overnight. When I returned at around 8:30am the next day it was not readdy until about 10:30am, despite me waiting there!!

At the time of writing, we have only fitted two new tyres, and we offered our customer a special rate. We have fitted lots of the exchange wheel/tyres, but pricing of a puncture on one of those was subject to the mileage that had been done. We are due to discuss if one of these tyres can be fitted on a fixed price basis, at our centre shortly. You have been given the correct information, they are a b :censor: :censor: :censor: h to fit, and can take HOURS. I am not trying to fudge a price, but at the moment, we are charging on a case by case basis.

Kingo

[anchorman]

I had my figers crossed!!???

[Fujisan]

I do offer advice where I can, and handle dozens of parts enquiries from you all, for which I have no problem, thats why I pay to be on here. However there are situations where I read the threads but make no comment. This is for a number of reasons, one, I would never divulge anything that was confidential or copyright, and secondly, sometimes it is unwise to make a comment where it will only stir up unrest. I am all for a free discussion, but some people make very personal comments on Toyota's or our own companys integrity. In that situation, I either say nothing, or put people straight where I think they are out of order! Some situations. like the early part of the run flat programme, were not handled particularly well, but I feel that situation has now been largly overcome. There are now lots of dealers with the equipment to fit these tyres. They are not cheap, and the process of fitting and coding the tyres (TPMS) is difficult and takes time, that is why I think that prices vary so much. The tyres are now available for dealers to stock, and we are keeping a few on the shelf. we also have a complete wheel available on the shelf, should the rim also be damaged. Runflat is here to stay for the foreseable future as far as I am concerned, I'm sure that pricing will settle down eventually

Kingo

Can't say fairer than that Kingo

Unfortunately I think you are right about the spread of runflat tyres. In 10 or so years time, spare wheels as standard will become part of history.

I don't mind that, I can get use to that fact but why oh why did Toyota have to pick the most complex and trouble-some run-flat system.

I know BMW owners at first complained of a harsh ride from super-stiff sidewall run-flats but personally I'd rather have that then the messing about and expense this doughtnut system bring's with it.

Anyway thank you for your reply Kingo

[sywy]

Yep. thanks again for replying to this topic

BTW, what is the procedure for driving on runflats? x miles at y MPH? Is it in the manual, which I've not got with me ATM.

I'm asking becuase the first dealer I went to advised me not to drive away from them (they would, wouldn't they!!) and also wrote on the inspection report that they had advised me that it was dangerous to drive. I tried to argue with them about the point of a run flat tyre (the clue is in the name!!), but they were having none of it. I was obviously not going to test the top speed of a T180!!