Multimode System Is Rubbish

[Sunny7]

Manual FTW! :D

But try and get the MMT upgrade; The Auris is AFAIK the ONLY car that has this magical MMT decrapifying upgrade - It hasn't (And apparently will never be) filtered down to the current and previous gen Aygo or Yaris (Although I assume the Mk3 Yaris has it because it'd be stupid not to!).

The only other workaround is the drive-it-in-manual-mode option...

Hi Cyker.. when you mention the upgrade.. is this the same or not as the resetting of the initialisation please? If the upgrade is something totally different.. what is it I am to ask for at the Toyota dealers.. ? Yesterday my car was re-initialised to reset the clutch for me.. and to basically wipe off the previous drivers driving style. It was a lot better when I drove it home last night, I was so relieved and rang to thank them straight away.....spoke too soon.. by today it was back to being B awful.. not quite as bad as it has been but still dropping gears and high revs although not as high as 4k+ as before. Driving was once a pleasure ....and I would go anywhere.. now I am thinking about my journey and whether I have to negotiate anything that the car may not like and react badly to!! Hellooooo!!! Am I losing the plot?!! What is this all about I ask myself!

I wish I knew soemone else local who owned one so that I could see if they thought I was right in what I am saying or what? I want to love my car!!!

I am so weary of all this .. I wish I had not bought it.. think I would love it though if it had this upgrade. I did request an upgrade but received quizzical looks as though did not know what I was asking for....I didn't so that cap fits and I am wearing it!

[Sunny7]

PS one of the defensive comments that was made was that all the other Toyota cars have this MMT with no problems at all.....I suggested he check out some reviews .. but that I could only speak for the Auris and whatever the other cars were or were not .. I was not a happy bunny! What is the deal with the other cars .. anyone know? Good /bad?

To be honest, salespersons on the defensive with the old 'never seen that issue before' or 'it's not an issue I have come across' is the standard response to any complaint usually followed by referring you to the service side. I wouldn't want to tar every car salesperson with the same brush which would be very unfair... I have had great service from one or two over the years... but I do think that the trade generally has a thread of obfuscation, misleading behaviour and dishonesty running through it. It does seem to be a real jungle out there made all the more stressful because of the financial outlay. But, as I say, I have had good experiences buying cars so all is not lost. I wish you lots of luck getting it sorted anyway and my fingers are crossed for you

Hi Geoff

Well I had all my fingers and toes crossed yesterday when the car went in to be 'looked over' .. they had it nearly all day and when I arrived to collect it was told that it had been 're-initialised' and now should be a lot better... something to do with the way the clutch has memory or some thing? My son said it made sense to him ..so let's hope that this has cleared a lot of the problem! I was told that my chassis number was not the same as the cars on the 'site' that had these problems so not sure ...but at least there was recognition (which meant a lot) that the car had had a problem!

I drove it home and so far so good, it was substantially better .. let's see if it lasts! Still pulling back and did revv up a bit too much but not as high as the 4000rpms as my previous experience. They said see how it goes for a couple of weeks and give them a call if any problems so they could not do any more at this stage and they did not charge me.

My confidence has been rocked somewhat in this experience though in the dealership/car specifics so that has to be healed still... however, I do not believe in holding grudges or bearing resentment, life is too short.. so I daresay my relationship with them would continue in future purchases and I would be able to recommend them to others given how they have handled this. My sales guy did listen to me and did help me to get this sorted. I have thanked him for that.

My son took me for a quick lesson afterwards in how to use the manual aspect of the transmission and he was just about to tell me the bit about the ES and I stopped him and said "no more.. I won't remember to do all this and will be attempting to put it into reverse thinking I am changing gear again.. no.. stop!!!".. he thought that was very funny and no doubt I was the subject of amusement at the pub last night with his pals! Oh well.... c'est la vie. Too long in the tooth to care about that...

One thing I learned from driving their courtesy car (Aygo) was that I don't want a manual again! That was a good test as I had been seriously considering getting them to take it back and having a manual again. I do still miss my Avensis though all said and done.. my attachment to that car is the 1st of its kind in all my previous cars.

Interestingly though I did speak to Trading Standards yesterday just to find out what my rights in all this were and as I had been misled on the issue of it not being a full automatic and was not at any time informed anything about the MMT aspect, and when asked various questions about the paddles etc.. was not told anything, I would have had full rights under the Sale of Goods Act and been entitled to a repair, replacement or refund and would you believe ( I found this staggering)... for a period of 6 years after the sale!! Obviously though, they prefer you to resolve it asap. I hope the car problems are therefore resolved so we don't have to go down that route for everyone's sake! I hope others make a note of that though if they are misled or missold anything.

It did raise other questions for me though which I hope they now think about for their future sales of used cars..and that is that if they know the clutch holds a memory of the last person/s who drove it.. re the wear and tear on it per se.. why is it they are not resetting this before the new owner takes the car? It made me wonder if the previous buyer had not kept the car due to this problem being present from the previous owner (1st owner) and that they had not taken it up with anyone at a dealership to find out as I have done... instead just decided to be shot of it? Perhaps there is a lesson here for me and for them for future sales. I for one will not take anything for granted that because I am not told something that it does not present a problem and that they check every used car for inherent problems before resale.

Thank you for your comments over the last couple of days, they have been much appreciated.

PS.....OOPS. Back to square one I think! The car is playing up again .. the resetting has unset itself! I had 25 mins of pleasurable driving in it where it actually felt like I was the one in control .. but today it has been doing the same gear changing down stuff and bogging down to a snails pace .. always on stopping in traffic and on roundabouts or junctions. Did something interesting tonight too .. I was on a very slight upward hill in rush hour traffic.. managing to hold it on the brake and then straight on to the accelerator to move forward and at one moment there was a period when my foot was not on the brake and also not on the accelerator .. and the car was moving forward .. idling sort of thing.. they used to idle our cars in Drivers Education in USA.. it was akin to that.. would not have batted an eyelid if I was on the flat or downhill even.. but as I was on a slight incline I thought it a bit puzzling! Anyone know why? My son was in the car with me at the time and it happened twice so he witnessed it too. Then shortly afterwards within a minute, we were on the flat and in traffic. slowing down stopping .. moving forward..slowing down....you know and then I tested it to see by not using either pedal and it was stationary as I would have expected. May be nothing but I like to know why my car is behaving in a particular way... and I have become very interested in cars since 2 weeks ago!!!

[Sunny7]

I have not read through all the later posts on this subject which I joined in at November 2011.. I would like to add though that after many tweaking sessions with the dealership .. new actuator, new clutch etc etc.. I gave up! I now drive it in Manual mode which I find much better .. I only use E for motorways or long stretches of dual carriageway. I suspect that the 'so called alleged perfectly happy 2nd owner' of this car did the same thing! I still do not feel I 'love' the car for the reasons stated previously and if I had the money would change it in a heart beat! I have learned however, to like it and drive it with more control! I do not like the way it hesitates at roundabouts and junctions when you need the car to go and I detest hill starts! Ho hum...... nearly 2 years on though.. I feel it was a poor choice for me at the time and took all my life savings! hmm I am now waiting to win the lottery or a competition so that I can change it for something with a better auto transmission!

[FROSTYBALLS]

The automated manual gearboxes such as Toyota's MMT have never worked as well as a 'normal' automatic, which is why manufacturers like Toyota and Mazda have dropped them in favour of CVT's.

[dnic]

I have experienced the same problems as other users of the MMT on my 2007 TSpirit. My wife's car an A Class with semi-auto is a real pleasure to drive, we have had it since new and it has 108k on the clock.

I have had the MMT ECU replaced this week with the latest hardware version. What an amazing difference, drives more like a conventional auto (not as smooth, but there again it uses different technology to achieve the gearchanges)

Gone is the jerky pickup from start and the move from 1st to 2nd is excellent, no hesitation when taking off after slowing down at roundabouts. All in all a massive transformation in the way the gearbox performs. Seems all is well so far using E and Es modes.

I will keep this thread updated over the coming weeks.

David

[Sunny7]

Hi David

Thank you for posting your own personal experience with this.. it is helpful to see that others are resolving their issues and that I am not the only one having problems!

Can I ask you please what the cost of this upgrade to the MMT gearbox was? I would love to do this on mine but fear that it is going to be too expensive to fix now. I drive my car in Manual all the time and only switch to E minimally.. dual carriageways/motorways etc

Sunny7

[dnic]

Hello H,

H,

I have only had my car 3 weeks, bought privately. I was aware of the concerns of users regarding the MMT. However I still went ahead, I factored in the cost of upgrade in. It was a leap of faith on my part that the upgrade would work.

I had fitted the latest version of the MMT ECU, unit cost (incl. vat) £547.54, labour to fit and programme (about 2.5hrs) (incl. vat) £285.00. Expensive in my opinion.

I believe that Toyota have been less than upfront in recognising the issue. The ECU that I had fitted is a 3rd generation unit, which I think implies Toyota was aware of the problems in the first place.

If you purchased you car from a dealer, maybe going back to them and asking for a quote to do the work.

I will keep you posted on how the MMT performs

David

[dnic]

mmt Update,

Thursday morning started car, but the gear lever would not engage in any gear. Phoned the dealer who fitted the unit and they sent around the tech who fitted the unit and a tech who is conversant with the electronics side of things, complete with laptop.

Techs reset the mmt ECU and performed a number of tests. All appeared ok, drove around the block, came back switched of the car and restarted all ok.

Friday morning same thing as Thursday gear lever would not engage in any gear. Phoned dealer again they suggested that i get it to them to have a another look at the problem.

Used the procedure in the manual to unlock the gear lever using a flat blade screwdriver. Able to use the car, however warning lights are on.

Will be going to dealer first thing Monday morning.

I will keep this thread updated.

David

[dnic]

MMT or what ever was playing up has fixed it's self

I did not use the car on Saturday. Sunday morning I needed to go out so I thought I will see if the car would be ok. Car started ok, with a forebaring of apprehension I engaged reverse gear. Gear lever selected first time (no lock out) Warning lights did not come on. Went for a shortish drive about 45 mins then stopped for 2 hours and back home.

One thing that I have done after reading numerous articles/posts is to park the car with the gear lever in E, my drive is on a slight incline.

Amazing this Auris, leave it on the drive for 24hours and it fixes it's self, going out around 11am today, hopefully a repeat of yesterday

David

[timbooo]

MMT or what ever was playing up has fixed it's self

One thing that I have done after reading numerous articles/posts is to park the car with the gear lever in E, my drive is on a slight incline.

David

Perhaps (bit of a leap) when parked in N the car had rolled back very slightly and the gearbox had thus engaged into a gear somehow and locked itself?

[dnic]

Tim,

Thank you, good suggestion. I recall reading somewhere, that the MMT is fitted with a clinometer which it uses to detect approaching hills so can anticipate gear shifts. If that is the case then parking front up on an incline could activate the angle gizmo.

Just a thought.

David

[dnic]

A good day

Went out today drove around 60 miles, mixture of open and town roads. Car is performing great, thinking about this on the way home. This is how it should be to drive , no jerking upshifts or hesitation at applying the right foot. No warning lights.

So far, a completely different car to drive from I first bought it 3 weeks ago.

David

[Sunny7]

HI David

Thanks for your updates and the cost of the work you had done too! I had a lot of stuff done to the car when I first purchased it from the Toyota dealer all of which came under the extended warranty thank goodness! I won't go into it all here but I was not happy with the person who sold me this car as it was not handled professionally nor honestly I do not feel. I did talk to Trading Standards who advised me on all manner of things and I could have had the money back under an enforcable act. But I would not have had all the money that I had invested in the car plus loss through depreciation etc so I really had no choice but to keep it. I was not a happy bunny.

Perhaps after xmas when work picks up again, I may explore the possibility of having the work done that you have had.

Re the getting stuck in gear .. a few times mine won't go into reverse or rather the gear will go in but it won't engage and sometimes it got stuck in neutral having changed itself there when driving in E. Not a pleasant experience I must say!

The car has always started though, (touch wood she says) and so have not had any issues with that aspect. I have a drive on a slight incline too but always park in neutral. Never had any problems.

My car has not been driven for 6 weeks re me having major surgery so hope its okay when I can start driving again! Gulp!

Sunny