Celica 190 - Is This A Good Deal?

[GazChap]

I've decided that rather than try and fix my 140's engine (it's not in that bad shape at the moment but could get a lot worse) I'm just going to part-ex it in for another Celica. Preferably a 190, but not necessarily.

A Toyota dealer local to me has a 2003/52 T-Sport with 31,000 miles on the clock and all the trimmings for £9K. Is this a good deal? They'll give me £4K for the 140.

I'm going for a test drive on Saturday, hopefully it'll all be OK.

[Scarlett Arrow]

£9K is pretty much what I would expect a Toyota Dealer to be asking for that TS. They would have bought it for £7K-£7.5K so they have up to a £2K mark-up on it. A face lift TS is an excellent choice, hope Saturday goes well and it turns out to be a nice example.

[GazChap]

Cheers, if I take the plunge I'll get some pics up. Haven't actually got that many pics of my 140 now that I think about it.

I'm reluctant to buy from anything other than a Toyota dealer after the experience I've had with the 140. At least with a Toyota dealer I'm covered if anything goes !Removed! up.

I know the 190s don't suffer from the engine problem in the 140s, and the facelift shouldn't anyway, but are there any other things to look out for on the 190?

[gordypix]

I know the 190s don't suffer from the engine problem in the 140s, and the facelift shouldn't anyway, but are there any other things to look out for on the 190?

HIGH REPAIR COSTS...!

Make sure you get an extended warrenty...!!!

[GazChap]

HIGH REPAIR COSTS...!

Make sure you get an extended warrenty...!!!

Can you elaborate? What tends to go wrong with 'em and how common is it?

[gordypix]

HIGH REPAIR COSTS...!

Make sure you get an extended warrenty...!!!

Can you elaborate? What tends to go wrong with 'em and how common is it?

not saying things will go wrong...

but if they do you need a lot of £££ to cover repairs if you are not under warranty.

[GazChap]

That's why I'm getting this from a proper Toyota dealer, I figure there'll be at least a 12 month warranty on it but I'll ask the question.

What makes the 190 so costly to repair compared to the 140?

[GazChap]

Well, I went to the dealership this morning to look at it. 40 mile trip (80 miles round trip).

Got there, spent about 15 minutes waiting for the right guy to come and deal with me. Spent another 30 minutes whilst he filled in my details on their computer and took my Celica out for a quick drive to ascertain it's part ex. value.

Turns out they'll only give me £3,500 for it in part ex, not £4,000. Disappointing, but not a train wreck.

He gives me some figures for finance etc. and then goes to get the keys. After 10 minutes, I find it a bit odd that he's not back so start to worry that it's been sold. The Sales Manager then comes out and says that the car was damaged in a vandalism attack on Thursday night - they threw a brick at the window and it smashed the windscreen and damaged the bonnet.

He explained my options - I could walk away, I could put down a deposit on the car and they'd bring the car to me to look at it, or I could carry on and agree to buy it.

I asked if the deposit would be refundable and incredibly he said no! "So you want me to put down a non-refundable deposit on a car that I've not seen?". In the end he relented and I put £200 down on it. Being a Toyota dealership I would think the repair job would be top-notch so I'm not too worried about that.

All in all, it's a bit annoying really. I took 4 hours out of my day and have pretty much nothing to show for it. I'm not impressed.

[Calisto]

"Being a Toyota dealership I would think the repair job would be top-notch so I'm not too worried about that."

This is not always the case.....just because they are a dealership does not mean top-notch. Just be wary and keep an open mind. After all they are wanting to make money.

[GazChap]

Oh, you can bet your ***** I'll be examining that car under a !Removed! microscope when they eventually bring it around. I almost want to say "no" just to screw them over for wasting my time this morning!

Incredibly, he said that someone else had an appointment to view the Celica this afternoon. When I asked if they'd rung them to tell them it wasn't here, he said he didn't know, went to find out and said that they had, but they were going to come anyway.

So I asked where they were from.

"Leicester".

Yeah, right. Like anyone is going to travel 60-miles one way to talk about a car that they can't see.

[gordypix]

So, have you seen the car you are buying at all? Have you driven it?

[GazChap]

So, have you seen the car you are buying at all? Have you driven it?

No to both questions. Like I said, the dealership is going to bring it to me once it's repaired. Which is just as well, because I'm not making another trip down there.

In all honesty, they're going to have to have done a !Removed! good job with the car to get me to go ahead with the purchase now. After them wasting my time this morning, I'm not in the mood for more time wasting. If that car is anything less than perfect when it turns up, they'll be turned away again straight away.

//edit: I've seen four pictures of the car (from every exterior angle) on the AutoTrader advert though. So I know it exists ;) And the story about the vandal has to be true, there was a Lexus at the dealership next door (shares a fenceline with the Toyota dealership) that had a MASSIVE dent in one of the doors.

[gordypix]

So, have you seen the car you are buying at all? Have you driven it?

No to both questions. Like I said, the dealership is going to bring it to me once it's repaired. Which is just as well, because I'm not making another trip down there.

In all honesty, they're going to have to have done a !Removed! good job with the car to get me to go ahead with the purchase now. After them wasting my time this morning, I'm not in the mood for more time wasting. If that car is anything less than perfect when it turns up, they'll be turned away again straight away.

//edit: I've seen four pictures of the car (from every exterior angle) on the AutoTrader advert though. So I know it exists ;) And the story about the vandal has to be true, there was a Lexus at the dealership next door (shares a fenceline with the Toyota dealership) that had a MASSIVE dent in one of the doors.

So you have put a deposit down have you?

And if so is it refundable if you then don't want the car?

[GazChap]

Yeah, I've put a deposit of £200 down. And I got a written notice saying that it would be 100% refundable if I don't want the car.

As long as the repair job is done to a good standard (and when I say good, I mean perfect - if there is ANYTHING wrong with the car then it's going straight back) I think it's a good deal - 2002/53 T-Sport with 31K on the clock and 12 month warranty.

I'm just about prepared to forgive the dealership for not calling me to tell me not to bother going, but if they put one more foot wrong the deal's off.

[gordypix]

Yeah, I've put a deposit of £200 down. And I got a written notice saying that it would be 100% refundable if I don't want the car.

As long as the repair job is done to a good standard (and when I say good, I mean perfect - if there is ANYTHING wrong with the car then it's going straight back) I think it's a good deal - 2002/53 T-Sport with 31K on the clock and 12 month warranty.

I'm just about prepared to forgive the dealership for not calling me to tell me not to bother going, but if they put one more foot wrong the deal's off.

Hmm, Still think you need time to look over the car and haggle the deal a bit better.

For example...

Look for paint chips and scratches which you should ask for them to touch-up.

Check the alloys and tires - haggle for replacement tires and refurbished or new alloys if they are damaged.

Original Toyota alloys are poor quality in comparison to others alloys on the market and the price you pay Toyota for them is steep. And this is what I have been told by Toyota Delaers themselves...! Plenty of owners can back it up aswell.

Toyota Alloys are prone to flaking and they will replace them while the car is under warrenty but asz yours is past the normal Toyota warranty you need to haggle if you are not happy with the wheels.

Ah, and ask them for a set of Car mats - they almost NEVER supply these in a car...!

[GazChap]

Oh yeah, I'm gonna look over the car properly and use my findings to try and negotiate, no problems there.

I'll check the wheels and ask them for car mats ;) One of the alloys on my 140 is flaking but the others are all fine for now, so hopefully they won't be too bad.

[GazChap]

The dealer's bringing the car over to me tonight at 5.45 for me to look at, will let you all know how it goes :)

[GazChap]

Decided to go for it! Everything's peachy, the wheels were fine (a slight bit of scuffing, but it's -very- slight and not noticeable to anything except the most stringent of examinations) and there's a full set of car mats already in the car that are practically brand new.

Result.

The thunder grey/silver colour is also a lot nicer in person than it is in the pictures I saw. Will get some photos up once I pick it up, probably around Sunday.

[Scarlett Arrow]

Excellent!, I'll look forward to the pics. :)

[gordypix]

When is it due the next service - are they gonna service it NOW for FREE?

Gotta blag some Freebies from them as you are about to load their bank account...!

[GazChap]

It's literally just had it's 30K service.

I'm tempted to threaten to pull out of the deal, I've just had a phone call from them to say that I need to pick up the car at 8.30am on Saturday morning as "Saturdays and Sundays are our busiest times so we can't do the handover at any other point during the day".

I can't get there for 8.30.

I asked how long it would take and they just said "about 20 minutes", but they're refusing to take 20 minutes out of their day to actually deal with me later on in the afternoon - despite the fact that I'm about to give them £5,500.

I hope my local Toyota dealer isn't going to be this ubiky, I'm not sure I'd like to take it to them to use the warranty if they are!

[gordypix]

Politely but FIRMLY remind them that you are their client and as such they have to make allowances for you and expecting you to get up early on a saturday morning is unreasonable.

If they are serious about client relations then you will be able to make an appointment to suit you later in the day and they should honour it...!

You are helping them to be BUSY and to make them money to keep their business afloat so they should not treat you as if you are causing them inconvenience...!!!

[GazChap]

Tried that. I even went so far as to speak to the Sales Manager who wouldn't budge.

I asked why I could make an appointment to come and look at a car at any time on a Saturday but not to actually !Removed! buy one. He came up with some nonsense about it being industry standard practice for dealerships to not do deliveries/handovers on a Saturday except in the early morning and late afternoon.

I think it's poppycock, but as I like the car I'm just going to go ahead with it (and make them bring the car to me, probably) and then write a very strongly worded letter to Toyota Customer Relations, because I'm far from impressed.

My local Toyota dealership is a lot smaller so presumably won't have these silly policies.

[iceland_potter]

I would be fuming if I were you mate. You're buying a fast car which is arguably more unpopular than ever at the moment in the current climate, they should be bending over backwards to suit whatever YOU want.

Just to give my 2p worth on the price as well, I'd honestly try to get a load more off, cars are really not selling at the moment which puts you truly in the driving seat - no pun intended.

[gordypix]

Tried that. I even went so far as to speak to the Sales Manager who wouldn't budge.

I asked why I could make an appointment to come and look at a car at any time on a Saturday but not to actually !Removed! buy one. He came up with some nonsense about it being industry standard practice for dealerships to not do deliveries/handovers on a Saturday except in the early morning and late afternoon.

I think it's poppycock, but as I like the car I'm just going to go ahead with it (and make them bring the car to me, probably) and then write a very strongly worded letter to Toyota Customer Relations, because I'm far from impressed.

My local Toyota dealership is a lot smaller so presumably won't have these silly policies.

Is this actually a TOYOTA Delaer you are getting it from...?

If so then tell them you are disturbed by their practices...!

The Sales Manager sounds like a PLONKER...! (insert stronger word if necessary)