Oxygen Sensors - Gobsmacked!

[webmills]

Hi All, I would welcome some advice.

I have a RAV4 2.0 GX 2003 with an engine light that has just come on.

Took it to Toyota main dealer and they originally wanted £260 to replace an oxygen sensor (not certain which one).

They then couldn't get the sensor out and have now suggested that I will need a new catalytic converter and up to four new sensors, cost ranging from £850 (for one sensor) up to £1450 (for all four sensors).

They then offered me £2000 part exchange for the car (£2000 less than Parkers part exchange price), less £400 for the cost of the parts that they would require to fix it. Which suggests that they are making £1000 on the labour alone!

In these credit-crisis times I simply cannot afford their prices and feel that I am being overcharged.

My friendly local mechanic reckons that a bit of heat applied in the right place will loosen the oxygen sensor although he is worried that he will not be able to determine which one is showing the fault. The last time he phoned Toyota to ask which oxygen sensor the code implied, they wanted to charge him £80 for the information.

Am I correct in thinking that with the right bit of kit U480 OBD 2 SCANNER CODE READER OBD2 (#200303166387) on eBay, that I'll be able to see the fault code and you knowledgeable souls will be able to tell me which sensor this points to?

Also, would anyone be able to suggest whether this solution might work and if not, a cheaper repair option.

Thanks for your replies.

[bothwell_buyer]

OMG !! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Wot a crazy outfit you've found!! £2000 for a 2003 RAV :censor: :censor: :censor:

Bomb the bstdis !!!

One of the technocrats here will come along and reassure you on the OBD bit. In the meantime, your RAV is worth way more than that!

Course if its a 3 door, I'd happily gie ye twa grand fur it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The trick to these problems is use a Jap specialist who does engine tuning and knows their stuff - some 'dealers' just are not clued up enuf. Did you pay them money to diagnose the fault? If so, then my next contact would be with trading standards. If not then just get a specialist to check it out....its not that difficult with the right stuff.

[stevepen]

Never seen so expensive prices before !

The sensors are about £65 ea from justlambada and you can get a proper 22mm split socket from most tool outlets to get it out yourself. The code readers are really easy to use and will give you number like Pxxxx just enter it into http://www.eobd2.eu/DTCL.asp and that will give you which sensor is faulty.

I'm not mechanically minded but managed to change mine in about 15 mins.

[webmills]

Thanks for all your advice.

[bitman]

i have that u480 code reader and located in crawley west sussex. your more then welcome to use it. and if you have the code there are web sites who give you the correct info witch bank etc.

i had some thing similar with those £$%^. i had the code for them but they still wanted £96 for diagnostics! and guess what my info was correct.

think of leaving those greedy mr t £$%^ and gone do the things my self. don't care about FSH.

[Calisto]

I recently bought my Lambda from Justlambda.....cost me £54.

http://www.lambdasensor.com/main/mr2.htm

Rav 4 lambda's are at the bottom of that link.

[Parts-King]

Stevepen: The sensors are about £65 ea from justlambada

I did the just Lambada at a dance school last week, I have the rrr's for it :D:

Kingo

[Bodgit-fixit-run]

Do it yourself. They are extracting the urine.

[anchorman]

Stevepen: The sensors are about £65 ea from justlambada

I did the just Lambada at a dance school last week, I have the rrr's for it :D:

Kingo

What with you and John Sergeant :D

[cfc1]

If you can't findanyone near you to read the code then buy yourelf one.. I don't know about the one in your link but I have one of these.. Ebay clicky this reads the code and will tell you which sensor it is.. eg, P0171 Bank 1 sensor 1 too lean will appear on the LCD display.

[dromdrom]

i had had exactly same thing with my RAV4, but my mechanic told me that it's not necessary to replace sensors at all. The indicator 'engine management' lights up when I drive on a motorway due to smaller petrol consumption. If I don't drive on a motorway, the light dissapears. Apparently, faulty sensor saves petrol and does not harm the engine at all. I have been driving like that for over 2 years, and all seems to work fine. I just ignore the indicator when it comes up. I saved £1400 claimed by Toyota for the repair, and keep enjoying my lovely car

[rpaterson]

You can probably diagnose what sensor it is with a £10 multimeter. Unplug the sensors and check for continuity and/or resistance. They won't all read the same as there are two 'banks'(??), but you should notice that one is way off compared to the rest - that's your dodgy one.

ps - same trick can be used for ABS sensors...

[cfc1]

i had had exactly same thing with my RAV4, but my mechanic told me that it's not necessary to replace sensors at all. The indicator 'engine management' lights up when I drive on a motorway due to smaller petrol consumption. If I don't drive on a motorway, the light dissapears. Apparently, faulty sensor saves petrol and does not harm the engine at all. I have been driving like that for over 2 years, and all seems to work fine. I just ignore the indicator when it comes up. I saved £1400 claimed by Toyota for the repair, and keep enjoying my lovely car

It's not a good Idea to ignore the EML/CEL at all, OK you might know you have a sensor problem which has caused the light to come on, but what if the car develops another problem that will also cause the light to come on?.. you will think it's your normal sensor problem when in actual fact it could well be a problem that could damage your engine if you continue to drive with it. ALWAYS get it checked no matter what you might think the problem is.

[webmills]

Continuation to my tail of woe....

Drove home from the garage yesterday, four miles, all fine. Wife drives one mile in car today and it starts cutting out with no acceleration. Starts fine then cuts out.

We waited five hours for the AA to arrive, then some other company turns up for them and simply transports the car back home, no fault diagnosis whatsoever, didn't even try to turn on the engine.

My guess is that in their enthousiasm to remove the original sensor, possibly by banging it, the main dealer have dislodged something into the catalytic converter ... what joy.

So now instead of a car with a warning light on that was working just fine, we now have a non-working car after a trip to the main dealer!!

Anyone know where I can get a cheap catalytic converter?

[Davrav]

Can't help with the CAT but whatever you do, reclaim the old CAT and take it to a scrap metal dealer yourself and get the cash. Worth phoning around for a scrap price too as cash paid does vary - could be up to £50 depending on type and size. It will help offset cost of new one if you do need to replace.

Sorry to hear your tale - sounds like you have been very badly treated.

Just thought:

If you go for an 'aftermarket' system to fit yourself, just be aware that, though these are usually welded up on jigs, they tend not to be allowed to cool properly and can distort by quite a margin if they have attached pipes. This can make them difficult to align/splice with the vehicle system.

[pmb]

Continuation to my tail of woe....

Drove home from the garage yesterday, four miles, all fine. Wife drives one mile in car today and it starts cutting out with no acceleration. Starts fine then cuts out.

We waited five hours for the AA to arrive, then some other company turns up for them and simply transports the car back home, no fault diagnosis whatsoever, didn't even try to turn on the engine.

My guess is that in their enthousiasm to remove the original sensor, possibly by banging it, the main dealer have dislodged something into the catalytic converter ... what joy.

So now instead of a car with a warning light on that was working just fine, we now have a non-working car after a trip to the main dealer!!

Anyone know where I can get a cheap catalytic converter?

www.carparts-direct.co.uk have one listed for 170 + vat. Mine has a rattle which apparently is a sign of it being one the way out. Plenty of posts on here about oxygen sensors including some of mine.

[webmills]

Thanks again everyone. I really appreciate your help.

[john21245]

i have that u480 code reader and located in crawley west sussex. your more then welcome to use it. and if you have the code there are web sites who give you the correct info witch bank etc.

i had some thing similar with those £$%^. i had the code for them but they still wanted £96 for diagnostics! and guess what my info was correct.

think of leaving those greedy mr t £$%^ and gone do the things my self. don't care about FSH.

[john21245]

i have that u480 code reader and located in crawley west sussex. your more then welcome to use it. and if you have the code there are web sites who give you the correct info witch bank etc.

i had some thing similar with those £$%^. i had the code for them but they still wanted £96 for diagnostics! and guess what my info was correct.

think of leaving those greedy mr t £$%^ and gone do the things my self. don't care about FSH.

If you document and record your servicing or repairs and, if possible,back them up with receipts for parts used then that is a service history. Individuals can be no more or less trustworthy than some garages.

[luke4x4tech]

You can probably diagnose what sensor it is with a £10 multimeter. Unplug the sensors and check for continuity and/or resistance. They won't all read the same as there are two 'banks'(??), but you should notice that one is way off compared to the rest - that's your dodgy one.

ps - same trick can be used for ABS sensors...

HI just to say don't try and use a multi meter on sensors as when you do a resistance check it puts a small voltage down the wire and if you are using a cheap one that can be as high as 9v thus damaging said sensor.

I can only assume you are getting confused with an oscilloscope that is the correct tool.

When an oxygen sensor is working it measures the amount of oxygen in a given flow of air you can't test them properly with out the engine running.

Bank 1 sensor 1 is the probe in the pipe from cyl 1-3 and bank 2 sensor 1 is cyl 2-4 pre cat and then you get sensor 2 they are post cat hope this helps

[rpaterson]

I only use digital multimeters as I'm aware of the problem of using analogue equipment. Never used a 'scope, always managed fine with my trusty multimeter. If I was to use it more often I would prob upgrade to a 'proper' automotive one.

[Uncle Bob]

This breakers may have the exhaust parts you need.....

http://www.equicar.co.uk/breakers/breaking...submit=Go+-+%3E

This problem you have with your Cat ,seems to have a standardize formate about it ( its come up on this site a few times with RAV4's and other makes of Toyota ), dealers seem to try so much harder to save the Cat when a sensor needs replacing under warranty, then suddenly once the warranty has expired, it then needs a new cat and 4 sensors if you could get an independent garage to free off all 4 sensors with a bit of heat for an hours labour ,then back to the Toyota dealer to find out which sensor is at fault.