Engine Transplant For More Power

[ZeroBlade]

:P Shock horror!

Yep u read it rite boys, I wanna change my 3SG-E lump for something else, but don't want to go the turbo route as the insurance is gonna skin me, and i want to be able to say that powers not gained with a turbo. B)

Basicaly i'd like to stick N/A if possible, and i had the new Altezza DVVTi in mind. Is this engine swap possible? (Matt: u & rogue fancy tackling a new job? ;))

What about dropping in a supercharged lump?A 2ZZGE seems nice, but I wouldnt mind going for a 2nd gen 4AGZE. I know the power gains aren't much from stock, but these have potential(?) form what i've heard.

Also what's insurance like toward SuperCharged engines, i know they don't like turbo's much?

thnx lads,

-Z

[Bibbs]

The dual VVTi Beams has different engine mounts .. I believe the head will go on a stock block .. but it'd be a lot of fettling to get it working proper ..

A 4AGZE?? You'll get about 180 bhp tops .. and you can get this with a Rev3 engine and chip .. It's what happens when you loose 400cc ..

And insurance companies look at engine swaps (for a non standard one) and turbo-ing and SC-ing all VERY badly.

I'd suggest going with a Rev3 NA (and then tell you insurance company it needed a new engine and it's a newer one - they probably wont charge if you don't mention that it's better) - then exhaust/filter and chip ..

[ZeroBlade]

Hrm i guess the AGZE is outa the question then, but i like the idea about NEEDING a new engine, in truth i'm not lying ;)

Got a pm off Matt about the DVVTi - i mite be afuture job lined up 4 Rogue Systems, gotta give patrick a buzz and see what he says!

You KNOW thats gonna be one bad-***** !Removed! of a mod

[Bibbs]

The DVVTi would be the !Removed! .. red top Beams are rare .. Black top in a MR2 .. can't be many ..

Not sure if you'd need to start with a latter block though (as there may be a Gen2 3sge / Gen3 3sge differences).

I know the car doesn't have much torque as all the power is well up the rev range .. but it's a load better then a stock NA.

But telling your insurance you NEEDED an engine swap due to excessive oil leaks? Can't see a big charge .. the 20 bhp is neither here nor there .. :D

[ZeroBlade]

The DVVTi would be the !Removed! .. red top Beams are rare .. Black top in a MR2 .. can't be many ..

Hehe i can see it now...

I go hunting for an Altezza, cause the driver to have an accident make sure his cars a write off.

Then go up to him and say "Sorry chap, it was totally my fault" proceed to give him details.

Then say, "listen m8 i don't mean to be cheeky, but would u mind buying the car back off ur insurance company and selling me it?"

Hrm thats a point. Can normal civilians buy other peoples cars off insurnace companes? Or do the companies sell them onto specific scrappies?

20hp increase, i thought the DVVTi pushed 210ish?

-Z

[Bibbs]

be hard to find an Altezza anyway ..

I was on about a rev3 engine over a rev2 for the extra 20 bhp

[ZeroBlade]

Yeh i know, but i figure i've got a year or so to search cos that's how long it's gonna take me to sve up, maybe longer :(

Ah i get yah,. Yep the R3. Tho i remember something about there being a 4th version of the engine, can't rem exact details right now tho?

[Bibbs]

the 4th gen was a in another Jap only car .. 260 bhp (but I think it was larger displacement)

[ZeroBlade]

I c, thnx for clearing that up.

Oh check this:

http://atsearch.autotrader.co.uk/WWW/CARS_...200338112247473

So i'm not gonna walk a mile away from where i'm sitting and steal the engine outa that

-Z

[Bibbs]

The black top beams aint in an IS200 mate .. that has a 2.0 6 pot engine .. 160 bhp, but lots more torque.

The Altezza is the Jap only Toyota IS200 - and they had the choice of the 2.0 4 pot 210 bhp or the 2.0 6 pot 160 bhp .. but you can't tow a caravan with the beams ..

[ZeroBlade]

The black top beams aint in an IS200 mate .. that has a 2.0 6 pot engine .. 160 bhp, but lots more torque.

The Altezza is the Jap only Toyota IS200 - and they had the choice of the 2.0 4 pot 210 bhp or the 2.0 6 pot 160 bhp .. but you can't tow a caravan with the beams ..

Ahhh, it all makes sense now, kinda. Basically i gotta go JAP.

One thing about the torque - i can' rem but does that mean the car has slower accelration and better top speed (basically)??

[Bibbs]

Torque is acceleration and BHP is top end ..

When my turbo was poorly it was 191 bhp .. and my mates NA was 184 (we were at a dyno day). We had a little race and I toasted him, as I had a "larger area under the torque curve" ..

The relationship is bhp = (torque x rpm)/5252, where torque is given in lb.-ft. and rpm is exactly what you think it is, revolutions per minute.

[ZeroBlade]

So the altezza engine doesnt have low end torque, but better top end...

So say hyperthtically i raced you, would i whupp ur ***** or would u whupp mine?

:D

[Bibbs]

With an NA there isn't really a curve in the torque it's like a straight line from 0 to top torque ..

With forced induction the curve is a lot steeper .. and then flattens out ..

NA is more predictable - you know when round a corner where to put your foot exactly on the throttle.

Turbo is harder as you have to blip the throttle, power on, turbo spools, too much power, ease off, too little power, throttle on ..

with 200bhp NA vs 200bhp Turbo .. turbo will win as it'll have the top power for a wider rev range ..

[ZeroBlade]

1.

NA is more predictable - you know when round a corner where to put your foot exactly on the throttle.

Turbo is harder as you have to blip the throttle, power on, turbo spools, too much power, ease off, too little power, throttle on ..

2.

with 200bhp NA vs 200bhp Turbo .. turbo will win as it'll have the top power for a wider rev range ..

Hrm i see, then the altezza engine is for me...

point 1 of ur's is why. Whilst i'm not scared of driving i like to have control, something which i don't think i'll have with a turbo, i.e. the kick in. Must admit tho when turbo kicks in its sweet :)

Point 2:

Guess the "gas" mite be an addon then...

Cheers for all this help m8 i'll buy you a bevvy if i ever c ya.

-Z

[Bibbs]

Don't get me wrong about the turbo, they aren't that bad .. it's just if you are on the very edge when cornering, it's like someone playing with the throttle which you also have to control .. it's why there are not many "drivers cars" that have turbo's ..

It's why all the small Lotuses are raved about, predictable ..

But it's also why I'd want a Noble .. twin turbo ..

I'm addicted to forced induction .. but would trade it all in for a 5.7 V8 ..

[ZeroBlade]

Don't get me wrong I would love that kinda car :)

But i just wanna c how far i can stretch the N/A. Basically i'm hoping that mods i do now i'll be able to retain if i stick w. an n/a.

Such as exhust, clutch, gearing(?) etc.

Basically my plan is:

1: to get my exhaust sorted 1st (just needs fitting) - approx £50

2: magnecor leads - spark plugs (blitz iridium) - (just needs fitting)

3: with the cold weather coming up i need tyres (+ rims ;)) - £1000

4: Window tinting (erm to stop the sun blinding me on a bright snowy day B)) - £150ish

5: Break upgrade - rotor discs - £435

- Then caliper upgrade too, not thought about this yet.

6: Supsension + struts- Still really unsure about this. I WANT a realy adjustable one's so i

can fine tune 'em.

7: Rev6 Rear lights (smoked)

8: The Fury bodykit - £800 (approx)

9: Get kit fitted + respray - £1500 (approx)

10: Clutch + Flywheel upgrade

11: Misc interior - steering wheel (momo millenium?) , seats (unsure), leather retrim (bout £600)

12: I think by now it'l be time for the engine conversion.

Hrm i think that's everything tho i'm bound to rem something i've forgotten so i'll proly edit this post...

-Z

[Bibbs]

1: Good start ..

2: Have a look for a copper contact Dizzy cap and a new rotor arm too ..

3: Have a look on MTTE as there are some BBS rims on there

4: I'n not sure on this now .. aparently driving is a pain as you can't see out the windows at night

5: IMOC have an affiliate (Red.Dot) doing Brembro Caliper upgrade .. Awesome kit. I've got disks/pads/hoses

6: Fully adjustable is good - but Eibach springs from fensport are fine for UK roads.

7: Update the look a bit ..

8: okay (can't remember what it looks like)

9: would be good

10: Not so much the clutch but a lightened FW will help

11: MattMR2 was suggesting they may go into re-trims in the new year ..

12: broom brooom

[ZeroBlade]

2. Ok, will do m8.

3. I'll have spy on there. Was lookign at these:

http://www.revolution.eu.com/erol.html#22334x0&&

17" ArowSpeed Flight

Right at the bottom, middle pic. But in HyperBlack (like the ones nxt to 'em)

4. I do do a lot of driving i the dark...

5. I like the look of the rotors and think they look pretty sweet under my rims :)

6. Mite go Eibach and skimp the fully adjustable, TBH i'm not looking to race or nething

serious.

8. This' it.

http://www.onderground-design.com/BODYKITS...toyota-mr2.html

A little F&TF i know but ima get it in black plus i've not seen this kit on a 2 in the UK yet.

Tho god know's every f****r will have it when i get mine done, lol.

10. I'll prolly have s*****d the clutch by then. Just had a brand new stock Toyota one

fitted... But i won't want to skimp on something such as this.

Other things that'l have to go with the engine r gearbox etc so i got more costs to think about there :(

Well it'l be worth it in the end, i'm getting all tingly

First(?) UK MR2 with e DVVTi engine and fury kit

P.S: All mods listed r copyrighted by me, ne copying and i'll hav to send the boys round ;)

hehe B)

-Z

[Bibbs]

3. Nice .. especially in a dark colour ..

6. I've only got coilover as I got 'em on the cheap :D

8. Ahh - affectionalty known as the "abortion" I believe ;)

[ZeroBlade]

6: Only got Coilover's...i trade u :P

8: Man u iz racizt. It's cos it iz orange, aye!

Lol

[Bibbs]

Trade me what? I wouldn't bin them now .. I love the drop .. my tyres are about 2cm off the arch and they are so solid it doesn't even get close over bumps ..

[ZeroBlade]

Sigh, damn bumps.

As far as the trading goes i thought coilovers were better than springs and more expensive.

So i could swap mine w. urs..

n/m it's l8 i'm prolly talkin sh**e

[Bibbs]

Coilovers are the T*ts .. and Cusco kit starts at about £1500 (and mine are stage 3 out of 4 race spec).

Springs are about £200.

I'll keep me coilovers mate :D

[ZeroBlade]

...I'll keep me coilovers mate...

You positive? You 100% sure?

Not gonna give u a 2nd chance to trade...

How's about i make hte deal better, my stock suspension?

There how'd u like that. 13yr old springs all inclusive, guaraanteed to give u the most bumps you've ever had in ur life!