Multimode Clunk On Change Down

[AussieOverseas]

Hello all ... another new forum member here!

I'm the proud owner of a new 2008 metallic grey 1.6L (1ZR) MMT (~3500kms) down here in Santiago, Chile (so, yes, the MMT gearbox version is available outside of Europe). I'm Aussie, and find it quite curious that the equivalent Corolla hatch in Oz is not available in MMT ....

First of all, thanks for all the useful information I've been able to glean from the forum threads. I too initially struggled with the MMT idiosyncrasies, but it's growing on me as I learn to drive with it, and not against it. It would be good if Toyota did release a firmware mod to the ECU that lowers the speed that triggers a change down to 1st gear ... surely that couldn't too be hard.

However, I'm a bit concerned about the noisiness of the gear change down to a lower gear whilst pulling up to a stop. You can easily hear (from inside the car with the windows fully closed) a clunk as the gearbox changes down. In reality, even whilst stopped changing from neutral to reverse or E/M creates a loud clunk that turns heads. It sounds spring-loaded, and actually a bit scary.

I've not managed to find any mention of this phenomenon in any thread, so I'm wondering if I have an isolated case. Has anyone else out there experienced the clunkiness I'm talking about? I plan to have the local dealer take a good look at this, but from my experience so far with Toyota down here, I figure I can get more help in this forum. Any advice you can offer will be greatly appreciated. Cheers

~Simon

[auris2008]

Hello all ... another new forum member here!

I'm the proud owner of a new 2008 metallic grey 1.6L (1ZR) MMT (~3500kms) down here in Santiago, Chile (so, yes, the MMT gearbox version is available outside of Europe). I'm Aussie, and find it quite curious that the equivalent Corolla hatch in Oz is not available in MMT ....

First of all, thanks for all the useful information I've been able to glean from the forum threads. I too initially struggled with the MMT idiosyncrasies, but it's growing on me as I learn to drive with it, and not against it. It would be good if Toyota did release a firmware mod to the ECU that lowers the speed that triggers a change down to 1st gear ... surely that couldn't too be hard.

However, I'm a bit concerned about the noisiness of the gear change down to a lower gear whilst pulling up to a stop. You can easily hear (from inside the car with the windows fully closed) a clunk as the gearbox changes down. In reality, even whilst stopped changing from neutral to reverse or E/M creates a loud clunk that turns heads. It sounds spring-loaded, and actually a bit scary.

I've not managed to find any mention of this phenomenon in any thread, so I'm wondering if I have an isolated case. Has anyone else out there experienced the clunkiness I'm talking about? I plan to have the local dealer take a good look at this, but from my experience so far with Toyota down here, I figure I can get more help in this forum. Any advice you can offer will be greatly appreciated. Cheers

~Simon

Congratulations to joint our "Mmt Owner" -

I am also a proud owner of a new 2008 auris 1.6 mmt black in luxury grade (sunroof)

You mention two points I have them also:

1. The fact that it going down to 1st in a speed too high ( 18 KM ) - this is my main complain and i did passed it to my dealer - but i got no answer till now.

2. About the sounds as the gearbox changes - don't forget it is a " manual gearbox" , but it will very wise to get a official answer from your's Toyota Dealer.

[SUPERSKIB]

Do you make a clunk or noise when you change gear manually with a manual box?

MMT is not a manual nor a simple auto; it is either a hybrid transmission or it is a dual mode auto/manual. Toyota can call it what they like but a box that changes gear without any input from the driver (ie in E mode) is an automatic – that's what the word means.

I don't make noises in my Auris DVD 130 manual transmission. Why should an automatic be less successful?

The MMT is a poorly developed piece of engineering. But Toyota will not admit it until they have solved the problem, just wait and see!

[Norwegian]

The MMT is a poorly developed piece of engineering. But Toyota will not admit it until they have solved the problem, just wait and see!

Im quite pleased with the MMT-box. Sure, its doesn't have that smooth gearchange as fully automatic has but its just the same as gearing in manual mode without pressing down the clutch. Some are pleased with it, some are not. It has its pro's and con's. Everything has that

[Dee Jay]

Do you make a clunk or noise when you change gear manually with a manual box?

MMT is not a manual nor a simple auto; it is either a hybrid transmission or it is a dual mode auto/manual. Toyota can call it what they like but a box that changes gear without any input from the driver (ie in E mode) is an automatic – that's what the word means.

I don't make noises in my Auris DVD 130 manual transmission. Why should an automatic be less successful?

The MMT is a poorly developed piece of engineering. But Toyota will not admit it until they have solved the problem, just wait and see!

MMT is a semi-automatic as it works in a different way to automatic gearboxes or CVT which use different technology. It does have an "e" setting in which the clutch and gear change are controlled by a computer which uses actuators to physically change gear and control the clutch.

I have a D4D Yaris with MMT and while I can feel the gearbox change down there certainly no "clunk"

As stating that "MMT is a poorly developed piece of engineering" I have to totally disagree, I love driving the Yaris with it, absolutely no complaints, it was easy to adapt to. I have owned other vehicles including automatics (Mercedes) and DSG (Volkswagen) and yes the MMT takes more getting used to, but hey it's less than half the price of the others.

[simon_d]

.........It would be good if Toyota did release a firmware mod to the ECU that lowers the speed that triggers a change down to 1st gear ... surely that couldn't too be hard.

However, I'm a bit concerned about the noisiness of the gear change down to a lower gear whilst pulling up to a stop. You can easily hear (from inside the car with the windows fully closed) a clunk as the gearbox changes down. In reality, even whilst stopped changing from neutral to reverse or E/M creates a loud clunk that turns heads. It sounds spring-loaded, and actually a bit scary.

I've not managed to find any mention of this phenomenon in any thread, so I'm wondering if I have an isolated case. Has anyone else out there experienced the clunkiness I'm talking about? I plan to have the local dealer take a good look at this, but from my experience so far with Toyota down here, I figure I can get more help in this forum. Any advice you can offer will be greatly appreciated. Cheers

~Simon

Hi

Glad to hear ur starting to enjoy ur mmt Auris! I got mine last week and im getting used to it too... I really like it, but the early change down to 1st does catch me out sometimes, for example when its in M and im slowing down at a junction, and then see that its clear to go, and im expecting it to be in 2nd, but instead its in 1st, and the revs are up in the stratosphere! The other time it catches me out is when its in Es, and I go onto a round-about and either it changes up halfway round , or changes down. I do agree with u that some re-programming could easily be done to stop the early change down to 1st. Apart from that I think its great!

On your second point, regarding the noisy gear change, I dont seem to have that problem... so I would advise that u get it checked out. When I change gear when stationary I can hear the gear engaging, but it is no louder than in any manual car I have owned... in fact the gear engagement in my MR2 is louder. When in motion I can barely hear the gear change.... and if the stereo is on the only clue is the rev counter moving. Maybe there is something amiss with the gear synchronization on ur car???

Hope u get things sorted to ur satisfaction and keep enjoying ur lovely new car!

Si

[auris2008]

Hi

Glad to hear ur starting to enjoy ur mmt Auris! I got mine last week and im getting used to it too... I really like it, but the early change down to 1st does catch me out sometimes, for example when its in M and im slowing down at a junction, and then see that its clear to go, and im expecting it to be in 2nd, but instead its in 1st, and the revs are up in the stratosphere! The other time it catches me out is when its in Es, and I go onto a round-about and either it changes up halfway round , or changes down. I do agree with u that some re-programming could easily be done to stop the early change down to 1st. Apart from that I think its great!

Hi

This is my point all the way from the begining.

We must start a serious pressure on Toyota-Europe headquarter to chance/modified the software in he MMT-gear to lower the speed it going down to the 1th gear. The present situation ( in 18 KM) make me crasy and i hate it.

Can u and the other mmt-owner in this forum send e-mail to Toyota-Europe to get their official respond why the mmt-software force down to 1th gear in too high speed (below 18 KM),

The e-mail adress is:

Ilaria Todesco

Customer Relations Specialist

Customer Relations Department

email : cust.service@toyota-europe.com

Please - we must do something

[MMT2007]

Hello all ... another new forum member here!

I'm the proud owner of a new 2008 metallic grey 1.6L (1ZR) MMT (~3500kms) down here in Santiago, Chile (so, yes, the MMT gearbox version is available outside of Europe). I'm Aussie, and find it quite curious that the equivalent Corolla hatch in Oz is not available in MMT ....

First of all, thanks for all the useful information I've been able to glean from the forum threads. I too initially struggled with the MMT idiosyncrasies, but it's growing on me as I learn to drive with it, and not against it. It would be good if Toyota did release a firmware mod to the ECU that lowers the speed that triggers a change down to 1st gear ... surely that couldn't too be hard.

However, I'm a bit concerned about the noisiness of the gear change down to a lower gear whilst pulling up to a stop. You can easily hear (from inside the car with the windows fully closed) a clunk as the gearbox changes down. In reality, even whilst stopped changing from neutral to reverse or E/M creates a loud clunk that turns heads. It sounds spring-loaded, and actually a bit scary.

I've not managed to find any mention of this phenomenon in any thread, so I'm wondering if I have an isolated case. Has anyone else out there experienced the clunkiness I'm talking about? I plan to have the local dealer take a good look at this, but from my experience so far with Toyota down here, I figure I can get more help in this forum. Any advice you can offer will be greatly appreciated. Cheers

~Simon

Hi Aussie

First of all, you don't have an isolated case. I also experience exactly the same, normally it sounds a little like if someone was reloading a shotgun. It is not fully reproducible except when turning in to the road leading to our apartment (going down quickly from 4th till 1st gear and turning sharp right), then it sounds more like if you are firing the shotgun (I have sensitive ears ;)) . I think and hope that everything is mechanically OK and that the Toyota engineers just have to work a little on their "audio design". Read some similar complaints in german forums, mostly then regarding the MMT in the Corolla Verso (which had a few problems when the system was new). If you find any more information or if you manage to get it fixed by a software update or a change in the gearbox or transmission fluid, please post it here...

/m

[AussieOverseas]

Hi all:

Thanks for all your replies ... there seems to be an interesting spread. Dee_Jay and simon_d don't experience a clunk but MMT2007 sounds similar to what I'm getting. For me, going up through the gears in M mode is fine, but going down under normal or even very light brakes is where the problem exists. E mode is the same.

Understanding how the MMT system works I would not be surprised if there was slightly more noise than a normal manual box when changing down, but in my case the sound is like what you hear if you are stationary and you slam a manual box from 1st to 2nd as hard as you can.

I'm a Toyota stalwart from way back (personal and work Landcruisers on various continents), and know Tojo build quality well enough to recognize that what I'm hearing is not normal. In my opinion, Toyota would not release an intrinsically flawed system. I too believe that the MMT type box is the way things will go in the future. I like driving mine very much, and hope I can get it sorted out.

Anyway, here is a happy snap, for those interested ...

I plan on getting the dealer to look over the problem, and I'll also organize a test drive of another MMT to compare. I'll post any answers I receive from the dealer.

Thanks again ... Cheers

S

[Phil0600]

Hello all ... another new forum member here!

I'm the proud owner of a new 2008 metallic grey 1.6L (1ZR) MMT (~3500kms) down here in Santiago, Chile (so, yes, the MMT gearbox version is available outside of Europe). I'm Aussie, and find it quite curious that the equivalent Corolla hatch in Oz is not available in MMT ....

First of all, thanks for all the useful information I've been able to glean from the forum threads. I too initially struggled with the MMT idiosyncrasies, but it's growing on me as I learn to drive with it, and not against it. It would be good if Toyota did release a firmware mod to the ECU that lowers the speed that triggers a change down to 1st gear ... surely that couldn't too be hard.

However, I'm a bit concerned about the noisiness of the gear change down to a lower gear whilst pulling up to a stop. You can easily hear (from inside the car with the windows fully closed) a clunk as the gearbox changes down. In reality, even whilst stopped changing from neutral to reverse or E/M creates a loud clunk that turns heads. It sounds spring-loaded, and actually a bit scary.

I've not managed to find any mention of this phenomenon in any thread, so I'm wondering if I have an isolated case. Has anyone else out there experienced the clunkiness I'm talking about? I plan to have the local dealer take a good look at this, but from my experience so far with Toyota down here, I figure I can get more help in this forum. Any advice you can offer will be greatly appreciated. Cheers

~Simon

[Phil0600]

Hello all ... another new forum member here!

I'm the proud owner of a new 2008 metallic grey 1.6L (1ZR) MMT (~3500kms) down here in Santiago, Chile (so, yes, the MMT gearbox version is available outside of Europe). I'm Aussie, and find it quite curious that the equivalent Corolla hatch in Oz is not available in MMT ....

First of all, thanks for all the useful information I've been able to glean from the forum threads. I too initially struggled with the MMT idiosyncrasies, but it's growing on me as I learn to drive with it, and not against it. It would be good if Toyota did release a firmware mod to the ECU that lowers the speed that triggers a change down to 1st gear ... surely that couldn't too be hard.

However, I'm a bit concerned about the noisiness of the gear change down to a lower gear whilst pulling up to a stop. You can easily hear (from inside the car with the windows fully closed) a clunk as the gearbox changes down. In reality, even whilst stopped changing from neutral to reverse or E/M creates a loud clunk that turns heads. It sounds spring-loaded, and actually a bit scary.

I've not managed to find any mention of this phenomenon in any thread, so I'm wondering if I have an isolated case. Has anyone else out there experienced the clunkiness I'm talking about? I plan to have the local dealer take a good look at this, but from my experience so far with Toyota down here, I figure I can get more help in this forum. Any advice you can offer will be greatly appreciated. Cheers

~Simon

Hi Simon

I've made quite a few negative posts here re MMT. My last one, however, was positive! I've finally got used to it & now fully appreciate the technology involved! I fully agree about the downchange to first gear - it would be great if an easy solution to that could be rolled out. I've always experienced a clunk when changing to reverse & have grown to find this a reassuring sign that 'reverse' is actually being engaged! I felt uncomfortable by the jerkiness/slight noise when braking to a stop in 'E' mode. Now, when I know I'm going to stop, I just move the gear shift into neutral (just like dipping the clutch on a manual). Hope this is helpful.

Phil

[Rose Mason]

Hello all ... another new forum member here!

I'm the proud owner of a new 2008 metallic grey 1.6L (1ZR) MMT (~3500kms) down here in Santiago, Chile (so, yes, the MMT gearbox version is available outside of Europe). I'm Aussie, and find it quite curious that the equivalent Corolla hatch in Oz is not available in MMT ....

First of all, thanks for all the useful information I've been able to glean from the forum threads. I too initially struggled with the MMT idiosyncrasies, but it's growing on me as I learn to drive with it, and not against it. It would be good if Toyota did release a firmware mod to the ECU that lowers the speed that triggers a change down to 1st gear ... surely that couldn't too be hard.

However, I'm a bit concerned about the noisiness of the gear change down to a lower gear whilst pulling up to a stop. You can easily hear (from inside the car with the windows fully closed) a clunk as the gearbox changes down. In reality, even whilst stopped changing from neutral to reverse or E/M creates a loud clunk that turns heads. It sounds spring-loaded, and actually a bit scary.

I've not managed to find any mention of this phenomenon in any thread, so I'm wondering if I have an isolated case. Has anyone else out there experienced the clunkiness I'm talking about? I plan to have the local dealer take a good look at this, but from my experience so far with Toyota down here, I figure I can get more help in this forum. Any advice you can offer will be greatly appreciated. Cheers

~Simon

Hi Simon

I've made quite a few negative posts here re MMT. My last one, however, was positive! I've finally got used to it & now fully appreciate the technology involved! I fully agree about the downchange to first gear - it would be great if an easy solution to that could be rolled out. I've always experienced a clunk when changing to reverse & have grown to find this a reassuring sign that 'reverse' is actually being engaged! I felt uncomfortable by the jerkiness/slight noise when braking to a stop in 'E' mode. Now, when I know I'm going to stop, I just move the gear shift into neutral (just like dipping the clutch on a manual). Hope this is helpful.

Phil