Need New Engine - Trading Standards

[malpass]

OK I brought a celica 2000 reg from a garage 8 weeks ago and it had a service and MOT the day before buying it.

8 Weeks in and the engine started tapping last night; checks the oil and there isn't even a drop on the dip stick!

Filled it up but too late engine has been run dry and needs replacing. Basically my argument is they must have sold the car with little or no oil in and as they had to have the air mass flow meter fitted at the same time I think they lost some oil and never topped it up.

I have rang trading standards and informed them of the details and said how can a full4-5 ltrs of oil disappear from an engine within 8 weeks when there are no leaks and the exhaust isn't blowing? There is nowhere for the oil to go so it must not have been there. They say I have a strong case yet my problem is this could take months to go through and in the mean time I have no car and cannot even pay for repair as I will not be able to claim it back, so the car is going to be sitting there losing value doing nothing!

Have any of you got any suggestions or input regarding this? Also, yes I know I should of checked the oil but after only 8 weeks of it apparently having new oil I didn't give it that much thought, also the oil light never came on so i'm guessing that is buggered too!

[jamesholden]

It's probably not the garages fault but the engine itself. The 1.8 VVTi has well documented oil burning issues, mostly in the Corolla and Avensis but the higher tuned versions in the Celica and MR2 have also been known to suffer from it. Not sure if Toyota would replace the engine at 8 years old, I think there only covering them upto 6 with this fault although someone else will be able to clarify that on here.

As regards the oil light that isn't a direct indication of low oil as it refers to oil pressure rather than actual quantity.

[Scarlett Arrow]

Sorry to hear that you've found out about the very well documented Piston Ring issue with the VVTi Engine. Toyota have been paying for new Short Blocks to be fitted up to 7 year old examples even if they don't have full TSH. Even if the Oil PRESSURE Warning light did come on, by then it's too late and the damage has been done. It's very likely the previous owner was aware of excessive Oil consumption and this was the reason they sold the Car.

Hope it gets resolved to your satisfaction by the supplying Dealer, personally I wouldn't admit to not checking the Oil level though as they will play the negligence card.

[malpass]

I see; well that still seems far too excessive of an oil burning issue for 8 weeks. I owned an RX8 prior to this that burns mad amounts of oil (probably the most of any car in existence :P) and that didn't burn 3-4 litres in 8 weeks.

On top of that there was no blowing from the exhaust so it couldn't of been burning oil else I would have noticed, no?

[cabcurtains]

This issue is different to the RX8, that car uses oil and its regarded as a quirk, so if its run dry Mazda wont help at all. This VVTI issue is acknowledged as a design fault, thats why Toyota have been paying to replace engines as opposed to trying to get out of it as is the normal situation. With modern oils being so thin, the chances of actually seeing it burn off are very small, the engine is burning the oil off but its not thick enough to see the clouds of smoke that you would expect.

Contact Toyota UK and explain the issue, they may help you out. If the garage you bought the car from is outside the Toyota network the chances are they wouldn't be aware of the piston ring issue. Its very unlikely the garage put the wrong amount of oil in the car as the issue is the same one that Toyota have acknowledged. If you pursue this with Trading Standards don't be surprised if the Piston Ring issue comes out in the wash, this will most likely remove any liability from the garage.

As mentioned, if you mention you haven't check the oil then liability will shift to you, as the manual probably states checking oil frequently.

[martin_longbow]

I am sorry to hear that mate but I dont think you are gonna have much luck with them, the driver of any vehicle is responsible for cheking oil and water. It would not be unreasonable for them to rely on that.

[T V O R]

All they have to do is quote the Highway Code...

Check the fluid levels in your vehicle at least weekly (Law CUR reg 27)

As you have had 8 opportunities to do this and decided not to for what ever reason, I think you will be more than lucky to claim anything. As it was serviced the day before you bought it (new oil and filter) it left the garage fit for the purpose.

Buyer beware.

[Black Knight]

Filled it up but too late engine has been run dry and needs replacing. Basically my argument is they must have sold the car with little or no oil in and as they had to have the air mass flow meter fitted at the same time I think they lost some oil and never topped it up.

Just for info they wouldn't touch anything that would cause oil loss from the engine just to change the air flow meter

[Baileys cream]

Sorry to hear someone else has been hit with this one!

I had the same thing spoke to Toyota and anyone else that would listen to no end. As mentioned before Toyota will help out if the car falls in the 7 years or 100k (which ever first) other wise they wont budge. They have however changed the parameters a couple of times (in the last 7 years or so) so ya never know they might do again but by that time we'll have all spent £££££££££££££'s! Ha ha.

Good luck.

[Leeky]

All they have to do is quote the Highway Code...

Check the fluid levels in your vehicle at least weekly (Law CUR reg 27)

Totally, was thinking the exact same thing.

I would try and claim off the Garage/Toyota (got nothing to loose) but to be honest i think its just one of those things :( Best start saving for a new engine me thinks.

Whenever i buy a car the first thing i do when i get it home is an oil and filter change - even if the garage has done it as i dont trust anyone.

But best of luck in getting it fixed

[silverarrow]

you are covered all cars have a warranty in that any fault is treated as being present within 6 months go back and reject the car and speak to stoke trading standards.

Also name and shame the dealer.

[MickD1970]

OK I brought a celica 2000 reg from a garage 8 weeks ago and it had a service and MOT the day before buying it.

8 Weeks in and the engine started tapping last night; checks the oil and there isn't even a drop on the dip stick!

Filled it up but too late engine has been run dry and needs replacing. Basically my argument is they must have sold the car with little or no oil in and as they had to have the air mass flow meter fitted at the same time I think they lost some oil and never topped it up.

I have rang trading standards and informed them of the details and said how can a full4-5 ltrs of oil disappear from an engine within 8 weeks when there are no leaks and the exhaust isn't blowing? There is nowhere for the oil to go so it must not have been there. They say I have a strong case yet my problem is this could take months to go through and in the mean time I have no car and cannot even pay for repair as I will not be able to claim it back, so the car is going to be sitting there losing value doing nothing!

Have any of you got any suggestions or input regarding this? Also, yes I know I should of checked the oil but after only 8 weeks of it apparently having new oil I didn't give it that much thought, also the oil light never came on so i'm guessing that is buggered too!

I have a 2001 celica, last November the engine spat the conrods through the casing.

I had a service 2 months before (not buy Toyota) and i checked the levels myself and they were topped up.

After going to Liverpool airport i heard a tapping noise, i got to the nearest service station and checked the oil NOT A DROP then its too late! i filled it up but the engine died about 20 miles later.

I phoned Marcrofts(Toyota garage) and they were aware of this problem but because i didnt have Toyota service history they didnt want to know!

I ended up paying £1300 for a recon engine to be fitted!!now i have a oil leak and i dont know where its coming from?