Newbie With An Opinion

[ellington]

Hi to all on the site. I've been registered for a while and have found the technical input excellent.

I've got a 2001 5 door GX Auto 2ltr petrol which I've had for nearly three years and it is simply EXCELLENT!

Over the years I have had all makes of cars including Mercs, BMW's, Fords, Vauxhalls, Fiats, Volvos you name it and I've had one.

I still have a BMW convertible for the sunny days but from the first day of owning the RAV I was really impressed. It does every thing without fuss, drives well, handles well, bit thrashy when you floor it but the torqe range seems phenominal for a two litre petrol engine.

The build quality is superior to any other of the cars I mentioned. The boot is sensibly plastic lined to cope with wet muddy dogs and the like. Why oh why do most manufacturers put carpet in the boot?? and the rear floor access is the best around for dogs to be able to get themselves in.

I love our RAV4 and hope to keep it till the end. It had only done 24k miles when we bought it nearly three years ago and has only done 42k miles now.

I've got a slight niggle formed with it now but will raise it under the ASK A MECHANIC forum.

Well done Toyota.

[chatman]

Welcome aboard ellington.....

Glad your enjoying the RAV so much.....

Why not post your query on here...maybe we can help you on that as well, and keep it totally TOYOTA for you......

[ellington]

Welcome aboard ellington.....

Glad your enjoying the RAV so much.....

Why not post your query on here...maybe we can help you on that as well, and keep it totally TOYOTA for you......

OK thanks.

The Rav has developed a strange noise when it gets over 40mph and I think it's coming from the nearside rear wheel area or possibly the rear axle but its very hard to pin it down. I'm afraid I can't think of a name for the noise but it's not a screech or a knocking or a rumble.

The noise is what I would expect from something out of balance like a bent shaft but there is no vibration and everything functions properly.

I've had the garage visually check for signs of wear or damage and they came up blank. They replaced all the oils at the same time as their visual inspection but the noise is still there. I've travelled in the back seat to try and identify where it's coming from and feel it's the rear nearside ish.

I've searched through the last 100 pages of this forum to see if someone has had a similar experience that I could learn from but to no avail.

This weekend I'm gonna get the wheels balanced as they haven't been done for a while and when they are off have a look to see if the brakes etc are ok but I'm not really sure what I'm looking for.

The Rav only does about 6k miles a year and never goes off road so I don't think it has been knocked and damaged. I'm hoping it's not a diff or axle problem developing. Are there any UJ's or bearings that can/ have been known to wear or the bearings dry out?

Sorry it's so vague but any advice would we welcomed.

[bothwell_buyer]

Well - do I guess yer first names Duke??

Welcome to the forii here where everyone but me is a nutter.

Yer noise.......

funny one - theres a wee handfu of us who have suffered from weird noises from the back nearside - and its seems to be coming from the car rather than any passengers.

From my experience - and I'm pushing thru well more than 200bhp on both my RAvs - there is a problem of sorts with the nearside rear. Why I don't really know.

I've read thru the stuff on rav4wrld and its helpful - as it indicates that there is a wider issue.

Anyway, we identified one problem with RAV number 2 and it was that the rear nearside hub nut needed tightened to the 149lbsft torque. Since then its seems better but its only been on the road for 200 miles since a complete engine swap etc. We should be checking this torque on rav number 1 this week.

number 1 RAV has bigger problems with the rear end....and I'm waiting for polybushes coming from the states so we can re-build the rear suspension. We already stiffened up the rear diff mount - but that causes a clunk if its worn.

We aim to replace all the rear suspension bushes to eliminate the weird sounds that come from there.

One thing we did have to do was to replace the central prop bearing - costly but it was part-seized and caused vibration.

Another thing I've found is a vibration contact between the exhaust and the rear underside bodywork which happens at certain speeds/acceleration but as I'm using a custom built exhaust then its difficult to generalise. The exhaust pipe is pretty close to the rear bodywork and again if the rubber mounts are worn then that could be a source.,

generally, I found the suspension bushes last about 80k miles before they need replaced. 7 years might result in rubber degradation.....

So - theres a handfu of things you can check......

[Dippy]

Can I add that on my 4.2 diesel I had a speed-related knocking, clear at about 30mph (once a second?) up to ?55 (rapid) after which it would just become a continuous noise. Car was 2003, I went to Toyota who heard it, looked at it and found nothing, told me not to worry - that was 3 yrs ago. It's just been taken away yesterday by a dealer who's given me an MX5 in exchange (impossible to sell in this financial climate) so I'm hoping that's the last I hear of it. Still interested to follow though.

[anchorman]

The most common noise from the back of a 4.2 is from the rear calipers. They become worn and allow the pads to rattle in time with wheel rotation. If you ease your foot on the brake when it is doing it and it stops then that is your answer. You are right to have the tyres checked in any case.

A link to curing the problem is at the top of the RAV4 page.

[ellington]

The most common noise from the back of a 4.2 is from the rear calipers. They become worn and allow the pads to rattle in time with wheel rotation. If you ease your foot on the brake when it is doing it and it stops then that is your answer. You are right to have the tyres checked in any case.

A link to curing the problem is at the top of the RAV4 page.

Many thanks for the suggestions. I guess this weekend I better start with the wheel balance and then start checking the brakes, hub etc.

[ellington]

The most common noise from the back of a 4.2 is from the rear calipers. They become worn and allow the pads to rattle in time with wheel rotation. If you ease your foot on the brake when it is doing it and it stops then that is your answer. You are right to have the tyres checked in any case.

A link to curing the problem is at the top of the RAV4 page.

Many thanks for the suggestions. I guess this weekend I better start with the wheel balance and then start checking the brakes, hub etc.

Well I've had the wheels off and had them balanced. Checked the tyres are in shape and all have good equal tread. Wobbled the wheels while jacked up to see if there is any play in the wheel bearings and found non. Braked look in good order, function well and applied thyem while travelling to see if the noise alters and it doesn't. Ditto handbrake. So it rather points towards a cv joint or something in the drive chain I guess. Could be a dry wheel bearing perhaps?

Going to the main dealer tomorrow and taking a mechanic on a road test to see if he can identify the noise.

Will let you know the outcome.

Any other ideas or suggestions always welcome.

[anchorman]

I think somebody once commented that a duff UJ caused a similar problem.

[bothwell_buyer]

Ye - should have mentioned that it could be a duff rear CV joint - not that common but I'm starting to see more posts elsewhere on this.

[ellington]

Ye - should have mentioned that it could be a duff rear CV joint - not that common but I'm starting to see more posts elsewhere on this.

Well got to the main dealer today and before we road tested it the mechanic said he would put money on the tyres being "out of shape" he ran his hand over each tyre and in each direction and showed me how your hand ran smootly over the tread in one direction but not the other.

Took it out on the road test and he said his mind was certain that was the problem and that they have had the problem a lot on the Avensis's but not on the Rav.

I would need to replace the tyres to find out. Great! the tyres have at least 6mm on them and are only two and a half years old.

Also got the tracking checked by the way and it's spot on.

I went back to the tyre fitters and asked them if they agree that the tyres were out of shape and they said yes but not enough to worry about?

The Toyota mechanic was sure that the problem was not with the drive chain or wheels but that view was without any close inspection or jacking up of the car.

Dunno where to go from here now.

Any suggestions anyone?

[Davrav]

Are there any members near to you with a similar model/wheel and tyre size who would be prepared to swop wheels for a short time? You would then know if the tyres are really the problem.

Any RAV owners out there who can help the man out?

[dave.m]

Ye - should have mentioned that it could be a duff rear CV joint - not that common but I'm starting to see more posts elsewhere on this.

Well got to the main dealer today and before we road tested it the mechanic said he would put money on the tyres being "out of shape" he ran his hand over each tyre and in each direction and showed me how your hand ran smootly over the tread in one direction but not the other.

Took it out on the road test and he said his mind was certain that was the problem and that they have had the problem a lot on the Avensis's but not on the Rav.

I would need to replace the tyres to find out. Great! the tyres have at least 6mm on them and are only two and a half years old.

Also got the tracking checked by the way and it's spot on.

I went back to the tyre fitters and asked them if they agree that the tyres were out of shape and they said yes but not enough to worry about?

The Toyota mechanic was sure that the problem was not with the drive chain or wheels but that view was without any close inspection or jacking up of the car.

Dunno where to go from here now.

Any suggestions anyone?

If your tyres are mis-shaped, I would be looking for the reason why. This is Freelander syndrome, tyres going mis-shaped due to problems with

either the Intermediate Reduction Drive (LR version on transfer box) or the viscous coupling which sits on the rear propshaft. When the front

wheels start spinning, this sends drive to the rear, when it ceases up, which happens on a lot of Freelanders, it means all four wheels are driving.

This causes transmision wind up and every time you go round a corner the car bounces slightly causing the tyres to mis-shape. The simple check

for this is to try and reverse your car up a slight slope while turning the wheel full lock, if you feel resistance there is a problem. Why this would

happen on a Rav ? Dont know but certainly warrants further investigation.

[bothwell_buyer]

Theres a diff lock switch/button on 4.1s I know - and the drivetrain looks pretty similar between 4.1s and 4.2s. This cars an auto, and a 4.2 - so is there a diff lock facility??

Like dave, I think there must be a reason for the tyre wear - although would some tyre wear not be normal if tyres are kept running the same direction?

I still wonder about the rear outer cv joint which also has the rear wheel bearing.

Is it all tyres that have the same wear pattern? Or just 1?

[ellington]

Theres a diff lock switch/button on 4.1s I know - and the drivetrain looks pretty similar between 4.1s and 4.2s. This cars an auto, and a 4.2 - so is there a diff lock facility??

Like dave, I think there must be a reason for the tyre wear - although would some tyre wear not be normal if tyres are kept running the same direction?

I still wonder about the rear outer cv joint which also has the rear wheel bearing.

Is it all tyres that have the same wear pattern? Or just 1?

They all have some degree of wear and to a pretty similar extent.

[bothwell_buyer]

Theres a diff lock switch/button on 4.1s I know - and the drivetrain looks pretty similar between 4.1s and 4.2s. This cars an auto, and a 4.2 - so is there a diff lock facility??

Like dave, I think there must be a reason for the tyre wear - although would some tyre wear not be normal if tyres are kept running the same direction?

I still wonder about the rear outer cv joint which also has the rear wheel bearing.

Is it all tyres that have the same wear pattern? Or just 1?

They all have some degree of wear and to a pretty similar extent.

OK

I'd guess that its normal wear, once the possibility of the diff lock being on permanently is discounted (again thats if the diff lock exists on this model....someone tell me it does??) One avenue might be to source an automatic transmission specialist and ask them for an opinion.

From my own experience of my two, I still think it might be related to the rear nearside driveshaft/CV/wheel bearing assembly. We've found from the setup of the suspension that the whole lot works together and its difficult to pinpoint the source of a noise. Number 1 RAV is (still) waiting for the arrfival of polybushes to allow us to take the rear end apart and rebuild.

[ellington]

Theres a diff lock switch/button on 4.1s I know - and the drivetrain looks pretty similar between 4.1s and 4.2s. This cars an auto, and a 4.2 - so is there a diff lock facility??

Like dave, I think there must be a reason for the tyre wear - although would some tyre wear not be normal if tyres are kept running the same direction?

I still wonder about the rear outer cv joint which also has the rear wheel bearing.

Is it all tyres that have the same wear pattern? Or just 1?

They all have some degree of wear and to a pretty similar extent.

OK

I'd guess that its normal wear, once the possibility of the diff lock being on permanently is discounted (again thats if the diff lock exists on this model....someone tell me it does??) One avenue might be to source an automatic transmission specialist and ask them for an opinion.

From my own experience of my two, I still think it might be related to the rear nearside driveshaft/CV/wheel bearing assembly. We've found from the setup of the suspension that the whole lot works together and its difficult to pinpoint the source of a noise. Number 1 RAV is (still) waiting for the arrfival of polybushes to allow us to take the rear end apart and rebuild.

well after another few days of driving I don't think it is the tyres. I think it is something in the cv/bearing department so I'm gonna have to get it on a ramp somewhere with the wheels dangling so they can be turned etc.

[ellington]

Theres a diff lock switch/button on 4.1s I know - and the drivetrain looks pretty similar between 4.1s and 4.2s. This cars an auto, and a 4.2 - so is there a diff lock facility??

Like dave, I think there must be a reason for the tyre wear - although would some tyre wear not be normal if tyres are kept running the same direction?

I still wonder about the rear outer cv joint which also has the rear wheel bearing.

Is it all tyres that have the same wear pattern? Or just 1?

They all have some degree of wear and to a pretty similar extent.

OK

I'd guess that its normal wear, once the possibility of the diff lock being on permanently is discounted (again thats if the diff lock exists on this model....someone tell me it does??) One avenue might be to source an automatic transmission specialist and ask them for an opinion.

From my own experience of my two, I still think it might be related to the rear nearside driveshaft/CV/wheel bearing assembly. We've found from the setup of the suspension that the whole lot works together and its difficult to pinpoint the source of a noise. Number 1 RAV is (still) waiting for the arrfival of polybushes to allow us to take the rear end apart and rebuild.

well after another few days of driving I don't think it is the tyres. I think it is something in the cv/bearing department so I'm gonna have to get it on a ramp somewhere with the wheels dangling so they can be turned etc.

Well I still haven't got to the bottom of the noise and its getting louder.

It's definately at the rear end and I've swapped the wheels over but to no effect.

I've had an Indie road test it and look underneath and he also says it's tyres?

I've had a good look underneath and there's no evidence of any wear such as oil or fluid leaks etc.

So even though I'm not convinced its a tyre a problem and I still have 5mm of tread on all of the tyres I'm only gonna find out one way so I'm gonna buy some new rears in the next couple of weeks.

I don't want to be right. I want the garages to be right but I'm just not convinced. Watch this space. Either I will be ****** of for buying two new tyres and still having the problem or having to dispose of two perfectly legal tyres that are just too annoying.

[Dippy]

You'll be even more annoyed if it wears into those new tyres after a few thousand miles and you have to junk them too.

[anchorman]

Tyres can make some really strange noises but you can keep the old ones until you have checked the results. It is usually the result of a separation where some previous impact has ruptured the reinforcing braces or the wheel being out of balance and the oscillating has caused slight egg shaped wear. This is not uncommon on the back as it is less noticeable if it can't be picked up like steering wobble.

You've got to start somewhere so replacing the tyres is a kind of investment towards the future!

[local hero]

Prior to buying 2 un needed tyres could you not borrow someones spare +your own and see if the noise goes away, the same size wheel tyre combo from a lexus/honda will fit "i believe"

[ellington]

Tyres can make some really strange noises but you can keep the old ones until you have checked the results. It is usually the result of a separation where some previous impact has ruptured the reinforcing braces or the wheel being out of balance and the oscillating has caused slight egg shaped wear. This is not uncommon on the back as it is less noticeable if it can't be picked up like steering wobble.

You've got to start somewhere so replacing the tyres is a kind of investment towards the future!

Well that's sort of what I figured. As I said in my opening post I am well impressed with the Rav and it does everything we ask of it without fuss. This noise problem has just taken the shine off of it a little because it was so quiet and smooth before. I really am hoping that the garages are right and would settle for throwing away a few mm of tread to sort it.

I'll let you know in due course.

Thanks for your contributions.

[ellington]

Well I got there in the end.

I managed to persuade Listers Of Lincoln the main Toyota agent to take a look.

Their service forman took a long drive with me and he wasn't convinced it was the tyres.

He thought it might be a wheel bearing on the way out but wasn't sure.

He agreed to have the car into workshop for a day and inspect every cv joint, bearing the lot.

He said he would disconnect the drive shafts so that the wheel bearings could be checked with totally free wheels and he would also check all the oils/oil levels etc. In other words a very thorough check over.

He rang me shortly after lunch and said he has some good news and some bad news. Gulp!! :( :(

The good news was that he had found nothing wrong with anything in the drive train or wheel bearings. :)

The bad news was that it WAS THE TYRES!!!! :o

When I collected the Rav there was NO CHARGE!! How about that! Well done Paul at Listers Toyota at Lincoln!!!!!!!!! :D :D

His advice was to live with the noise for a little longer to get some more miles out of the tyres.

Well I couldn't so today I bought four new Toyo Open Country tyres and had the tracking re checked / set.

Guess what?

It WAS the tyres :D :D

The Rav is back to her good ole ways, quiet and smooth.

I'm happy to have the problem solved and I guess I should show more faith in those first two garages I tried.