Multimode System Is Rubbish

[bjw]

The Multimode System is GREAT :)

Not if you are stuck on the side of the road waiting for the RAC to come out to you

No problem has had more complaints ( or posts)than this issue !! it just keeps coming back time after time and when you think it has died down again it starts up.

As Parts King has said there is no way Toyota will admit there is a problem !! but hopefully in time it will be phased out

[geoffb]

As I have mentioned before, does anyone know if Toyota uses MMT in Japan? I was just curious to know if it has a strategy to test MMT in Europe and/or has bowed to a more extreme green lobby over here.

[bjw]

As I have mentioned before, does anyone know if Toyota uses MMT in Japan? I was just curious to know if it has a strategy to test MMT in Europe and/or has bowed to a more extreme green lobby over here.

No the MMT is just confined to Toyota Europe(we are the beta testers for this technology) it is not available in Japan or the USA

[hertsnminds]

As Parts King has said there is no way Toyota will admit there is a problem !! but hopefully in time it will be phased out

Can't see that happening any time soon. Every manufacturer has this type of system in place, VW/Audi call it DSG, Citroen EGS, Aston Martin well Clarkson just calls theirs rude names. You also have every F1 car using this type of system.

If you read the Citroen forums about SensoDrive and now EGS they elicit exactly the same reactions as the Toyota MMT system. It either works perfectly or creates nothing but trouble.

It would be interesting to put 20 drivers in the same MMT car and see how it drives for them. Be even more interesting to then get the same 20 drivers in 5 different manufacturers versions of the MMT type system and see the reactions. I wonder if there is a dealer group, set of owners clubs or car magazine that could set up a test like that?

[Julie C]

I think the fact that Toyota are rumoured to be replacing the MMT speaks for itself. The internet is littered with unhappy stories of MMT experiences - these should not be knocked just because you like the system, I am happy you do, but a forum such as this is about being able to speak about your own personal experiences. I'm sure there is a thread somewhere saying how wonderful the MMT system is, perhaps you would be better posting in that and leave this for those of us who are disappointed/upset/angry we are.

[Parts-King]

I think the fact that Toyota are rumoured to be replacing the MMT speaks for itself. The internet is littered with unhappy stories of MMT experiences - these should not be knocked just because you like the system, I am happy you do, but a forum such as this is about being able to speak about your own personal experiences. I'm sure there is a thread somewhere saying how wonderful the MMT system is, perhaps you would be better posting in that and leave this for those of us who are disappointed/upset/angry we are.

Julie, I am truly disappointed that you dont like MMT. however you dont have the monopoly to moan about your dislike of MMT in this or any other forum. If the forum was filled with one sided negative comments it quite frankly wouldnt be place to visit too often as we would all become members of the fellowship for the miserable! I have never disagreed that there have been issues with MMT, there have, particularly with Verso, HOWEVER I still come back to the point, MMT is superb in the Auris. IF Toyota ditch MMT, then it will have to be replaced with the new style auto transmissions now coming on the market, in order to hit their strict CO targets

Kingo

[Julie C]

I dont for a second believe I have a monopoly to moan, however having been a loyal customer of Toyota for the past 9 years I did want somewhere to share my disappointing experiences. I chose a thread relating to that, so I indeed have every right to post my feelings in the relevant thread.

You share your good experience, I share my bad. Quid pro quo. It is a public forum and if my experience is of any help to other potential buyers of an MMT transmission car, all the better.

[bjw]

I think the fact that Toyota are rumoured to be replacing the MMT speaks for itself. The internet is littered with unhappy stories of MMT experiences - these should not be knocked just because you like the system, I am happy you do, but a forum such as this is about being able to speak about your own personal experiences. I'm sure there is a thread somewhere saying how wonderful the MMT system is, perhaps you would be better posting in that and leave this for those of us who are disappointed/upset/angry we are.

Julie, I am truly disappointed that you dont like MMT. however you dont have the monopoly to moan about your dislike of MMT in this or any other forum. If the forum was filled with one sided negative comments it quite frankly wouldnt be place to visit too often as we would all become members of the fellowship for the miserable! I have never disagreed that there have been issues with MMT, there have, particularly with Verso, HOWEVER I still come back to the point, MMT is superb in the Auris. IF Toyota ditch MMT, then it will have to be replaced with the new style auto transmissions now coming on the market, in order to hit their strict CO targets

Kingo

Of course the forum will attract a lot of negative comments but that is to be expected as with any problem !!when it is running as it should nobody posts !!

Owners of Toyota's vehicles are I think some of the most loyal customers a motor manufacturer will have ,and its not by accident it is because they have listened to there customers in the past .

But I am afraid they seem to have stopped listening ,there has been so much damage done to Toyota's reputation by the MMT fiasco !! how many customers have cut there loses and sold there car and moved on !!

If this was America I wonder what reaction from there customers would be !! I think I know.

Can you name any other vehicle from Toyota that was subject to an VOSA investigation

I really believe if people are not happy with there cars they should post that is the only way potential customers can be made aware of any problems and because at the end of the day I am sure people are intelligent enough to make there own informed decision

[Red Yaris 54]

I think the fact that Toyota are rumoured to be replacing the MMT speaks for itself. The internet is littered with unhappy stories of MMT experiences - these should not be knocked just because you like the system, I am happy you do, but a forum such as this is about being able to speak about your own personal experiences. I'm sure there is a thread somewhere saying how wonderful the MMT system is, perhaps you would be better posting in that and leave this for those of us who are disappointed/upset/angry we are.

The whole point of the TOC forums is to air a BALANCED viewpoint between members.

In any situation it is more likely that unsatisfied customers will shout the loudest and most frequently.

I have been trying to give my honest opinion by stating my entire satisfaction with MMT.

Many extreemly satisfied owners are really not interested in singing the praises of MMT on the internet, so the impression is generated that those that do complain are in the majority.

This is not the case, as for the many thousands of MMT equiped vehicles sold by Toyota Europe only a small percentage of owners have expressed dissatisfaction.

The forums do tend to distort the factual truth :)

[auris2008]

I think it' just me and you Red Yaris54...

Cold-Fusion:

I don't think I was expressing much of a tone, I was responding to your statement that Toyota had made a mistake and should say so. The very many satisfied customers, like Red Yaris54 will tell you that you are in the minorty in not likeing MMT. I have always said people should try it before knocking it, many havnt even sat in one but somehow manage to slate it. The vast majority of TOC members slating MMT are the same people! You see their name popping up time and time again to knock the product, giving an impression that it is the majority of MMT owners having problems, in reality, it just isnt like that

Kingo

You forget me as one of the owners that love MMT ,

except THE PROBLEM IT GOING DOWN TO 1TH GEAR IN THE SPEED TO HIGH ( 18 KM ),

and I say it again " It is a PROBLEM and MALE FACTION because there is no SEMI-AUTO gear in the world that behave like this !!!"

More then that - NO MANUAL-DRIVER WILL CHANCE THE GEAR FROM 2TH TO 1TH IN THAT SPEED IN NORMAL DRIVING !!!

You said many times before " It is not a problem" - I thing you are completely wrong - and I have more then 40 years experience driving Manual cars all over the world-so give me some credit that I know what I am talking about.

I really don't understand why Toyota-main Office ignore us and don't make any effort to please us to fix the MMT-SOFTWARE to a better behavior. - for me it make me CRAZY every times it going down to 1th in this speed.

[Julie C]

can we stop the bus on this.

I think in general the majority of threads/posts etc throughout these boards are from happy contented Toyota owners, believe me I know how that feels, I was one of them for many years.

It is everyones prerogative to post their personal opinion. I think everyone here is giving an honest opinion, the thing about opinions is they are personal and I'm sorry but nobody banging on about their wonderful experiences with an MMT transmission will make me suddenly change my opinion - nor will my opinion change theirs.

These posts were all made in the appropriate thread - but I do object to someone saying I dont have a monopoly to moan etc etc just because I disagree with them.

[Parts-King]

I am perfectly happy to stop the bus ;) however before it stops

I accept you dont like MMT, end of, I have no doubts in my mind on that score, but some of your quotes do not represet to people reading this thread, the full picture. So far some of your personal opinion is

I wonder how much business they have lost over this

I would think a whole lot more of them if they held their hand up and admitted they had screwed up with the MMT fiasco

The internet is littered with unhappy stories of MMT experiences

Not entirely true, you are likely to hear bad news rather than good and anybody reading your story would assume everthing is bad with MMT, it isnt

I chose a thread relating to that, so I indeed have every right to post my feelings in the relevant thread

You do, and I have an equal right of reply. All I have said is MMT is superb in the Auris

So I'm off the bus, but may have to get back on it in due course ;)

Kingo

[Red Yaris 54]

I am perfectly happy to stop the bus ;) however before it stops

I accept you dont like MMT, end of, I have no doubts in my mind on that score, but some of your quotes do not represet to people reading this thread, the full picture. So far some of your personal opinion is

I wonder how much business they have lost over this

I would think a whole lot more of them if they held their hand up and admitted they had screwed up with the MMT fiasco

The internet is littered with unhappy stories of MMT experiences

Not entirely true, you are likely to hear bad news rather than good and anybody reading your story would assume everthing is bad with MMT, it isnt

I chose a thread relating to that, so I indeed have every right to post my feelings in the relevant thread

You do, and I have an equal right of reply. All I have said is MMT is superb in the Auris

So I'm off the bus, but may have to get back on it in due course ;)

Kingo

I will pass right down the bus in this case.....................................It still needs a conductor ;)

[bjw]

I am perfectly happy to stop the bus ;) however before it stops

I accept you dont like MMT, end of, I have no doubts in my mind on that score, but some of your quotes do not represet to people reading this thread, the full picture. So far some of your personal opinion is

I wonder how much business they have lost over this

I would think a whole lot more of them if they held their hand up and admitted they had screwed up with the MMT fiasco

The internet is littered with unhappy stories of MMT experiences

Not entirely true, you are likely to hear bad news rather than good and anybody reading your story would assume everthing is bad with MMT, it isnt

I chose a thread relating to that, so I indeed have every right to post my feelings in the relevant thread

You do, and I have an equal right of reply. All I have said is MMT is superb in the Auris

So I'm off the bus, but may have to get back on it in due course ;)

Kingo

I will pass right down the bus in this case.....................................It still needs a conductor ;)

I just hope it does not have an MMT transmission

[Parts-King]

Anyway..................

Farmer D1ck started all this off.........Where did he get to?.........Got off at the first stop I believe :lol:

Kingo

[bjw]

Anyway..................

Farmer ***** started all this off.........Where did he get to?.........Got off at the first stop I believe :lol:

Kingo

Planting tulip bulbs no doubt

[Parts-King]

I just noticed you cant say D1ck anymore

Kingo

[geoffb]

Now the firing has stopped and an eerie silence is descending I thought I'd carefully raise my head above the trench

ooooo look, a bus - how strange. And it has the bonnet up. Could it be the transmission?

A truce methinks. What else on such a civilised forum of Toyota owners.

[Red Yaris 54]

Now the firing has stopped and an eerie silence is descending I thought I'd carefully raise my head above the trench

ooooo look, a bus - how strange. And it has the bonnet up. Could it be the transmission?

A truce methinks. What else on such a civilised forum of Toyota owners.

A good idea Geoffb........................still not driven an MMT car?

Whilst it is quiet why don't you get out to your Toyota dealer and try driving a car with MMT? ;)

[geoffb]

Now the firing has stopped and an eerie silence is descending I thought I'd carefully raise my head above the trench

ooooo look, a bus - how strange. And it has the bonnet up. Could it be the transmission?

A truce methinks. What else on such a civilised forum of Toyota owners.

A good idea Geoffb........................still not driven an MMT car?

Whilst it is quiet why don't you get out to your Toyota dealer and try driving a car with MMT? ;)

Not really in the market for a new car presently and I really like my Corolla automatic box, best auto I have ever had. Mind you, if I was looking I would probably give MMT a go just out of interest on the basis that one shouldn't attempt to criticise what one hasn't tried.

My next car may not be a Toyota though to be honest. As I've said elsewhere on the forum I am really shocked at the downward trend in Toyota interior plastics and that, above all else, has really put me off - and I say that as a Toyota fan who has had several of them (various models) in the past :(

[uk_driver]

Have had my 1.6SR multimode for a month now and love the transmission. Used to get fed up when, on my way home, I would hit a queue of traffic, and my left leg would have to go up, down, up, down, up, down...then hold it half way up, back up, and down again on the clutch pedal. You get the idea. I arrived home feeling as if I had done a workout!

I drive using manual mode, and change gear using the gear knob most of the time, and the paddles some of the time. As long as you take your foot of the accelerator when changing (as you do in a manual car), the gear changes are smooth and you wouldn't notice anything untoward.

And now when I hit the slow moving traffic, I simply stick it in 'E' mode and let the car do all the work!

I simply fail to see why anyone would want to drive a conventional manual ... would someone please enlighten me!

[auris2008]

Have had my 1.6SR multimode for a month now and love the transmission. Used to get fed up when, on my way home, I would hit a queue of traffic, and my left leg would have to go up, down, up, down, up, down...then hold it half way up, back up, and down again on the clutch pedal. You get the idea. I arrived home feeling as if I had done a workout!

I drive using manual mode, and change gear using the gear knob most of the time, and the paddles some of the time. As long as you take your foot of the accelerator when changing (as you do in a manual car), the gear changes are smooth and you wouldn't notice anything untoward.

And now when I hit the slow moving traffic, I simply stick it in 'E' mode and let the car do all the work!

I simply fail to see why anyone would want to drive a conventional manual ... would someone please enlighten me!

Nice to have you here .

I love my mmt Auris and 95% i drive in Manual mode.

Did u try " Snow mode" = starting in 2th ? - find here all my posts how to do it .

if u need more help tell me.

The only male function in MMT is that it change from 2th to 1th in the speed too high - 18 Km/h -

]in a very unpleasant way - getting a strong rocking - as u release the clutch ( in manual gear) toם soon and toם quickly.

Toyota did noting to improve and update the MMT's software to fix this male function, it is very unsatisfactory, I expected much more from Toyota,

and the MMT's owners in this forum do nothing to force TOYOTA to do it.

[DougTews]

Greetings, I'm new to the forums. I recently purchased a slightly used 2007 Auris T Spirit MMT with only 15,000 miles on it. In the current economic climate, I had to downsize from a much larger car to something more affordable.

As to MMT issues, it may be puzzling why some people are happy with it and others hate it. I've been driving mine for only 10 days now, but can contribute some specific observations that hopefully might enlighten this discussion - both from positive and negative sides.

I live on the Isle of Wight. We have some areas with fairly level driving, but other areas are very steep and hilly to the extreme. When driving in the automatic "E" mode, it does take a little adjustment to get used to the apparent hesitancy when shifting. However, the sensation is not all that different from what I've experienced riding with people driving manual transmissions. The transmission upshifts in very quick succession when accelerating in an apparent attempt to maximize fuel economy (by keeping the revs low).

I've discovered in relatively flat areas, the transmission fares generally well. There is no question it's very different from a conventional automatic (and I understood this before I bought the car). In flat or gently rolling areas, I have little complaint about the operation and adapted to its "different feel" rather quickly. I suspect people who are happy with the MMT are driving primarily under these conditions.

However, driving in hilly areas is a different experience altogether. To leave my village, I must drive up a long and very steep hill. My first attempt was disastrous. As I started, the car quickly upshifted in it's usual fashion, but at the same time the hill got progressively steeper. In an apparent strive for economy, the transmission refused to downshift. The car quickly bogged down to almost a standstill, before it finally downshifted, lurched ahead, but then upshifted too soon and wound up slowing down again. Fortunately, no one was behind me, or I could have been rear-ended.

I discovered the Es mode handled this much, much better. I have subsequently also learned how to negotiate this hill in standard E mode. However, when driving through a very hilly area, it's safer to drive in Es mode. Otherwise the car can unexpectedly bog down…and at the worst possible moment.

I too have had awkward shifting occurring when slowing down and speeding up (as when negotiating a roundabout). It hasn't been often, but it does happen occasionally.

I can perfectly understand why some people have no issues with the MMT, but others hate it. A lot of it has to do with both personal driving style and especially so with terrain. For those who love their MMT's, I defy them to come and drive around in Ventnor on the Isle of Wight and maintain they had a smooth, uneventful driving experience…it isn't going to happen.

Overall, I have to agree with the nay-sayers, that this transmission is not well executed. My impression is that mechanically it's quite capable, but the problem appears to be in the software running it. As my Auris is a 2007, I'm going to ask the dealer if there are any software updates for it available.

In the meantime, I'm learning to drive it, and for the most part successfully. Frequently all that's necessary is to switch to Es mode when the situation warrants it and switch back after the difficult terrain is past. As the MMT is neither a genuine manual or automatic, there is definitely a learning curve when first experiencing it. I think the technology has promise, but it's not quite there yet.

[Cyker]

I'd tend to agree it's most likely a software issue. Pretty much every semi-auto out there with the exception of VW's DSG uses a nearly identical system to the MMT (i.e. is a computer controlled clutch and gear shift in some form), but they aren't as bad as the MMT's I've tried.

Supposedly the newer Auris' have an update firmware which makes the MMT much better, but on the older ones the balance between syncing RPM and shift speed is just really bad and it appears to have very poor torque sensing as you're finding for those hills.

To be fair tho', in steep hill situations you're supposed to use the kick-down when driving any kind of automatic (Semi or full) to avoid it overloading itself like that. Again however, the MMT doesn't handle sudden transitions like that well and it's like being kicked up the ***** as it doesn't sync RPMs properly if you do a kick-down like that on particularly steep hills (or with heavy loads I suspect, 'tho I haven't had the opportunity to try that! They tend to frown on you bringing a trailer on a test drive )

I've never liked semi autos TBH so I'm rather biased against them. Only semi I've not instantly hated was the VW DSG, but that thing costs more to repair than my Yaris is worth which is a bit off-putting!

Right now, if someone wanted me to advise them what automatic to get, I'd say either get a torque-convertor 'real' auto or a HSD (They blow the MMT out of the water and even give 'real' autos a run for their money in terms of smoothness!)

[Jan&tone]

Greetings, I'm new to the forums. I recently purchased a slightly used 2007 Auris T Spirit MMT with only 15,000 miles on it. In the current economic climate, I had to downsize from a much larger car to something more affordable.

As to MMT issues, it may be puzzling why some people are happy with it and others hate it. I've been driving mine for only 10 days now, but can contribute some specific observations that hopefully might enlighten this discussion - both from positive and negative sides.

I live on the Isle of Wight. We have some areas with fairly level driving, but other areas are very steep and hilly to the extreme. When driving in the automatic "E" mode, it does take a little adjustment to get used to the apparent hesitancy when shifting. However, the sensation is not all that different from what I've experienced riding with people driving manual transmissions. The transmission upshifts in very quick succession when accelerating in an apparent attempt to maximize fuel economy (by keeping the revs low).

I've discovered in relatively flat areas, the transmission fares generally well. There is no question it's very different from a conventional automatic (and I understood this before I bought the car). In flat or gently rolling areas, I have little complaint about the operation and adapted to its "different feel" rather quickly. I suspect people who are happy with the MMT are driving primarily under these conditions.

However, driving in hilly areas is a different experience altogether. To leave my village, I must drive up a long and very steep hill. My first attempt was disastrous. As I started, the car quickly upshifted in it's usual fashion, but at the same time the hill got progressively steeper. In an apparent strive for economy, the transmission refused to downshift. The car quickly bogged down to almost a standstill, before it finally downshifted, lurched ahead, but then upshifted too soon and wound up slowing down again. Fortunately, no one was behind me, or I could have been rear-ended.

I discovered the Es mode handled this much, much better. I have subsequently also learned how to negotiate this hill in standard E mode. However, when driving through a very hilly area, it's safer to drive in Es mode. Otherwise the car can unexpectedly bog down…and at the worst possible moment.

I too have had awkward shifting occurring when slowing down and speeding up (as when negotiating a roundabout). It hasn't been often, but it does happen occasionally.

I can perfectly understand why some people have no issues with the MMT, but others hate it. A lot of it has to do with both personal driving style and especially so with terrain. For those who love their MMT's, I defy them to come and drive around in Ventnor on the Isle of Wight and maintain they had a smooth, uneventful driving experience…it isn't going to happen.

Overall, I have to agree with the nay-sayers, that this transmission is not well executed. My impression is that mechanically it's quite capable, but the problem appears to be in the software running it. As my Auris is a 2007, I'm going to ask the dealer if there are any software updates for it available.

In the meantime, I'm learning to drive it, and for the most part successfully. Frequently all that's necessary is to switch to Es mode when the situation warrants it and switch back after the difficult terrain is past. As the MMT is neither a genuine manual or automatic, there is definitely a learning curve when first experiencing it. I think the technology has promise, but it's not quite there yet.

Doug, firstly welcome to TOC

I found your comments most interesting, spending as much time on the Island as I do, I'm glad i use the Prius over there rather than the wifes Aygo. However I think that I would use the MMT box on our Aygo as a manual around Wroxall and Ventnor, can the Auris and Yaris mmt's be driven in manual mode? That would certainly sort the hills out I feel...