Towbar For Rav4.3

[SteveR.]

I spoke to someone who had a genuine Toyota detachable towbar fitted and he wasn't best pleased. Apparently he has to remove it in order to open the rear door, which he finds a pain - and potentially expensive if he forgets and dings his door. He said he'd since seen "Witter" bars and wishes he had one of theirs fitted instead (I gather they don't foul the door). When the time came to have a towbar fitted, I found a local installer who fits Witter bars. I've never had a towbar fitted before, so the prices for what I've always though of as a simple lump of metal on the back seemed quite high, and I was persuaded to go with the much cheaper option of a fixed bar instead of a removable one. It was booked in for this coming Monday.

Yesterday (Friday) the installer called yesterday to cancel - apparently the supplier doesn't have any in stock and doesn't know when they will get them in. It's a bit of a blow because I was hoping to be able to use it very soon, but perhaps I should take it as an opportunity to look more closely at the options. Since booking it in, I've heard comments about towbars on Ravs being very low because of the rear door. I was told that although this doesn't really matter with a single-axle trailer, it might cause problems with a twin-axle one. That's not something I had considered; my trailer is single-axle, but it would seem a pity to limit future options if it's avoidable. I also can't help wondering if the reason the Toyota part fouls the door is because that's the only way they can get the tow height correct, and that anything that doesn't foul might cause problems if I ever want to tow a twin-axle.

So I find myself floundering in an area that I know very little about. I always assumed a towbar is a towbar is a towbar, but I'm now having to consider fixed vs. removable, interference with rear door, and tow height. Can anyone with more experience with such things clear any of this up for me? What I'd really like is for someone to recommend a make that's trouble-free, easy to fit on a DIY basis, in stock for next-day delivery, and cheap :) Realistically, I'll settle for any help in sorting out what's important and what isn't.

SteveR.

[bothwell_buyer]

Ah well...

I have a Toyota fixed towbar on my 1994 3 door RAV - fitted with other exras when I ordered it. I had the rear step fiited as well.

With this, the door opens fine. However, it normally doesn't clear the coupling on the trailer. The towing height is however ok for the 2 twin axle units I have.

I have the Trafic fitted with a towbar (DIY job) which was an easy fit. However, I had to fit the towball at its lowest to enable the back doors and rear ramp to be used without having to remove the ball pin. As a result, the towball is really too low for the twin axled units....I've thought about changing the style of towing bracket to one where you can remove the ball hitch and pin. This would allow me to raise the bracket and still open the doors.

Coming to your question, there are a number of towbar manufacturers other than toyota or Witter. The bar I fitted to the Trafic came from another supplier, -can't remember who but!

With the advantage of hindsight, I'd look for a bracket which allows a choice of towing height and the use of a ball/pin so the ball/pin can be removed when not in use....this would help to have the bracket at a height where you can tow a twin axle without putting more weight on the front axle...much the same way as you see on some landrovers. When you have a trailer hooked up, you'll probably not get the back door open much at all anyway.

The other thing to watch for is that the electrical coupling socket/s are accessible without you having to squirm under the car to reach them - a sensible bracket will extend the socket/s.

With Witter, you pay for the name - as you say a tow bar is a lump of fabricated heavy gauge metal, measured to bolt underneath your car easily. Try surfing the net for other suppliers for a price comparison.

Also, make sure that the electrics are done neatly, and are waterproof - only cos a badly done job will result in future problems with connection corrosion. I can tell you all about that after a journey from Aberdeen to Glasgow last week with only the indicators working on the trailer!!! The trailer plug is well corroded, as was a connection block half way down the trailer. No fun replacing the connection block in pouring rain when its dark! I didn't even attempt the plug (I have a spare in the tool box) and drove with the hazards

There are a number of suppliers so you should be able to get some comparisons.

The other thing to consider is using spring assisters if you are towing a nose heavy trailer. These are reasonable, easily fitted, and maintain the rear suspension height. Depends on how often you will be towing.

good luck

[Rav City]

I had a Westfailia detachable towbar fitted to my 2005 Rav at the caravan show in 2006, if you have a later Rav with a number plate in the middle it will have to be detachable.

If you are towing an caravan I would be concerned regarding the ball height if it misses the rear door.

[anchorman]

My mate Wollastom has some experience of this. I will interrogate him and come back on this.

Cheers

[BigBaz]

I have a Witter fitted to mine and the back door opens fine, until the trailer is coupled up. The door will open but the plastic trim on the bottom of the door acts like the barb on a fishing hook, the doors opens, but wont close unless you manipulate the plastic trim about 7-8 mm to close the door again.

Oh, and I paid £200 to Toyota for them to arrange a Witter installer to come to my house and fit it for me. It is a single socket version.

[SteveR.]

Thanks all - it all seems quite complicated. The 4.3 (2006 on) model is apparently different from the 4.2 model when it comes to towbars. I'm not sure in what way, but I guess it's invalid to makes assumptions about one based on the other.

I'm not sure about the comment about it having to be a detachable one on a 4.3 model. The installer was planning on fitting a fixed one, and Witter's list clearly showed both a fixed and a detachable for the 2006 on model. OTOH, if that list was in error, it might explain why Witter they don't have one in stock and can't say when they'll be in!

[anchorman]

I misread the post last night and thought we were talking about a 4.2

On the 4.3 I believe it is less of a problem than a 4.2 because the rear door does not come down to the bottom. I personally would have the genuine Toyota bar with the detachable ball. The wiring kits are available from both Toyota and other suppliers and these are very nice in that you unplug the lights and re-plug the loom inbetween without splicing the wires.

I think your 1st port of call should be Parts-King who will quote you for the pukka stuff.

Cheers

[Clive XT5]

[On the 4.3 I believe it is less of a problem than a 4.2 because the rear door does not come down to the bottom. I personally would have the genuine Toyota bar with the detachable ball. The wiring kits are available from both Toyota and other suppliers and these are very nice in that you unplug the lights and re-plug the loom inbetween without splicing the wires.]

I agree with Anchorman. On my 4.2 I fitted a genuine Toyota bar with detachable ball as it was the only way I could achieve the correct tow height for my single axle caravan. The interferance with the rear door is a bit of a pain but fitting/removing the hitch is only a 30 sec. job. Towbar fitting was an easy 45 min. DIY job, the only special tool required being a torque wrench - presume 4.3 will be similar. I think (not sure) that the 4.3 has Multiplex wiring therefore it would be safer and easier to fit a proper wiring kit than splicing the wires.

Cheers

[anchorman]

Somebody with an 4.3 fitted one and the wiring but I can't remember who (yes yes, I know its the age!!!).

Maybe a search would turn it up.

Regards

Clive - are you Buxton or Matlock?

[duncerduncs]

Somebody with an 4.3 fitted one and the wiring but I can't remember who (yes yes, I know its the age!!!).

It's member '2.2 D4D' that has a towbar fitted to their 4.3 (how could you forget anchorman!? )

There are 3 shown in the brochure, surely one must fit... :D

[anchorman]

Somebody with an 4.3 fitted one and the wiring but I can't remember who (yes yes, I know its the age!!!).

It's member '2.2 D4D' that has a towbar fitted to their 4.3 (how could you forget anchorman!? )

There are 3 shown in the brochure, surely one must fit... :D

Just done a week of earlies!

[Clive XT5]

Somebody with an 4.3 fitted one and the wiring but I can't remember who (yes yes, I know its the age!!!).

Maybe a search would turn it up.

Regards

Clive - are you Buxton or Matlock?

Buxton and proud of it Anchorman. Your not thinking of rustling our sheep are you ? All the pretty ones are spoken for!!!

Cheers

[dave.m]

Somebody with an 4.3 fitted one and the wiring but I can't remember who (yes yes, I know its the age!!!).

Maybe a search would turn it up.

Regards

N Maria fitted one herself as I remember.

[anchorman]

Somebody with an 4.3 fitted one and the wiring but I can't remember who (yes yes, I know its the age!!!).

Maybe a search would turn it up.

Regards

Clive - are you Buxton or Matlock?

Buxton and proud of it Anchorman. Your not thinking of rustling our sheep are you ? All the pretty ones are spoken for!!!

Cheers

No I have my own little harem - flossie, raquel and oda may (she's black) - so no need for rustlin'. You didn't work at the lazy F did you?

[anchorman]

Somebody with an 4.3 fitted one and the wiring but I can't remember who (yes yes, I know its the age!!!).

Maybe a search would turn it up.

Regards

N Maria fitted one herself as I remember.

You are right - how could I forget (I think it's happening - I'm losing it).

There was somebody else earlier though.

[Bezzer]

I've got A 4.3 with a PCT Prestige detachable swan neck type towbar fttted by Towtal in Stoke, cost £320 all in fitted with twin electrics. :( Toyota dealer wanted £680 :o

The door still opens you "have" to have detachable only because of the number plate, legally you can't obscure it with the towbar if you aren't actually towing which a fixed bar does.

[SteveR.]

you "have" to have detachable only because of the number plate, legally you can't obscure it

Aaaaahhhhh... The penny drops. Thank you for that, it's obvious once pointed out!

I have to say I'm rather surprised at the installer. They have a lot of experience with towbars and seem well respected, so I would have expected them to have checked all this when I went to see them. When they called to cancel, they said that Witter didn't have any fixed towbars in stock and didn't know when they would have them again. I asked them to check whether detachable ones were available and to leave a message on my answerphone. When I picked it up, it was asking whether the number plate was bumper- or door-mounted. I called back the next day to let them know it was bumper-mounted, and also asked if there were other options e.g. fixed bars from alternative manufacturers. The people dealing with it weren't in (Saturday) but I was assured that they would already have investigated such options and that they would call back on Monday with a quote for the detachable.

This morning they called to quote for both removable and fixed from another manufacturer (Brink Bars) - so much for having investigated that option already. Fortunately I had read your posting before they called, so I mentioned the issue of obscuring the numberplate. They said they shouldn't think it would be a problem, but they'd call the manufacturer and check. When they called back, they confirmed that if the spare wheel carrier is on the door, it'll have to be detachable. "About £400" from Witter.

I really think they should have been much more on the ball than this. What with the messing about and the extra cost, I'm sorely tempted to go elsewhere or to DIY. I ws a bit dubious about the wiring, having heard mention of the 4.3 having very fine and fiddly wiring, but if comments in this thread lead me to understand that this is only an issue if trying to splice the wiring and that a proper kit makes it easy - is that correct? The installers said the job would take them about four hours, which seems quite a long time for experienced fitters if it's as straightforward as it sounds. I remember NMaria's posting, which I think she said took a whole day, but I don't know if that included splicing wires or if she used a kit (I couldn't find her post when I tried, but I'm not very familiar with the search feature - I'll try again).

SteveR.

[sywy]

This one?

[SteveR.]

This one?

Yes, thanks, I found it when I tried again. Not sure how I mucked up the previous attempt - I'll blame Bacchus!

[bothwell_buyer]

This one?

Yes, thanks, I found it when I tried again. Not sure how I mucked up the previous attempt - I'll blame Bacchus!

Is Bacchus an aberdeen player??? Gawd - the place is fu o foreigners.

[SteveR.]

;)

[SteveR.]

By the way, what are "12N" and "12S" when it comes to towbar electrics kits?

[Clive XT5]

By the way, what are "12N" and "12S" when it comes to towbar electrics kits?

Steve,

12N is the black socket which is wired to supply all the car electrics to the trailer/caravan for lights, indicators, stop lights etc.,

12S is normally grey and required when towing a caravan to supply current to run the fridge and charge caravan leisure Battery whilst in transit. If you are only going to tow a normal trailer the only socket you need wiring in is the 12N.

In your earlier post you mentioned £400 quoted for a Witter detachable tow bar. Is this just for the bar or does it include all electrics and fitting? If it's just for the bar it seems a bit dear - my genuine Toyota detachable for a 4.2, which incidentally is manufactured by Brink, with a 10% discount cost £195. inc. VAT from my local Mr T.

Regards.

ANCHORMAN - Yes I was at the lazy F.......... and we have a mutual friend very close to you with vintage RR's. :) :)

[SteveR.]

you mentioned £400 quoted for a Witter detachable tow bar. Is this just for the bar or does it include all electrics and fitting? If it's just for the bar it seems a bit dear - my genuine Toyota detachable for a 4.2, which incidentally is manufactured by Brink, with a 10% discount cost £195. inc. VAT from my local Mr T.

Yes, that was "from zero to go" - includes electrics, fitting and VAT. I hope!

Thanks for the clarification about 12N/S. I take it that all I need for trailers (no caravans) is 12N, and that I can ignore 12S completely?

Adding up the numbers, I figure I could source the Witter parts for a little over £280 (inc delivery & VAT) for a DIY installation. I'm tempted by that, but I've found someone else locally who has quoted about £365 all-in (though I don't yet know what make he's proposing to fit). Eighty quid doesn't seem expensive for fitting, even if I count my own time as "free". I have a reluctance to let anyone pull my car to bits, but in theory they should be less likely to damage it than I am.

I'll check what make he's proposing before deciding. Any suggestions of makes that should be preferred or avoided?

[Bezzer]

When I was deciding where to have mine done a mate who has a garage business spoke to a mechanic from a local Toyota dealer with a view to getting the bar trade for me, he was told it was a half day fitting job and the bar and bits would cost around £400 he also found out the dealership had NEVER fitted one to a 4.3 as everyone thought they were too expensive. ;)

It was cheaper to go to a specialist towbar place, £320 all in as I said, they spliced all the wirng and didn't use plug in stuff, took 2 hours, watched them do it and I wouldn't like to attempt it myself even though I'm not usually put off by electrics.

All bars have to be properly approved nowadays so whatever you get should be OK.